Old Bill

Hi Doug.

Yes, certainly it is not an accurate representation of the actual fern leaf. However, it is based on the best information that we have available as to the logo used on the lorry which is this cigarette card of all things. So far, we have not found any official representation to copy. It is just unfortunate that neither our photo above or 'Runflat's' document is crisp enough to blow up and use. If you do find an official diagram of the roundel or, better still, a clear photograph of one on a lorry, then we will be very pleased indeed as we have, today, decided that these are the markings we will use. One less decision left to make!

Steve

Oh dear! Bad luck!

Steve

It is nice to see the recognition of the role of us colonial troops in the war, and would certainly be a change to otherwise British dominance of the fleet( For the few military trucks being displayed of the time frame).

In saying that what is the colour scheme and markings on the Autocar?

Doug:-\

Whilst we have not yet decided what markings it will carry, it would be nice to recognise our colonial cousins. There does not seem to be any cross-reference information available between vehicle identification numbers and their allocation, (Unless you know better, Roy?) and this photo and one other are the only ones we have seen with the NZ marking. Is there an officially recognised version of the fern leaf or do you think this signwriter just had a good stab at one?

Our Autocar has a 'made-up' livery using our best judgement. We believe that those used in France were the water tank variants and that the truck bodied versions went to East Africa. Very few photos of Autocars have come to light and no truck-bodied ones with any markings. We have seen pictures of those of the Canadian Motor Machine Gun Brigade with a triangle containing three 'C's and the water tankers with a crescent containing three stars. We are certain that ours operated as a tanker within the British Army although the Australian War Graves Commission had some after the war. With our limited knowledge, we painted it the standard khaki colour and added a number which we found stamped on the front left dumb-iron. (The chassis number is on the rear cross-member on an Autocar and different from this one). If anyone can show us a picture with markings on, we should be very pleased indeed.

Steve :confused::confused:

Yes. Well I could make the stencil for them but I think we will be better off, timewise, if we leave it for the signwriter along with the numbers on the bonnet and licence plate and any symbol on the seat box. Tim will choose a number and a symbol. We have several pictures of the lorries with a fern and 'NZ' on the seat ends which I take to signify New Zealand. We could also have a shell (ammunition) or a clover leaf (fodder).

At the moment we are cock-a-hoop at just being able to use original stencils and thank Barry very much for his great kindness in lending such precious items to us. What amazing survivors.

Steve :-D

You are right about the learning in this game, Richard. I hadn't spotted the reversed front door but it is obvious now! Mind you, there is no slot in the base to accept it so perhaps it came from a different lamp altogether. I will have to look more closely at another one although that might be a job for another day. I think we have our work cut out getting the Dennis ready for the time being!

Steve

We picked up this Lucas 742 at Beaulieu a few years ago. It has the electric conversion socket screwed in the back and also WD stamped in it. It is intended that it will find a home on the Thornycroft eventually.

Steve

Hi Mike.

Very many thanks for your kind offer. It is always very reassuring to have another string to the bow! I'll send a PM once we have been accepted and look forward to sharing a cuppa!

All the best,

Steve :-)

In your run up to the Brighton run, what do you feel in what order are the biggest chances of mechanical failure?

R

It is difficult to guess what might happen although we should be able to sort it on the road. With our other lorries we have had a variety of failures, usually involving the magneto, from it moving and uncoupling itself from the drive dog to distributor cap insulation break down and to the centre carbon brush for the grounding switch breaking up allowing the spring to wrap itself around the contact breaker. We have also had the impulse drive mechanism come off allowing the key to fall from the drive and thus losing the timing. We never found the key so I whittled a new one from a piece of mahogany we were using as a chock. It got us home!

On the Autocar, we have suffered an exploding tyre (a problem we won't have with the Dennis!), a sunk carburettor float and the flywheel coming loose from the crankshaft. I whittled a new float from a piece of softwood which got us home although it had sunk by the following day. The loose flywheel was a pain as it was a body off and gearbox out job in the rally field to get at it. Had to do it though as it was our only transport home. It did cause a lot of interest at the show and there were as many people watching us as there were around the ring!

The only prediction I can make is that the most likely problems will be to do with fuel or ignition. I am hoping that with so many of you to keep your fingers crossed for us, we will be OK!

Steve

Great to see the body going on.

I see a problem developing with a lack of clearance as the roof goes on! Doug:

Quite right. I have spent so much time wandering around in the back with my head down that I am beginning to feel like a cross between John Cleese and Groucho Marx!

Steve :-)

I am very fond of silver soldering because it is so easy to get a good neat job. It is as strong as mild steel and runs right through the joint although it won't fill gaps of more than a couple of thou and it is expensive. Of course, I am also better at it than welding!

Steve :-D

Many thanks and to you too! Have a happy, safe and vehicular new year!

Steve :-D

Well, yes and I am rapidly turning into a dust-cart spotter!

I was pleased to find an original general arrangement drawing for our lorry on the wall in the production office. My photo album was good for the job interview too!

Steve :-D

Out of interest, I notice Steve(?) is wearing a Terex-Pegson shirt in one of the photos. I work for a quarrying company (Bullimores). I wonder if we've met at some point.

 

James

Yes, I did work for Pegson for seven years of which the first six and a half were great. With the collapse of the rock-crusher market they closed the factory and I now build dust carts for a living. We may well have met in some hole in the ground somewhere!

Steve :-)

(PS Glad you are enjoying it!)

Hello Steve,

 

This might be of interest, ref welding.

 

Thanks for that. What an excellent video! I hadn't thought of looking there and have learned a lot already. Now I must go and check to see what sort of rods I actually have!

Steve :-)

Thank you for your kind words, I hope that you enjoy it as much as I enjoy writing down my memories.

Ray.

I enjoy them all Ray. Thanks for sharing them!

Steve

Hi Quentin.

Many thanks for all of that. You are quite right in that my welder is very much a home use type although not the cheapest end of the market. However, I will have a go with the Oxford welder and see how I get on. I normally manage to do these things by having a bit of a read and then just getting stuck in. It doesn't seem to have worked this time and I am very grateful for your expert knowledge. It is really nice to have an explanation of what is going on.

I'm so pleased that you are enjoying the story. I has been great to be able to share it and to receive so much help from you and all of our friends here. I will let you know how I get on over the break but I don't think I am quite ready for overhead welding yet!

Many thanks for your thoughts.

Steve :tup::

I can't help but comment on the welding... Given the spectacularly high standard of all the other work and looking at the wimpy little ground lead on the welder I would suggest you need a better welding set, even a pigeon could get a better result with a decent set just by pecking it in the general direction

It has always disappointed me that I have never mastered stick welding as I can do most of the things that we want. Some proper lessons would probably help, as would a lot more practice. I was using 3mm rods at 120A or thereabouts. The set is rated to 180A and the cables are those which came with it. Would you replace the lot or could I get away with just heavier cables?

Steve

That is a great piece of machinery, good to see it is still in use! Do you know pressure and cylinder diameter, or the force needed to press the tires off?

 

Thanks, Marcel

Hi Marcel.

I don't know the actual force this time as the pressure gauge had been removed for safe keeping and we didn't trouble to put it back. However, it is a 14" ram and the total capacity is around 300 tons. Unusually, the gauge is calibrated in 'hundredweights per square inch' and the pressure is applied by use of a hand pump. It is quite hard work but you can feel exactly what the tyre is doing and when something is going wrong.

The press dates from the Great War and was used by a local Dunlop tyre dealership before being rescued by our friend about thirty years ago. I believe that it weighs about 11 tons and half of it is below ground level.

Steve

The tractor unit is an American built Knox. I think the tank is a French 'St Chamond' but I need to have a look at my books to be certain!

Steve

Hello Wanderer!

You have come to the right place and some real experts will, no doubt, be along shortly. For what they are worth here are my first thoughts.

The first lorry is an ex British army AEC Y-type lorry. There are not many clues but the bonnet is the right shape as are the very distinctive bonnet handles. Also, the Y-types had a rigid cab split at shoulder height and this one shows the joining holes along the top edge of the seat.

The third picture shows three more Y-types in the background behind the motorcycles.

The last picture shows a Packard lorry, with its very distinctive radiator, on the extreme right hand end.

Did the British find themselves in Estonia at this time? I'm afraid that I know almost nothing about this conflict.

Good luck with your researches!

Steve:-)

Yes, there certainly has been some coffee (and beer!) gone into the project. We don't record that against the lorry though!

What you can see there is the bolt store. It was getting very much out of hand until Dad put up the series of shelves. We have managed to collect a set of vehicles with every sort of fastener standard common at the time which is something of a pain, especially as we only fit the original thread type back on them. The bottom shelf is BSF (Dennis). Next up is UNF (FWD). Above that, they are UNC (Autocar) followed by Whitworth (Thornycroft) and on the top are the coach bolts. We are less fussy with the coach bolts although they must have square nuts. Hex nuts are absolutely wrong for the period. In some places, I have made up square nuts for when we have run out. They are a pain but stick out like a sore thumb if they are wrong.

I don't think they are ever quite finished. There are still a couple of little jobs outstanding on all of the ones we have done and, of course, we now have a maintenance problem as well.

When we stop working on the Dennis, the Thornycroft will be next. That will be another ten year project so I don't think we will need to worry about being bored for a while!

Steve :beer:

By way of diversion, can you explain the wheel and clamp on the engine flywheel please? Doesn't look like an extractor.

Father has taken some more pics and this is the best. You can see the clutch leaf springs running across the flywheel, the thrust bearing carrier in the middle and then the clutch brake ring on the end. The challenge is going to be in extracting the cone from the flywheel as it has been there a long time!

Regarding electric transmissions, I thing they were introduced because it was so difficult to change gear which commonly resulted in gear tooth damage. Versions were made by several companies including Tilling Stevens, Dennis Stevens, Hallford and Thornycroft. The Tillings were the most numerous. I have had the great good fortune to ride in a Tilling Stevens bus and it is a most weird sensation. Going up hills, the engine is revving hard but the bus only crawling giving the sensation of a badly slipping clutch!

Steve

Note in organiser for london to brighton may 2011

Entry form came today..... :cool2:

By way of diversion, can you explain the wheel and clamp on the engine flywheel please? Doesn't look like an extractor.

What you are looking at there is the next project! I will ask Dad to post a better picture.

That is the Thornycroft M4 engine and what you can see is the clutch brake and clutch springs. The clutch is a large cone like the Dennis but it is pressed into the flywheel by two leaf springs which go across the flywheel, either side of the drive shaft. The ring you can see is the clutch brake. This is attached to the cone and moves backwards when the pedal is depressed. If you push your foot to the floor, it moves far enough back to contact some friction material on a carrier thus slowing the gearbox mainshaft down more quickly and allowing faster up changes. When changing down, one must remember to push the pedal in only slightly so that it doesn't come into contact. Another one of the joys of driving ancient lorries!

Steve :cheesy:

That is such a simple solution - the really clever bit is being able to think of it in the first place!

I did have the piece of plate leaning against the end of the bench for two years before I worked out how to attack it!

Steve