Old Bill

Thanks for that Chaps. I have been trying to work out how they did it originally as the taper is very fine. Is that a slotter Marcel? It looks as old as the lorry! Can it be set at an angle in order to plane the taper in? My thinking at the moment is to drill the hole and file it roughly square. Then I plan to make a broach which I can pull through the hole with a piece of stud to make it accurately square finally finishing up with some careful filing. It did occur to me to use the quill on my milling machine as a slotter and just mount the wheel on a rotary table, packed up at an angle so that I could plane the taper. However, my mill is not big enough to get it underneath! Many thanks for your kind offer Marcel but perhaps you are a bit far away this time! I guess they must have used the slotter originally unless they had some sort of fancy broach. Filing is fine for one-off but production is a different matter. Cheers! Steve

Great! I thought they had all gone! No doubt it will come out one day and we can always make a new block if one doesn't turn up. Something to look forward to. Steve

I'm afraid we have been a bit quiet recently due to end-of-season rallies and so on. We are still working on it though and I hope Tim will be able to post some pics of the steering wheel pattern I am making sometime next week. In the mean time, we have ordered the timber for the body frame and are also in the process of applying for a licence plate. Whilst digging through the paperwork for evidence of age, I came across this picture. I'm sorry it is so poor but I hope that you can see that it is our chassis frame and another in the roof of a garage near Huddersfield, viewed from underneath. It must have been quite a challenge just to get them up there! Steve

I have just been Googling Pagefield and have found this comment: '1913 Pagefield produced the N model, a subsidy 4ton lorry using a 42hp Dorman engine and supplied 519 to the Forces. It remained in production until 1931' I agree that it certainly looks like one and you are right, the wheels are cast, now I look again. Are there any survivors? I have never heard of one. Steve

The Dorman 4JO was used in a number of chassis including the Caledon and the Hallford. This chassis is neither of those! The wooden spokes suggest an American chassis but they wouldn't use a British engine. Tim (GWT) will have a suggestion for sure! Steve

During the rest of my time in Devon, I made up the fuel pipes and fitted the filter and it all looks very nice. However, the filter stop valve didn't seat and no matter how hard I turned it off, it still leaked. A closer look revealed a sliver of steel down one side of the thread where I had drilled out the old spindle. This was pushing the new one off-centre causing the leak. Much poking with the scriber wouldn't shift it and I was somewhat at a loss until I remembered reading of a method for extracting broken taps from non ferrous metals by dissolving them out in a saturated solution of Alum. After obtaining a supply of Alum from an on-line pharmaceutical supplier (The first time I have used one of those!), I dissolved as much as I could in a plastic pot of hot water leaving some crystals still visible in the bottom. I then immersed the offending casting and left it there all week on top of my central heating boiler to keep it warm. I have, this evening, washed it out and found the steel completely gone. Reassembly demonstrated instant success so I am very pleased. I don't understand the chemistry that is going on but I guess that it is an accelerated galvanic corrosion process between the dissimilar metals. As a result, it will only take steel out of a non-ferrous casting. If you break a tap off in your cast-iron block it won't work! Another useful process to keep up one's sleeve. Steering wheel pattern next! Steve :-)

I think there is a bit too much work in a chara. We have been on the job for eight years already and I don't want to add a couple more! It is interesting to note that the army did have some fairly austere charabancs for troop transport but I have only seen them on AEC or Locomobile chassis. Fortunately for us, Dennis lorries all seem to have the general service body. I think that the first drive out of the shed is going to be in the new year. Although the body and seat box are fairly straightforward, there is quite a lot of ironwork involved and therefore a lot of man-hours. Unfortunately, Tim and I still have to earn a living and cannot devote as many hours as we would like. Never mind. Something to look forward to! Steve

I see that Tim has put three more films on Youtube. There does seem to be some interference from the HT though! Steve

Thanks for all of that Chaps. Yesterday was quite an exciting day! I am fortunate to have a day off today but poor Tim has had to go back to work. We do have some more film and I expect Tim will post some later. The first time we tried to start it, we had two spectacular 'front-fires' through the carburettor leaving us all with our ears ringing. These were due to fitter incompetence on my part as I had connected it as 1-2-3-4 instead of 1-3-4-2. Once that had been rectified, it started on the sixth pull, as you saw, (The film really is the first start!) and ran for about ten minutes. The oil pressure gauge climbed to 40psi and then settled back to 20 as it warmed up. The engine is remarkably quiet with almost no exhaust noise at all. The gearbox hummed gently and the whole effect was super. The engine responded well to snap throttle opening and also idled so slowly that we could count the revolutions so all in all, we are very pleased. Some of the hose joints began to weep as it warmed up but the clips were tightened and that sorted them. Number one inlet valve plug also had a weep so I will go and tighten that in a moment. There is a slight oil leak from the magneto drive shaft which we can live with but nothing else serious. Next job is to fit some controls to it and then we are on to building the bodywork. It is a simple body but there are still a few hours in it so next year's Brighton run will still be a challenge. We will keep you posted! Steve :-D:-D:-D

A man after my own heart! Don't worry about not having the skills. If you pick a project and genuinly want to do it, the skills will soon come! Steve

We're ready for it! Steve

I think you are right. When I have played with other peoples ancient vehicles, one of the expressions has often been 'Have you tickled the carb?' I had forgotten that! Steve

Quite right! Our objective is to produce a vehicle that looks loved and cared for using factory parts. I don't mind if bits of it look well used as it is, after all, 90 years old. It is nice, however to be able to share and talk about what we have actually done to achieve this illusion and I would like to thank Jack for giving us this opportunity to do so on the forum and to make so many new friends through it. Steve

That is the end of the needle valve controlled by the float. When starting, it can be lifted off its seat to allow the carb to flood and hopefully ease the starting process. Steve

Yes, thanks Ray. There are so many good stories which are lost through not being written down. It is really great to hear some of them! Steve

Thank you for your thoughts chaps. I have just checked the orifice size in the 135 jet and a number 55 drill pushes in nicely. That is 0.52" or, 1.32mm. Our spare carb has a 120 jet in it which will take a number 56 drill which is 1.19mm. Finally, Ben has kindly loaned us a carb to use as a reference. That has a 160 jet in it which takes a 53 easily or almost a 52 drill. These are 1.51 and 1.61mm so I think you have it, Norman. I agree that it isn't worth making new jets at this stage so we will just run with the 135 and see how it goes (assuming we can start it!) In my pottering this evening, I have looked at the fuel pipe connection and that is 5/8" UNF! Goodness knows why but I don't have that size so I will have to make a new one 5/8" BSF which is the size specified on the fuel tap. Of course, it needs a piece of 13/16 AF hex brass, which I also don't have, so I will have to make some of that first. Once all that is done, I can make the nut and olive. This really is a very silly pastime! Steve

Fortunately for us, safety glass hadn't become common so the lorry is completely open and that particular need doesn't arise! :-D Since completing the tube, I have been tinkering with the carburettor. As mentioned before, I am stripping down one and fitting the parts to another incomplete body of the correct size. This has turned out to be a more expensive exercise than expected as Claudel was French and so it is all metric and we are not tooled up for that! Dad has bought some taps and dies and I have ordered some more change wheels for my lathe to allow me to screw cut metric pitches. Always something! One thing still remains a puzzle and I am hoping that you chaps can help. The manual describes the correct jet as a 'number 130'. The jet I have extracted from my donor carb is clearly marked '135'. Can anyone tell me how the Claudel numbering system worked and whether I will have to make a new one or not? If I have to make a new one, It would be nice to know what the numbers actually mean so that I can drill it the right size! All thoughts and comments would be much appreciated. Steve

Quite right. That is one of the reasons why we have not put any in yet! Steve :-D

You might have it there. Certainly, that little tank of water will either run out in no short order or do very little in terms of cooling unless the water could be contained within the drum. Our drum has no provision for that and is full of oil for the UJ. I have driven a car with a metal to metal (cast iron on bronze) drum brake and it was quiet, smooth and effective. Railway equipment was always metal to metal until relatively recent years and that only tended to squeal at the lowest speeds just before stopping. The bottom line is that I don't know why they troubled with the system! Steve

That's a good question, Roy. I have never seen one on a vehicle. However, the GA drawing does show a water tank on the scuttle above the driver's knees and a photo in the manual on an early pattern scuttle, also shows it. (see below).We have found no evidence of one having been fitted to any of the bits and pieces we have obtained, though, and the holes are not shown on the scuttle drawing so it is my belief that they were probably discontinued early on. We have, therefore, decided not to try to fit one. Actually, I haven't been able to see how it worked either as there is no obvious place to put it on the brake drum. Does anyone have any experience of transmission brake coolers? Steve

I must admit that I don't know although I think that what was removed was thick and nasty through age and use. The manual says such things as 'a good quality engine oil' which is not very illuminating. However, the FWD manual specifies the viscosity and exactly how to measure it although I haven't tried checking myself. I just rang Morriss's and the chap there said 'let me look in the book'! We have always found them extremely helpful and the oil turned up within 48 hours. Great service. Steve

Good question! I think that the back axle will hold around two gallons and the gearbox about three. According to the manual, the sump has a capacity of five gallons. I hope we don't have to change it very often! Steve

I don't think dishing it will be too difficult as the spokes are all straight. I just plan to hold the rim of my steel profile in the vice and push each spoke in until it looks about right. I will then clamp the spoke to the edge of the bench and bend the centre part out again until it is parallel with the rim. The spokes are not joined at the centre so the cuts will simply open out. I can then glue the MDF on and dress it to shape as the final pattern. At least, that is the theory! Steve

I can vouch for series one being very good indeed with even a cameo appearance from the 60hp Napier car. At one point, they even did the old school photo trick with the tender appearing in several places at once! The airfield, hanger and Royal Aircraft Factory sets are all outstanding and I hadn't realised quite how good they were at the time. Mind you, I was only twelve when they were first shown! Steve

Some good thoughts there. Thanks Chaps. Unfortunately for us, the finger grips are 45° around towards the inside so a fully laser cut/water jet/wire eroded profile just wouldn't work. Well, a posh 3d wire eroder might but there is a lot of cutting to do at some cost as well as the finish machining to produce the 3-d shape. To CNC mill it from the solid would be a quite acceptable solution but I dread to think what the blank might cost. The wheel is quite dished so a 2" thickness may not be enough. The rim is 1 1/2" diameter in section. If we had our own mill and could write our own programme, then it would be a possibility. Our aim, always, is to do as much as we can ourselves so the current plan is for me to make a pattern and to cast the whole thing in one piece in aluminium. We don't have the gear to roll the correct steel tube for the rim but I think that the aluminium will be OK, once it is disguised with the black phenolic resin coating. I intend that the pattern will be of MDF glued to a central steel core with the spokes bent to the correct angle. (I can't believe that I had that cut three years ago!). Father has presented me with a rotary table so I can use that to get the finger grips correctly positioned and then cut them out by hand. The real time and care there will be in the marking out but as our time is free then that will be fine. Cost wise, this job could run away with us if we are not careful. Even the steel blank was £45- and I can see the casting being around the £50- mark. I have just been sent a potential lead so all of this may come to nothing. Fingers crossed! Steve