Jack Posted September 25, 2005 Share Posted September 25, 2005 Have been trying to remove my pulley as the woodruff keys is worn and there is slack in the pulley and is 'knocking'. The pulley would not slide off the crankend at all, no matter how much you pushed and pulled. In the end part of the pulley broke so I decided that I would have to cut it off. The problem I have is that the pulley was sitting behind, I repeat, behind the flange How the hell I am going to replace the pulley. I have left the pictures in 'large' format so you can see the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddball Posted September 25, 2005 Share Posted September 25, 2005 Is there a bolt up the inside of the dog for the starting handle by any chance :?: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karoshi Posted September 25, 2005 Share Posted September 25, 2005 Is there a bolt up the inside of the dog for the starting handle by any chance :?: No, the combined crank pulley and vibration damper is not retained on the crank front end. It is a parallel taper boss with a straight keyway, and a straight push fit, there is no retaining bolt inside the dog. The pulley MUST be pulled evenly with two bolts or by the use of a puller; applying uneven pressure will cause the pulley to lock. If your keyway is already damaged this will be even more important. It MUST be A STRAIGHT PULL. Karoshi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 25, 2005 Author Share Posted September 25, 2005 Colin do the pictures of the crank look normal? I can't get me head around this! :twisted: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted September 25, 2005 Share Posted September 25, 2005 Jack, You mentioned that there was originally slack in the pulley on the key. Did you actaully feel that? If so, then I reckon what has happened is that the key has worn in to one side of the key way in the pulley and you are pulling aginst the key. Your next move would be to drive it back and hope that it comes loose again and see if it will line up, key to keyway. Maybe not easy to understand, but I have seen this many times. what sort of puller were you using? A hydraulic one should be best as more load can be applied. I think the knock would more likely be a timing gear loose on a keyway, so once the pulley is removed, check to see any evidence in the pulley and crank and if not sure, remove timing cover for further inspection. Kewelde Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 25, 2005 Author Share Posted September 25, 2005 Hi Kewelde There was about an inch of play in the pulley but the only way that the pulley was attach was by rivits, that went from the pulley to the facing plate. Is the bit that is left have the keyway in it? As I can not see one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted September 25, 2005 Share Posted September 25, 2005 Hi Kewelde There was about an inch of play in the pulley but the only way that the pulley was attach was by rivits, that went from the pulley to the facing plate. Is the bit that is left have the keyway in it? As I can not see one? Jack, It is a few years since I had a pulley of a Jimmy engine, but the pulleys serve as harmonic balancers, that is why there is rubber in them. You are left with the hub on the crankshaft and you will need a good puller, dont forget the centre of the puller has to go in through the starting handle dog to bear against the crank. I am now doubtful whether the key is the problem, my guess now is that you felt movement in the rubber bonding of the pulley, unless you actually saw the starting dog part, move as well. Kewelde Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 25, 2005 Author Share Posted September 25, 2005 Ok, so that collar has now got to be 'pulled'? I don't understand why rivets are in the mix, you have the facing plate, then rubber then the collar then rubber then the pulley all held together by very lose rivets.............does that make sense :? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karoshi Posted September 26, 2005 Share Posted September 26, 2005 Jack as said. 1/. The pulley is a combination device of pulley and harmonic damper. The damper is insulated from the pulley by way of rubber mounts, the mounts are retained by thro' bolts ( these ((you said rivits)) have nuts on the back! ) If this rubber isolation pad fails you will appear to have play in the pulley. 2/. To renew the broken pulley you must now pull the starting handle dog to renew the pulley, which as you say fits behind the dog. 3/. If the timing cover needs to be removed you will have to drop the sump pan to access the two bolts which secures the bottom of the timing cover. These fit from the inside, all the rest fit from the outside. 4/. The picture you show is of the crankshaft with the starter dog still in place. This dog is a straight pull off the crankshaft. The two threaded holes in that dog flange can be used to push the dog off, be careful to protect the timing case cover from denting owing to these removal screws pressing on it. 5/. A straight pull is ESSENTIAL or the dog will bind. 6/. Either way from here on you must remove that dog to repair this situation. 7/. IF the keyway is nadgered a LOT of effort may be required to pull the dog, and a hydraulic puller would be best. 8/. I'm guessing, but if the dog is still tight on the crank your problem was worn rubbers in the harmonic damper, giving the appearance of a floppy keyway. If it was as loose as you claim the damper should now just fall off! 9/. IF you use heat to encourage the dog off, you WILL damage the timing cover oil seal. But you will be replacing this anyway...wont you! Hope this helps Karoshi, who can't even put a tent up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 26, 2005 Author Share Posted September 26, 2005 Jack as said. 1/. The pulley is a combination device of pulley and harmonic damper RIGHT GOT THAT The damper is insulated from the pulley by way of rubber mounts, the mounts are retained by thro' bolts ( these ((you said rivits)) have nuts on the back! ) If this rubber isolation pad fails you will appear to have play in the pulley. THAT WAS ALL IN PLACE BUT THR THROU' BOLTS WERE RIVITS, THIS IS WHERE I WAS GETTING CONFUSED AND I COULDN'T SEE HOW THE PULLEY SYSTEM WAS SET UP AS THERE WERE NO BOLTS! THE RIVITS WERE AS SLACK AS SLACK AS YOU WOULD IMAGINE AS THEY WERE DOING NOTHING TO HOLD THE ASSEMBLY TOGETHER. 2/. To renew the broken pulley you must now pull the starting handle dog to renew the pulley, which as you say fits behind the dog. OK THE BIT WITH THE HOLES IN :shock: 3/. If the timing cover needs to be removed you will have to drop the sump pan to access the two bolts which secures the bottom of the timing cover. These fit from the inside, all the rest fit from the outside. OK STARTING TO HATE GMC'S NOW 4/. The picture you show is of the crankshaft with the starter dog still in place. This dog is a straight pull off the crankshaft. The two threaded holes in that dog flange can be used to push the dog off, be careful to protect the timing case cover from denting owing to these removal screws pressing on it.OK GOT THAT, WILL TRY TONIGHT 5/. A straight pull is ESSENTIAL or the dog will bind.OK 6/. Either way from here on you must remove that dog to repair this situation.OK 7/. IF the keyway is nadgered a LOT of effort may be required to pull the dog, and a hydraulic puller would be best. THAT SOUNDS EXPENSIVE :oops: 8/. I'm guessing, but if the dog is still tight on the crank your problem was worn rubbers in the harmonic damper, giving the appearance of a floppy keyway. If it was as loose as you claim the damper should now just fall off! NO THEY WERE FINE THE PROBLEM WAS THE RIVITS 9/. IF you use heat to encourage the dog off, you WILL damage the timing cover oil seal. But you will be replacing this anyway...wont you! BY THE SOUNDS OF IT, YES :shock: Hope this helps Karoshi, who can't even put a tent up. Cheers Colin that is a great help! Jack. PS I will PM you instructions of how to put up a tent.......fair skills swap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karoshi Posted September 26, 2005 Share Posted September 26, 2005 You didn't answer no 9. Karoshi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddball Posted September 26, 2005 Share Posted September 26, 2005 You didn't answer no 9. Karoshi. Looks like the timing cover will have to come off anyway, to straighten out the kink that has appeared in it :shock: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 26, 2005 Author Share Posted September 26, 2005 You didn't answer no 9. Karoshi. Now done :oops: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karoshi Posted September 26, 2005 Share Posted September 26, 2005 Thats better. Karoshi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 26, 2005 Author Share Posted September 26, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 26, 2005 Author Share Posted September 26, 2005 guys.............I am not near hitting the panic button but I am not far off :shock: Here the skinny; There is no keyway at all! I can not see how this collar is fitting to the crank! Could there be a possibility that this collar is machined out of the crank? Or could it be threaded on? .............I am totally lost here and am running out of time :cry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karoshi Posted September 26, 2005 Share Posted September 26, 2005 Jack: *Yes there is, it’s just that you can't see it. *It’s a parallel taper. *No *No Just use the bolts and pull the so**ing thing off. Karoshi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 26, 2005 Author Share Posted September 26, 2005 1 x GMC 353 for sale..............see Jack! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M8Greyhound Posted September 26, 2005 Share Posted September 26, 2005 YIKES thats a bit severe mate...that pulley definatley pulls off . Says Lloyd stating the bleedin obvious Regards Lloyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddball Posted September 28, 2005 Share Posted September 28, 2005 So Jack, have you got that pulley off yet or what :?: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted September 28, 2005 Author Share Posted September 28, 2005 :oops: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddball Posted September 28, 2005 Share Posted September 28, 2005 :shock: :shock: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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