LarryH57

One last point - is your Commer a 15cwt or 30 cwt?

As far as it went, Brown Dark (MT) No.1A, (Chocolate Brown) was only officially sanctioned by the RAF for around 9 months; from 31st December 1942 and was replaced by orders in AMO A.891/43 on 9th September 1943, with ‘Paint, P.F.U., Black Matt, quick drying’. A.891/43 stayed in force until 1944 when a further AMO, A.519/44 was issued on 8th June 1944; which changed the basic colour to ‘PFU Olive Drab’ with Black Matt as the camouflage colour. British Olive Drab had been in use by the British & Commonwealth Armies for about a month or more before D-Day, first with Micky Mouse black camo them none as the war contined. By 8th June 1944, AMO 519/44 it was obviously a bit late to change RAF vehicles either in France, or prepared to travel by ship to Normandy, plus repainting was not required until absolutely necessary and the attritian rate was less for the RAF vehicles, so thats why the Micky Mouse scheme may be seen on RAF vehicles right up to arriving in Denmark in May 1945. So go with Brown Special No.2 ( and with ‘Paint, P.F.U., Black Matt, quick drying’?) - it will make a nice change! Brown Special No. 2 was the RAF name for SCC.2

And as a polite suggestion, don't paint your Q2 in RAF Blue Grey if it was made in 1944. I'm also guessing that your Q2 went to NW Europe as part of 2TAF, on or after D-Day if it ended up there until recently, unless it was one of many surplus vehicles given away as aid post WW2 Although British Olive Drab was ordered by the RAF (to match the Army) prior to D-Day, many RAF vehicles with less 'front line duty', we still in Brown Special No.2 with either Brown Dark (MT) No.1A, as the camouflage, or P.F.U. Matt Black, which we have come to know as 'Micky Mouse Ear' Camouflage. I guess you know there were variations of Micky Mouse Ear, painted with less rounded ear camo than ‘Mickey Mouse Ears' and these varied in style from 'foliage' or 'devils horns' to 'crows feet'. Incidentally, the RAF Roundal was very prominent on all sides of the larger 2TAF vehicles like the Austin K6 types, but anything smaller, didn't seem so covered, but a roundal on the bonnet and and tilt sides, which appears to be of a set size, still looks quite strange on a 15cwt vehicle - thats why I have yet to see any roundals on tilts of preserved RAF vehicles at MV shows! Some examples below from a time when the NWE front line had moved towards Germany. Note the old camo style still in use. The Ford WOT 15cwt is Denmark in 1945.

When I saw this photo I immediately thought it wasn't an RAF Jeep, as a feature of many RAF Jeeps in 2TAF in NW Europe was they were devoid of pioneer tools, as if an NCO in charge, said that those tools will surely be nicked by the locals and so I will look after them, or other logic reason like "we never get in situations where we need to get our hands dirty! And of course there is no RAF Type 1900 number.

From the look of it , your Commer does look to be one of these, in the photo of the factory line up, (below) rather than the van type? However, I think those in the line up are Q15 models but according to Bart Vanderveen the Commer Q2, was sometimes produced with a closed cab like yours (rather than an intergral cab) and these were made for GS and specialist bodies like the aircraft engine pre-heater. Factory Line up of Commer Q15 vehicles? The Commer with Type E radio body, may be trial fitting of a body that looks similar to those on Bedford MW, with wheel arches bigger than necessary, presuably to cater to all sorts of vehicles and wheelbases. Note the cab roof with its look out / MG position.

I know that many Dodge Weapons Carriers (with and without winch) were issued to the British & Commonwealth Forces in the Far East and in SW Pacific area and Australia , as my Dad used one in Borneo in 1945, (and the recreation of his Dodge would probably be disbelieved at MV shows today, as it would be painted in US Olive Drab and with Allied star as delivered, with Australian Army additions of the Australian 7th Division, and driven by dad in RAF Uniform (a mix of Jungle Greens and Australian version, with Australian Brown boots, and with a few trusted Japanese POWS in the back!) But were Dodge Weapons Carriers ever used by the British Army or Canadian Army in NW Europe? I think the Canadians made their own version of the Dodge WC at their Chrysler factory as the D3 but I guess that was too late to see action in NW Europe?

Rootes, Regarding your Commer 15cwt, what type of body do your think it had or has remains of?

Many WW2 military vehicles in preservation are now running on 21st century air, and E5 fuel, and driven by owners whose parents were not likely to have been born in wartime. Such a shock for the purist! And many of the WW2 Spitfires that 'haven't flown since' being recovered from, the Dunkirk beaches, lakes or dug up in France, do fly with their original serial number painted on the side, so I guess that makes them 'original' unlike those fake Me262s in Germany.

Ruxy, I am holding out for some 6.50 x 16 tyres with Xtragrip military tread to keep my Lwt looking like '1980s British Army' as best as I can, to go on my specially prepared spare set of '231601' wheels. I knew one Lwt owner who fitted what he said were tyres used on London black cabs, and they looked awful! There must surely be a market for 6.50 x 16s in the Uk as there are plenty of Lwts that could use them at the right price. Hopefully they still make them somewhere and the inner tubes?

Out of interest Barry, where are your tyres made? I'm still holding out for some Land Rover Lwt tyres - 6.50 x 16s with a military tread - Goodyear Xtra Grip

When, I bought my Lwt about 20 years ago, I wanted it to look fairly orginal, but liked the splash of colour of the yellow bridge plate, and the Union Flag, but removed the Pegasus badge! Revisiting a few photos of the RE vehicles on exercise in 1980s in BAOR, shows a distinct lack of Union Flags, but green bridge plates and in one photo I have there is a number in 2 inches high numbers above the headlight.

When I was in the Army, newly built Series III Land Rovers were delivered to my RE unit in late 1970s , painted in Gloss Dark Bronze Green but with the galvanised parts, like front and rear fenders and tilt hoops left unpainted, and with yellow bridge plates. In the early 1980s the existing Series LRs were taken to Workshops and were sprayed Nato matt green and black, including the bridge plates. I never saw any grey coloured ones. A year or two later, the bridge plates were removed entirely. After that, I dont remember ever seeing a new Series LR delivered in Nato matt green, with unpainted galvanised parts. Am I remembering correctly- did the painting style / instructions to Land Rover change? Did they spray the entire vehicle before deliver, or were British Army units always supplied via a Vehicle Storage / Park type Unit, where they were sprayed prior to delivery? I do remember an occasion when a new Series FFR arrived and I painted it with Nato matt black to camouflage it, as it was just green. My own Lwt, a 1980 built 12v GS, is a bit strange as some parts of it are Gloss DBG, such as the part below the windscreen and aroundthe vent panels, but the rest is Nato green; were manufacturers using up old stock of parts or was this done by the British Army? My Lwt does show evidence of a collision, possibly with a tree or trees, as the front offside wing has been repaired and the Offside front bumper is slightly bent. On the nearside it appears another collision with a tree has bent the tub, while in use without the doors. Also at the rear, there is a box for the jack in the 'wheel arch' that has been added. There should be one in the nearside engine bay for 'HG' registered vehicles?

And now RAF Armoured Cars Use of captured equipment hasn't had much attention at MV shows. Why haven't we seen any 'LR Sdkfz 222' painted as RAF?

I guess France might celebrate the 80th anniversary of the liberation of Paris later this year and 'Mesuier Le Mayor' will wonder why no 'vehicles historique' have turned up in Paris, for the 'victory parade' It will be the same in 20 years but will they ever celebrate 'zero carbon day'?

So I guess, if you go wander off the route to Normandy you have to avoid cities.