Pete Ashby

Looks like everyone who had a view on this topic has contributed. So as it’s raining here in the Wild West today I have a few spare minutes to add my personal thoughts to Robert’s original question, it also delays the evil moment when I have to go and box in some pipes in the utility. Firstly, I have never heard of anyone converting their MV to electric propulsion, if you have or you are that person, it would be interesting to hear from you. I suspect there currently would be engineering difficulties for anything over 15cwt size. As to my own view in short, I would be very much opposed to the concept for reasons I’ll set out below. Looking at the issue in terms of the facts, the argument based on ecological grounds, does not stand up to integration when considered in terms of mass balance. The volume of CO2 that Classic, Vintage and Veteran vehicles add to the world’s total mass balance is tiny by virtue of the fact of the limited numbers of vehicles compared to other forms of transport, industry producers and natural events. An important factor is the mileage travelled, ie, the time the machine is actually emitting CO2 is minuscule compared to other forms of mass transport. I would guess that most MV owners do less than 2000 miles a year and many will do considerably less. Using a numbers based approach it may be shown therefore that we are not part of the problem. However the ethical argument would suggest that as other forms of transport move to net zero (an interesting concept that I find full of hidden caveats and glaring omissions) then the percentage contribution from our vehicles becomes increasingly significant. But in terms of mass balance our vehicles will still only add a tiny amount. We have all been subjected over last 18 months to a barrage of statistical data that has required careful interrogation to determine the true meaning and context of the numbers presented, the key word here is context. Moving now to the conceptual and philosophical argument surrounding electrification of our vehicles I need to put my cards squarely on the table. I first started driving at the age of 4 in a field sitting on my Fathers lap in his split screen Morris Minor woody estate. From there I graduated to motor bikes and scrap cars driven around a field at the back of the village garage. Then my first Ford GPW at the age of 16 and as soon as I got my licence for the road at 17 a progression of cars, MV’s and a passing interest in Vintage Hot Rods and steam engines and indeed all things related to the internal combustion engine, I will be 64 this year. All this adds up to the fact that I could be regarded as the classic ‘petrol head’ and something that I refuse to be made to feel ashamed off. Collecting and restoring WW2 Military Vehicles has always been for me about recreating a time machine. That within the confines of the road traffic act is as near to the original vehicle as possible in terms of it’s appearance, noise, smell and sensation when moving. It’s the combination of all those things that bring the vehicle to life and in some small way provide a link to both the period and men who operated them. To electrify a WW2 MV would be a travesty of all things that the vehicle stood for and represented to me. The nearest comparison that I can come up with is that of installing an internal combustion engine inside a steam locomotive and using the argument that “well at least it still moves” to justify doing so. The whole essence and being of the machine would change out of all recognition and it would become a travesty of it’s former self, as it would be for our vehicles. So what is to become of me an old curmudgeonly petrol head swimming against the rising tide of popular political opinion focused towards the demise of the internal combustion engine and the desire to move to perceived clean electric power?. Wally Dugan mentioned Hydrogen power in his first post in this thread if it comes to the crunch when it becomes commercially and politically un-viable for producers to provide fossil fuels for our vehicles then this would be a reluctant option. I believe that at least it would preserve the essence of the original propulsion system with the engine and ancillary drive train intact. Would I embrace it with open arms?…….. No I would not…… but it may be the lesser of evils in terms of options and may prevent me from having to drive a Hoover. Pete

a character had a history of maintaining 1930s farm equipment, tractors, civilian vehicles etc, would any of those skills be transferable to working on tank engines? Helpful to an extent but the vast majority of farm equipment and traction in the 1930's was still horse powered so the answer would be not without significant trade training particularly for German armored vehicles. Would a person with no prior experience of tanks be able to drive one, or fire a shell? Not really these are skilled trades in any Army and require considerable training. Pete

I remember that WC42 in Mains very well it stood with several Dodge Ambulances in front of which were several Weapons Carriers one of which is still on the regular show circuit today. When I first saw the panel van around 1976 it was reasonably complete the rear had a lot of Dodge spares in it at that time. As time went by weather and various yard sort outs took it tole until it finally collapsed into the nettles. Pete

Just a word to the wise, be wary of pouring cold water in any quantity over hot castings like your manifolds for example. The sudden thermal shock may well cause distortion or even cracking of the cast. Much better to wet a rag and wrap it round the pump, or fuel lines, or carb then remember to remove it before trying to restart the engine as you don't want the rag getting picked up by fan. Pete

To be serious for a moment Robert raises an interesting point, one despite my flippant response that is worthy of discussion. It calls into focus issues that form fundamental reasons for what I have spent my life doing, I hope people will engage with this discussion I'll wait to see what others have to say first before I add my two penny worth I have some strongly held views on the matter. LarryH57 has a point the tide is against us I fear with the current political desire of Western Governments to be seen to be taking action. Pete

Your right with regard to the restart providing it is vaporization you are suffering from then when everything cools down the problem goes away. Fuel pumps will not pump vapour either in the feed line or the pump chamber so that's problem 1. Problem 2 occurs with heat soak from the exhaust system via the inlet manifold and then into the carburetor this problem usually occurs after the engine has been shut down then restart attempted within a short time period. Fuel in the float bowl will expand and possibly boil. The net result here is this pushes raw fuel through the various power circuits then dribble into the inlet manifold where it forms varpour which the ignition system cannot ignite due to the wrong oxygen to fuel ratio ( 14.7 to 1 as a rule of thumb). This is why after a lot of cranking with the throttle held fully open providing your battery is up to it, the engine will if your lucky, couch into sluggish reluctant life accompanied by clouds of black smoke made up of virtually raw fuel issuing out of the tail pipe. Couple this with the vaporization in the fuel pump and or feed lines and it's not looking good for that rapid get away from the pub car park in front of the gathered admiring crowd of onlookers. Your last point about how did these trucks operate in desert conditions is an interesting one and one that I have asked myself too. It falls under the same set of discussions to my mind that center around the 6 volt vs 12 volt discussions that rumble around on any WW2 truck forum, camp fire or beer tent you choose to visit. My take on this is if it didn't work then in nearly six years of war time operation carried out by the two largest automotive nations in the world it would have been changed pretty dam quickly. This can be seen in a number of different spheres of military automotive design during the war. All very interesting but it hasn't addressed your question. For what it's worth my thoughts on your direct question are as follows: 1 Equipment was all factory new and by this I mean everything that goes to make up the vehicle. 2 Petrol was of a different octane rating without all the go faster cheaper additives that come as standard from the pump now . 3 There were a number of actions taken by troops in the field to alleviate some of the issues, from the simple act of wrapping a rag around the fuel pump then having a bod sit on the wing to keep dripping water on it (not really practical on a jaunt to Tesco's these days) to taking the engine covers off and throwing them away ( not very good for the resale value of your vehicle), this is before we get onto fabricating overflow tanks out of 2 gallon cans ect. Pete

Robert with the deepest of respect take a deep breath and go and sit in the shade old friend Best regards Pete

Give these people a try https://www.castironwelding.co.uk/ Pete

After the diversion of fitting some of the smaller tasty items it was back to the heavy duty stuff once again. The left front wheel, hub and back plate were removed, cleaned, painted and put aside to harden off. While the wheel was off it gave clear access to the frame and road spring under the cab, which was also cleaned primed and repainted. The tyre was removed from the rim and then the rim cleaned (see previous posts), painted, and put aside for the paint to cure. A delve into the back recesses of the storage shelves turned up the front brake shoes and hangers that had been cleaned painted and stored away probably over twenty years ago. Another poke about found the retracting springs, bottom adjuster and the top bi-sector unit these needed to be disassembled cleaned and reassembled in the same manner as with the rear units described in a previous post about the back axels. With the back plate painted it was refitted and the brake gear added. The hub was next, wheel bearings were checked and repacked with fresh grease and then adjusted for end float. The left hand thread wheel nuts were fished out of the molasses bath after several months of soaking washed off then cleaned up, etch primed then top coated Now it was the turn of the brake drum, this is a roughcast affair with the working surfaces machined smooth. The drum is super quality steel so although it looks in poor condition in the first photo a bit of time with the wire wheel on the grinder brought up the working surfaces to bright steel and then it was my usual painting sequence when dry it was fitted and the shoe contact adjusted. At the start Work in progress Etch primed Gloss black undercoat Top coat and fitted While I was waiting for the paint to harden off I trial fitted the left hand wing those who have followed this epic story of snail pace restoration will recall my efforts to restore the wings I intend to finish grinding down the welds and get the wing preped finished and bolted on over the next month or so. Time for tea and biscuits I'm thinking. Pete

Over the last month I’ve focused attention on the Leyland and continued the theme of getting stuff out of boxes and drawers and off shelves and onto the truck so this post is all about small stuff getting bolted on. The large and imposing radiator carries the maker’s nameplate at the top and the model type at the bottom both were missing from this truck. However, some years ago now I was lucky enough to have been loaned an original of both plates so that I could make silicon molds and cast resin replicas these were stored away awaiting a call to duty and some twenty years later here they are fitted. While at the front of the cab I decided it was time to fit the side lights. I bought these in an auto jumble back in the mists of time so they were dug out, given the treatment and fitted. A small advance in the scheme of things but the truck begins to look a bit more complete with every item bolted on now. in one of the posts in this blog I described how I went about making a replica Volkes air filter housing. Well it’s time had come so that got bolted on as well. Last but least for this post is the Clayton Dewandre air tank and gauge for the tyre pump, it's yet to be plumbed in to the pto driven pump but at least it’s on the truck and out of a storage drawer. More to follow Pete

That is a very fine looking truck Keith looks like you have the oil pressure issues sorted. Pete

Welcome Vince you'll find this a very friendly site to be part of. The key to getting a good response to a question here or on any forum for that matter is to think about the header you put on the post a lot of us are on multiple forums across the web either as regular contributors or there to learn and ask questions. The result for me at least is I tend to skim read the headers to pick up anything of interest before I open the post it's not being elitist it's purely just a time thing. As to the right place to post it can often be best to first use the search function on any of the forums and if that doesn't turn up anything useful start a new topic in the most appropriate section. Good luck with the project and remember there is never a silly question

Thank you pleased your enjoying the blog. I try to make them a bit chatty and on occasion pass on the odd nugget of information picked up along the road of collecting and restoring MV's for just a little short of 50 years now, I'm not professionally trained but every one learns from their mistakes I was once told (I'm fairly certain they lied as if that was the case I'd be the worlds authority by now). As for getting the truck on the road there's a bit more to do yet but every job is another bite at the Elephant, although I have to say that some of the projects waiting their turn are beginning to look more like Woolly Mammoths ! Pete

Just an observation Keith on your last photo, you may wish to put a rubber grommet on your oil gauge line where it passes through the bulkhead. A combination of vibration and chaffing could end up with no oil pressure and a nasty mess to clear up regards Pete

As Gordon says above treat it as a three speed box with additional crawler gear in first. Many years ago now I did a conversion for a customer on a Carryall where he wanted a higher road speed so he provided a set of power wagon difs with higher ratio than the war time WC ones. It completely changed the characteristics of the truck using first was now a necessity at junctions lights and roundabouts and as you have found 1st to 2nd is a long pull without much road speed to keep the truck moving. However it added about 10 mph to the cursing speed in top but was a night mare on hills as it ran out of puff in top very quickly and then it was foot to the floor in 3rd all the way up hovering over the stick waiting to pull second on occasions something on a stock WC that is only required when climbing a mountain.. The foot note to this is the customer was very happy with the result as he was moving to the Fenlands no hills and long flat roads. Pete

Firstly sorry hear of your Fathers passing but well done you for taking the truck on, so many get sold on by family in double quick time these days. To address your question, the numbers you quote sound just fine for an engine with some miles on it Gordon's advice is worth following perhaps before the winter lay up. Otherwise enjoy the rare truck you now own drive it with the respect that a vehicle of it's age requires and it will last a life time. Pete

Well done chaps keep at it, every unit and nut and bolt cleaned and re fitted to the frame is another positive step towards the completed project. Pete

Thanks Richard, no no problem getting the bearing I use the Vintage Bearing Company they're on the web for bearings and seals reasonable prices and quick delivery. There was no part number on the roller cage or else I could have probably sourced it through 'bearings are us' also on the web. Bearings and seals are universal and almost never made for individual applications the trick is being able to cross reference the part number to a modern produced item. Your right about the hide hammer vs the ball pein if I were doing this on an Al casting then a soft faced hammer would be preferable I've got a plastic one from B&Q that does the job admirably, but there is little danger when dealing with big chunks of cast like this, as ever the trick is in the wrist. regards Pete

Once the paint was hard it was time to stuff all the bit's back inside the case the input and output main carrier bearings were like new so they went back in with the new pilot roller cage, new leather rear output seal and new gaskets all round. I was recently asked where I got my gaskets from, the person asking me had never heard of the answer before which I must say surprised me. So for any one who is wondering I've set out below how I do it. I'm sure a lot of people know how to do this so don't bother with the next couple of photos skim through to the finished job photos at the bottom of the page. But for anyone who hasn't made a gasket here's how I was taught to do it below. I make them the old fashioned way with the exception perhaps of one or two specialist engine gaskets like exhaust and head for example I have made exhaust gaskets before but it's a mega pain in the butt and takes a long time if you can get them buy them would be my advice. First off you need gasket paper ( although back in the day any old corn flake packet would do at a push). Gasket paper comes in various thicknesses in long rolls, ( google it it's not expensive compared to buying preformed gaskets). It's important to have a range of of thicknesses in stock. Here for example in the case of the T 9 the pre- load on the input and out bearing races is determined by the number and thickness of gaskets required. These are the gaskets I made for this job This is how they are made: First up cut a chunk of gasket paper big enough to cover the whole mating surface Take a small ball pein hammer and hold the sheet of gasket paper on the job making sure it covers all of the mating surface Find the first bolt hole by rubbing your thumb around where it should be it helps if your thumbs a bit grubby Once you have the marked the first hole hold everything square on the mating surface and gently tap round the mark made by your thumb using the ball end of the hammer, a few taps and the paper cleanly falls away (remember to pick it out of the bolt holes when the job is complete) This bit is important, put a bolt in the hole if it's a threaded hole put the original bolt back in a couple of turns if it's just a clearance hole find a bolt of similar diameter and drop it through the gasket paper this now is your datum point that will help to hold everything square Choose a bolt hole on the opposite side of the work piece and repeat the above procedure and put another bolt in Do this for all the other holes working from one side to other in turn adding a bolt each time When all the holes have been tapped through rub your thumb round the inside edge of the mating flange and gently tap that out the center portion It looks like this now and I've started to tap out the outer edge of the gasket. Notice the angle of the hammer it needs to be at about 45 degrees to the edge of the flange to cut through cleanly Jobs done one PTO gasket Right now for any one who's gone to make a cup of tea and grab a biscuit while all that was going on here's the finished Warner T 9 it just needs the hand brake drum, operating cams and band fitting. I have a new old stock lining that I'll have to drill and center bore to take the rivet head then I'll rivet the lining onto the band but that's for another day. That's all for for now Pete

The Warner T 9 uses roller cage bearings one for the main shaft pilot bearing and two large ones for the Lay shaft gear cluster so the next step was check these out for condition and ware. Reverse idler is a bush and that checked out fine as well. Here's a couple of photos from the manual showing the T 9 it's a very simple box to work on and is virtualy bullet proof in operation This is how Dodge Brothers recommend you test a cage bearing for ware any torsional movement indicates ware in the carrier frames and needles. Then it was a case of getting the micrometer and vernier out to measure the lay shaft and pilot shafts and the bores on the gears against the factory spec. Everything checked out within a couple of thou with the exception of the main shaft pilot roller cage which showed considerable ware. This seemed very odd when the rest of the box was virtually factory new. I suspect it has something to do with the PTO operation running the gearbox in neutral for considerable periods of time while filling the the tank. A new bearing was sourced and everything was put into clean polythene bags while the case was prepared for painting After a go with the wire brush on the grinder and and a wash down with 2k universal thinner Coat of etch primer applied Two coats of G3 top coat shift tower and top plate in etch primer after checking for bent shift forks and operation in all positions In two coats of G3 so that was that, everything was put aside for the paint to harden off fully before the rebuild started. more to follow Pete

With all the external bits of kit removed it was time for the moment of truth as the shift tower and top cover was removed enabling the first proper inspection of the gear sets to be made. Result!! no chipped or damaged teeth and all the case hardening was in perfect unmarked condition, due to a large extent to low mileage and the very gloopy gearbox oil. This could have been original military spec oil, have you ever noticed how original transmission oil it has a very distinctive smell?, it brings back happy memories from the scrap yards of my youth searching out elusive MV parts..................... Any way moving on. Here the input shaft has been removed Now the lay shaft has been driven out to drop the lay shaft gear cluster into the bottom of the case so that the out put shaft and gear sets can be taken out of top of the box. With a bit of a fiddle the lay shaft gears can be lifted up out of the box. The Warner T 9 box has no thrust washers on the lay shaft and relies on the hardened face of the lay shaft gear front and back running on a machined faces in the box casting. Reverse idler and shift fork can be seen at the lower front of the case. more to follow Pete

Time for a update on progress from the Wild West. Continuing the previous theme of focusing effort on the mechanical bits I dragged the gearbox out of storage. Then set about cleaning and de-greasing the outside before starting to take anything apart and risk getting the internals contaminated with the tens of years of accumulated muck and grit. CMP Canadian Dodge series trucks all shared the same basic 4 speed Warner T-9 gear box the D15 tanker has a PTO output for driving the power pump similar to the D60 tipper version. So this was the starting point You can see the power pump PTO on the right hand side of the gearbox in the photo below with the engagement lever on the front of the case Here the worst of the gunge has been cleaned off the case, Then the hand brake band,drum and output flange have been removed along with the complete PTO unit. More to follow Pete

Some excellent engineering again Richard, congratulations to you. Pete PS no longer a GRP virgin, but I did get stuck to everything including the bench !! I'll send you an up date on progress in due course.

Wild guess here, 5th wheel tractor unit ? Any evidence of extra holes in the frame for the fittings ? Pete

Not easy Owen unless some one can actually inspect the truck there are a number of features that would indicate it's history and authenticity. Looking at the photos on your web site it could be a 44 MB well restored with reproduction dash plates and there's nothing wrong with that, or it may be a made under licence French Hotchkiss M201 produced up until 1966 and there's nothing wrong with that either as long as it's advertised as such. However It may be a legitimate combination of MB and M201 parts rebuilt by the French army post war with a modern reproduction body and fittings added during restoration. Again nothing wrong with this there are plenty about like it. The key as with any purchase of an antique is that the buyer needs to be aware of the subject material and the advertising needs to honest and clear, in other words if there is doubt that can't be reasonably settled then it should be noted in the catalogue that there are uncertainties regarding province. I would suggest you remove the 1944 Willys references in your advertising and stick with the Hotchkiss/Willys theme. The date of manufacture on the DVLC docs can in certain cases be a bit of a false lead as it was not uncommon with unusual vehicles for this to be the date of first UK registration however in this case I have suspicions that it may be correct. Pete