Old Bill

Hi Chaps.

Many thanks for all of the advice and guidance. All very useful and interesting. I was in Devon for the weekend so we have finally bitten the bullet and lined the tank. I bought two tins of 'Slosh' for a total of £60- delivered. (Ouch!) and, as the tank has never held fuel we poured it in and tumbled it for an hour.

It was a most soul destroying job as we couldn't see what was going on whilst trying to handle a most awkward shaped tank without scratching the paint. Eventually, we poured out the remainder and ended up with about £40- worth to dispose of! Oh well. The job is done nowand the tank is hardening off ready for when we can all get together and fit it. I will be pleased to see it installed!

On a more interesting front, I cut a gasket for the carburettor and then fitted it to the manifold.

It looks quite nice so hopefully, I won't have to touch it again. We shall see!

More to post later but I need to get the hang of the new website!

Steve

Looking more closely, none of the pictures I have posted are showing either. I post mine by using 'attachments' whereas Tim usually uses someone like photobucket to host them. Is there a clue there?

Steve

It was fine when I opened it at work at lunch time but I can't see it now.

Thanks for posting, Barry. It is a nice pic. They are early subsidy lorries with the slat side body and hard cab so much closer to John Arthur's example in appearance. I haven't seen that one in colour before. How did you find it?

Steve

Nice to see the progress Dan.

I think Andy is right about the con rods and I would be very wary of using cast ones. With your kit and skills, it would be nothing to carve them out of the solid and they would give me a lot more confidence. Now, we need Mr Pugh's advice on material specification. I would suggest a low alloy steel like En 24 to quote a standard which went obsolete fifty years ago.

The wooden rod is an excellent idea to confirm clearances.

Good luck with it all!

Steve

Thanks for the warning!

Dad has finished painting the fuel tank and it is now ready for sealing. This has been the worst ever item for paint bubbling on the second coat due to lack of cleanliness. It seems that thinners is just not good enough where soft solder flux is concerned and we should have used scouring powder or something caustic instead. Oh well. There is another lesson learned.

I have some 'Slosh' on order so once the paint has hardened off, we will try that.

Now back to pattern making!

Steve

Hi Ben.

You don't need to make the first cut full depth. You can do two or three cuts an inch deep to get the clearance diameter and then do another two or three cuts the next inch deep, repeating until you have clearance to full depth. I'm sure that you have worked this out already!

Part of the joy of this game is working out how to do something with the kit you have rather than try finding bigger kit. This is a good one!

Have fun!

Steve

Father has been to the foundry this week and picked up the latest castings. These are the silencer ends for which the patterns were so kindly printed by Barry and also the the top water pipe for which I am indebted to John for the loan of his original to use as a pattern.

The moulder was very pleased with the finish on the pattern due to the 'Patterncoat' paint as it made it much easier to extract them from the sand. It was painful to rub back but obviously well worth doing.

Dad now has some more homework!

Steve

A few odds and ends going on this week. I have turned up two more carburettor choke tubes of 27 and 26mm bore so I will have something to play with when we start the engine for the first time.

It was nice to meet up with several forum friends at Old Warden Steam Rally the other day. I was pleased to see that John Marshall has the same size carburettor on his Thornycroft as we have. It gives one confidence!

I have just bought some 'Wynns Carburettor Cleaner' in Halfords. I hadn't thought that there might be such a thing until FlandersFlyer mentioned it a few days ago. There is always something new to learn!

More posts shortly.

Steve

Thanks Tomo. There is something new to be learned every day!

Steve

Hi Tomo.

At Old Warden, you very kindly showed me the Pyrene extinguisher that you have for the Thorny and I was most interested to hear the details. Tim gave me this one for Christmas last year for the next project.

It is American made and 1917 dated which is absolutely wonderful for us.

I am sure that you said something about the font of 'Pyrene' and also the colouring of the label.

And also something about the position of the filler plug.

Please could you comment on this one and also give me some tips on how to clean it as yours was immaculate! Mind you, I am sure that a lot of hours went into it!

Many thanks,

Steve

The lack of a transverse spring does suggest post-war so that or a rebuild, perhaps to increase the payload. I think the second 'gear lever' works the diff-locks on the side of the transfer case. I can honestly say that crawling underneath to lock the diff when stuck in the mud is no joke!

A super lorry and a great project for someone.

Steve

I don't have a suitable thread gauge as we are not geared up for metric! I took my glasses off, looked closely and then counted ten threads against a 6" rule which does have a metric scale. I tried to make it 0.8mm pitch but it just didn't work so I settled for 0.75. I did hold the tap against the screw first, though, just to make sure.

Macro vision is about the only advantage of short-sightedness!

Steve

The main jet had a polish.

Then the throttle and end caps. I couldn't wire brush them as it took off the nickle so I was left with just Brasso as I couldn't find a solvent that would touch the muck on the outside. I dressed the damaged cover with a needle file and then polished the ends flat with fine emery paper on the surface plate so that the throttle would have a reasonable chance of sealing against them.

I drilled out the screw which I failed to remove earlier and then ran the tap through very carefully. This was successful, I am pleased to report.

All of the original bits, ready to fit. Cleaning the main castings was exceptionally painful as I could not find a solvent which would shift the muck and resorted to hand scraping and Brasso. What should I use to clean a carburettor?

Now, on to the bits I had to make. The venturi should have a 28mm throat, according to the manual. However, I was surprised to find that the diameter through the throttle was already 28mm so that there would be no divergence until after the throttle. I was fortunate to be able to borrow a Solex MOV40, which is a later incarnation of mine, and was interested to find that the venturi in that one also had no divergence. I find this puzzling but it gave me the confidence to turn one up.

Then I turned up a replacement screw to secure the end cover.

I fitted the covers using the mill and the lathe as presses in order to make sure that I put them in squarely. This worked well and I managed to remove almost all of the end float in the throttle barrel without it binding.

Clean up the banjo and final assembly and it is ready to fit.

Something to take to Devon the next time I am heading that way. Now it is back to pattern making.

Steve

The carburettor has been occupying my bench for ages so I thought it time to sort it out and get it fitted so that it would be out of the way! The manual has a very useful section of the bronze, updraft Solex with barrel throttle with which they were originally fitted.

After about five years of looking, in other words, twenty three years ago, I managed to track this one down which is almost right but of the 1923 pattern which has a slightly different idle arrangement. Conveniently, the manual quotes the jet and choke sizes and the dealer managed to match the jets for me but didn't have a 28mm choke tube.

I started pulling it apart and fortunately, this was fairly straightforward.

Then the choke tube. This came out OK but has a hole and slot in the side which does not line up with anything. It has also been filed on the outside diameter so I think it has had a hard life and probably come out of something else as the dealer knew that I wouldn't be using it. It has a 22mm throat.

Then the end plates on the barrel. These appeared to be simply pushed in so I tapped the end of the throttle barrel with a mallet until one came out.

Oh.....

So that was what the screw was for!

I then attacked the screws with heat and an impact driver. I twisted the end off twice but eventually got one out.

It is metric, 5x0.75mm for which, of course, I don't have a tap or die. A quick call to Tracy Tools had them in the post the next day and I cleaned it and the hole up .

HAve you found the photos in the 'Stilltime Collection'?

http://www.stilltimecollection.co.uk/search/q/0-3,1,4,2-3-0-0-0-1-1-palladium.html

I can't post them here but they are nice and clear and worth investing in copies.

Good luck with it!

Steve

Thank you for all of that gentlemen. Lots of food for thought there. I must take a look inside the Dennis tank and see what is going on there as that is unlined.

A while back, Barry very kindly 3d-printed the patterns for the silencer ends for us.

They are super. However, the process produces a textured surface which will make it very difficult to slide the sand out so he recommended painting them with a two-part epoxy called, not surprisingly, 'Pattern Coat'. He sent me a sample which I used for the first coat. You have to be very quick with the stuff as it is like trying to paint with a jelly after about five minutes but it does fill the surface very well. I carefully rubbed it back, (a most tedious job!) before applying a second coat and then rubbed that back as well. The surface came out very smooth and I am sure they will be fine.

Dad dropped them off at the foundry this week so that is another pattern ticked off the list!

Many thanks, Barry.

Steve

We won't fill between the end plates as once the oxygen iis used up, they will stop corroding.

I'm not planning to line the interior at the moment but I should be pleased to hear some thoughts both for and against. What are the actual issues with modern fuel and what might be going on inside the tank? I don't think of ethanol as being that aggressive towards metals, unless you know different!

Steve

I have, at last, got the latest pictures!

The last task on the tank was to fit the double skins on the ends. Unfortunately, the tank has rusted at a phenomenal rate so the first task was another wire brushing.

The outer skin is a laser cut profile which fits on the edge of the flange on the inner skin. Of course, this had a fillet of solder which had to be scraped out by hand, a very tedious exercise.

Much to my amazement the profile simply pushed in with no adjustment which was a very pleasing result.

The joint was painted with Baker's Fluid and then gently warmed up with the torch and some electrician's solder run in. This had a lower melting point than used previously and I hoped not to disturb the previous joint.

The edge was dressed flush using a flap wheel in the angle grinder and we are very pleased with the result.

A wipe over with some thinners and Dad started on the first coat of Bondaprime. We wanted to get this on quickly due to the speed with which the tank was corroding.

Once the coat was dry, we put the tank back up in order to bend the straps to shape and drill the ends for rivets.

Ready for paint.

Unfortunately, it appears that I didn't clean the tank sufficiently well and the second coat is having a problem so Dad is currently struggling with that.

I have ticked the tank off the list. Silencer end patterns to complete next!

Steve

After visiting the Great Dorset with the family, I took the opportunity to finish the fuel tank. Unfortunately, I left all of the photos in Devon so it will be a day or two until the postman catches up with them In the meantime, I also turned up a spacer and fitted the fuel filter so that is one more piece off my bookcase!

Steve

unlike face book cant press like . SO like like like the whole restoration great stuff

Glad you are enjoying it. It is the only reason for doing it! Well, that and all the help everyone so kindly offers.

Thanks for the tip-off over the butt-welding clamps, chaps. I have never seen those either but now I know to look for them when I need them! What is on the underside of them?

Steve

We are rather pleased with the general effect. It seems to fit anyway! Now we have to solder on the end double skins without upsetting the joints and fit the tank straps. Then it will be ready for painting and we are on to the next task.

This tank has been quite a challenge and I must thank everyone who has helped in the process. We could not have done it without you!

Steve

Now it was a case of de-rusting the ends and fitting them into the tank. The soft solder flux is amazingly corrosive and the rust just arrived overnight.

This time, we could use Mr Pugh's rivet squeezer which was much quicker than knocking them down. Many thanks, Andy.

Tim got quite into it!

Once all the rivets were down, it was just a case of warming up the joints and adding a bit of solder. Actually, I might have got a bit keen with the solder as there are definitely some globules inside which rattle. I will have to make the effort to shake them out.

Remove the rust from the ends again, paint the joint with Baker's fluid and then warm up as before.

The moment of truth!

A leak! One of three at each end and three on the top seam. These were quickly re-run awith a bit more solder and the tank left on end for a while, full to the filler neck.

Turn it over and check the other end.

Success! A trial fit was then felt in order.

Well, I have just had the great good fortune to have two weeks off and some of that time has been devoed to assembling the fuel tank. First job was to strip it down so this is what a fuel tank kit looks like.

Then it was a case of tinning all the joints. This was done using 'Solder Paint', a most wonderful concoction of solder powder and Baker's fluid. It is fiendishly expensive but does such a good job that it is worth every penny. Just paint it on and heat it up until the solder melts and runs over the surface. Easy!

With all the contact surfaces tinned, the tank was then riveted up. First part of that process was to make a rivet snap capable of supporting the rivet heads inside the tank. We made that up by strapping a piece of 4" x 1/2" strip to the anvil and then turning up the snap itself which was dropped into a hole in the end.

The wrapper was temporarily held together with the Clecos and the rivets were inserted and knocked down finishing off with another snap to form the head.

The baffles were inserted and secured with the Clecos before fixing them with rivets.

Passing visitors also get dragged in to hold the tank!

All done and ready for soldering.

I wanted to add some solder to the baffles before fitting the ends so that I could see what I was doing. The tinning made the job easy and it was just a case of warming it up and feeding some more solder.

Thanks for that Adrian. That is another little corner of history I know nothing about. I am looking forward to hearing more and watching your progress.

Good luck!

Steve

The reason for using Araldite was that I had two open tubes on the shelf that have been there for years! Of course, once I have my casting, I will have to get the stuff off again so John can fit it to his lorry!

Steve