Pete Ashby

I'd suggest that one is at the upper end and at a premium due to its early build date. I would think you may be in with a shout around the top end of your budget.

good luck

Pete

One in the UK on Milweb now http://www.milweb.net/webvert/77242

Pete

The August 1942 parts list includes both the old slotted rocker cover listed as ''1st jobs'' and a filtered inlet for the new sealed cover listed as ''after jobs'' there has been a lot of discussion about the term ''after jobs'' and Iv'e not seen a full explanation of the term the nearest I think any one has come to explaining it is a modified or substituted part.

So by August 1942 PCV systems were being supplied from the factory and retro fitted as required to earlier manufactured units, the guys on MLU will probably be able to give chapter and verse on this subject.

Pete

it's a post factory replacement unit as your truck came off the line some time between July 1940 and December 1940 without a frame number it's not possible to be more accurate. PCV on Canadian 216 units does not appear until some time after mid 1942 (I'll have a look and see if I can give you a better date on that). If you can find the stamped engine number it may help to decide the year of the block at least.

Pete

It looks like you have a later pattern engine there Howard I can see PVC kit on the inlet manifold and an oil bath inlet filter on the rocker cover.

The early engines contemporary with the truck would just have a down draft tube from the crank case and two slits in the rocker cover as inlets. Interestingly there was a field instruction to hammer the slits shut as it was found that in dusty conditions ie in the desert engines were suffering from excessive top end ware as a result of grit ingress. I have actually come across several early rocker covers where this mod has been carried out.

Pete

Was the air compressor common on CMPs?

Compressors were standard equipment on 30cwt and 3ton chassis

Pete

Given the vehicles history, I still can't believe there's not some proper blue prints out there somewhere!

I suggest you ask that question on the G503 forum there are guys there who will give you chapter and verse on what is and what is not available from the archives.

The short answer is that Willys moved onto to post war production then to all intense and purpose ceased to exist via a number of buy outs/intellectual property transfers. I can tell you from experience that when this happens vast amounts of hard copy archive material just get dumped. It's worth remembering that in the intermediate post war period the MB and GPW had by no means reached 'iconinc' status and as such any material that has survived it is purely by luck as at the time the print chest containing that information would be viewed as just so much waste paper...sad but true.... been there done it in another life. :-(

Pete

From memory I think Alex the water pumps have different part numbers as well but I'll have to check.

Pete

In the August 1942 parts list the pump to take the large pulley is a different part number and marked for use with 5 1/16" pulley and six blade fan. The small pulley is listed as 4 2/64" fan shrouds are listed for all vehicles 'As required'.

Trawling some of the past information held on MLU forum posted by Mark Tonner of Ontario and the late David Haywood it appears that only 20 trucks of various types unspecified were saved and 220 were totally destroyed after the 1940 November 30/1 December bombing raid on the GM reassembly plant at Southampton. This information came from the 2nd detachment RCOC war diaries so should be fairly accurate I would suggest. I think it's a fair guess you are right Richard that Howard's truck potentially is a survivor of that attack and was part of batch of C60S 11 cabs contracted to the British under Supply Mech 2003.

I have also found a reference to a series of Emails that David Haywood and I exchanged some years ago where David states that 12 cab field conversion kits were supplied ready for fitting by 1 st week of February 1941.

Pete

Interesting. I was just looking at this last week, when looking for the water pump parts number and indeed noticed the different fans. My C8 also has a 4blade fan.

From memory I think Alex the water pumps have different part numbers as well but I'll have to check.

Pete

I have a 6 blade fan on my CGT cab 12

Does your radiator have a fan shroud fitted Niels?

I have a theory as yet unproved that all Chevrolet 12 cab FAT's and LAA's were fitted with 6 blade fans and shrouds first, the reasoning is this: these trucks would be expected to operate at low road speed but high engine rpm while towing or winching as result engine cooling would depend almost entirely on the fan efficiency hence 6 blade fan and shroud.

Pete

Pete, and Howard,

To have been issued with a new census number this was obviously a serious rebuild. Looking at the date of the rebuild on the plate, January 1941, it makes me wonder if this was one of the Chevrolet lorries caught in the bombing of the GM facility in Southampton ....... in December 1940. Either that or it suffered an accident, I think the bombing is possibly answer.

 

regards, Richard

I think you may well have something there Richard, somewhere I've got the details of the losses I'll see what I can turn

Pete

Hello Richard, heres a pic of the rebuild army plaque.

Now that raises the question as to why a truck that was probably less than 9 months old should require a class 1 rebuild:confused:

Thinking about it a little more I wonder if this was when the 12 cab conversion kit was fitted, I can't remember when these kits were issued it was some time in 1941 but they were designed so that the work could be done at the local unit level it really would not require a class 1 overhaul............intriguing.

Pete

Here's a photo of the 6 blade fan I mentioned in a previous post these were fitted I believe as a direct result of engine over heating issues with 11 cab trucks in the western desert. The 1942 parts list quotes both 4 and 6 blade fans interestingly with different sized pulleys and belts with different part numbers.

Pete

Hi Howard,

That number is not the original one, it comes from a batch (7 figure numbers all starting 17.....) put aside for rebuilt vehicles.

do you think the truck would be renumbered in 1946 at the same time the engine was overhauled Richard ? any idea where AAW B256 was located ?

Pete

Hello Pete I would have the tank with the cast top, this would be good to use to make a new tank or patch it up, could you send by a courier just let me know the cost and are do a bank transfer. are pm my details later. perhaps you can pm your info. Well my helper managed to get more done on the truck, most of the front is now unbolted and off took a bit of time, going to be fun getting it back together without scratching the paint work, some bolts came undone fine other went under the cutter. The water pump will need rebuilding.I managed to take some pics of the stencils in the cab. heres a few more pics of work carried out today. Howard

Ok Howard I'll dig the tank out of the barn let me have your e-mail by PM and I can send you a couple of pictures so you can see the condition.

The fan on your engine is the very early type pre what are known as North African Mods, I'll post a picture on here in the morning of the modified fan type. This for me is what makes 11 and 12 cab CMP's interesting they were rushed through the development phase to help fill the gap in transport created by the losses incurred by the BEF in France. As a result you can see almost month on month developments and modifications in the design as a result of in service feed back.

Pete

Thanks for those pictures, now I finally know what the holes in mine are for. Its interesting to see that it has a switch for the axle light and one for service/black out. Is the black out a headlight?

On both my CGT's there is a dip Switch mounted on the side of the chassis which cut the rear lights and turns on the axel light, how is this to interact with the axle light switch.

Niels here is the wiring diagram for all 12 cab Chevrolet's it should help to make things clear

Pete

Had a rummage among the CMP tanks I have and have found two early short neck tanks the bad news is neither are particularly wonderful one still has the cast top plate and reserve tap and the other tank has the top plate removed, I thought I had a top plate somewhere but I can't find it at the moment. If your'e been on Dirks site you will have seen he has top plates as NoS.

I would be very interested in the service number off the door if you can post a photo it may help to provide contract data.

Pete

Here's four photos that I provided for some one else to show what the early production 12 cab dash looks like.

I labeled the photos for clarity but from the factory there is no additional labeling other than the the small screen printed tags on the toggle switches (note the service/blackout plate is missing on the photo). Having said that I have seen one or two 11 and 12 cab trucks that were British issue that had hand written labeling like yours appears to have Howard. The single knob marked 'hood' operates the baffle in the air vent (one each side of the cab) on late 11 and all 12 cabs these knobs came from the pre war civilian car/truck parts

Pete

Such a lovely body! Pete, there was another unrestored one in Norway. If I remember correctly the Belgian as well as the Norwegian one were complete, but I have no idea where they went. There was a third in Holland, but the rear boady was cut down. But.....this truck did retain it's curved rear wheel arches. It was for sale for a while, but I think it never sold and should still be there.

 

 

Agreed! The 3C1 bodies recently came up on MLU: http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/showthread.php?t=23133&page=2

 

That's another rare truck, Pete!

 

Alex

I've not heard of Eric Delacom for years, I tried to buy the C60 off him at one time but we couldn't agree a price unfortunately so I have no idea as to whereabouts of the Belgium one.

Pete

The body parts list has 2 of the large tool boxes listed for a 3C1 body part No90055 the pad locks for them are listed Yale 41 part No938.

You do have a rare Vehicle there Howard particularly with the 3C1 body but a C60S with field mod 12 cab kit makes the whole thing very special indeed........ well it does for CMP junkies like Hanno Alex and me

Pete,

Heres the link for Dirk Leekwater http://www.lwdparts.com/, I'd also recommend the maple leaf up forum that's were most of the worlds CMP guys hang out.

Pete

here we go Howard photos of my old 12 cab C15A showing NoS rubber lights in correct positions note I have added and extra light each side at the rear and used them for indicators.

Front view

Rear view

Pete

On 11 and 12 cab Chevrolets the frame number was stamped not on the frame but on a zinc plate attached to the engine covers inside the cab. The rear lights should be 'rubber lights' the name is a give away they are rubber construction with red lenses the front side lights are the same units but with clear lenses mounted on the wings next to the head lights I'll see if I can find some pictures of my old 12 cab C15A which should make it clear. The side lights were available as NoS from Dirk Legwater I'll find a link for him.

Pete

I may have an early tank I'll have a look in the morning for you. I did have a pair of NoS drum head lights in the cosmaline but I'm afraid my son beat you to them for his 12 cab C15A bowser. Glad the scans are of interest if you can find the frame number I may be able to find the contract number for you.

Pete

Couple of scans from the October 1941 DND special pattern bodies part list that may be of interest

Pete