Old Bill

Wonderful Tim, no stopping you now. I marvel at how we are able to solve problems and source parts so quickly via the internet. In the past we would have given up after months of fruitless letter writing and false trails.

Quite right. Mind you, it has still taken us 22 years!

Steve

Those mated castings. Has this design purpose? Coolant circulation?

Yes, they just connect the blocks at the bottom to let the coolant through.

Even just with two cylinders in each casting, they are spectacular pieces of foundry work for manual sand casting. Before we obtained this engine, I was looking at making the patterns for them myself so that we could make them up but I never did quite work out how it was done. Fingers are crossed that I never have to do it!

Steve :-)

Tony,

 

I think that I may have a brand new one boxed, no idea of what it fitted, something military, but too short for a Dingo petrol tank. Problem is the shaft length and amount of twist is calculated to the needle sweep on the dial, but you could probably use the original shaft.

 

Might even be able to find a good float, check the centre to centre measurement of the two rods.

Hi Richard.

If you have a float that you could spare, that would be fantastic! The centre distance on the rods is 1 1/4" and they are 1/4" diameter.

Looking more closely at this float, it has obviously cracked and been caulked in the past. I guess it is just suffering from being old brass. I will have a go at drilling a couple of holes in it and washing out the oil with thinners before patching them with some shim and a soldering iron. It is quite an intriguing piece of work really. Just how did they make them?

When I shortened the one we had in stock to suit the petrol tank, I simply put the rod in the vice and twisted it a bit more with a tap wrench. It had to rotate 180° from bottom to top and it worked out quite well in the end.

Another challenge!

Steve :-)

Proper job!

Steve :-)

Hi Allan. Welcome aboard!

That is a very typical pic of the period, covered with blokes making it quite tricky! The clues are in the hubcaps and spring hangers but I can't quite see the detail. I have tried blowing it up but still can't see. Please may we have a more detailed scan of these areas?

No doubt 'Runflat' and 'Great War Truck' will know!

Cheers!

Steve

On 23rd November, 1917, Lieutenant Alfred King Tripe, my cousin, was killed in action at the Battle of Cambrai.

Alfred, commissioned as a Lieutenant, joined the Tank Corps where he was assigned to ‘E’ Battalion and went to France on July 1st 1917. After familiarisation training, they moved to the forward area at the end of July. Their tank park was at Oosthoek Wood.

Here Alfred was put in command of a Mk IV tank, E3 known as Eclipse II. He had a crew of seven: Corporal Murray, L/Corporal Lewis, Privates Jacques, Innes, Johnson, Hilling and Davies. In November the whole Tank Corps was pitched into battle. This was the Battle of Cambrai.

The battle began at 0600 on 20 November. It opened with a carefully prepared and predicted, but unregistered, fire barrage by 1,003 guns on key German defences, followed by smoke and a creeping barrage at 300 yards ahead to cover the first advances. Despite efforts to preserve secrecy, the German forces had received sufficient intelligence to be on moderate alert. An attack on Havrincourt was anticipated, as was the use of tanks.

Initially there was considerable success in most areas, and it seemed as if a great victory was within reach; the Hindenburg Line had been successfully penetrated with advances of up to 8 km achieved. Of the tanks 180 were out of action after the first day, although only 65 had been destroyed. Of the remainder 71 had suffered mechanical failure and 43 had been 'ditched'. The British had suffered around 4,000 casualties and had taken 4,200 prisoners, a casualty rate half that of Third Ypres (Passchendaele), and a greater advance in six hours than in three months there.

‘E’ Battalion were left with 11 servicable tanks out of the 42 that had started the battle. E3 was one of them, part of No. 3 section under the command of Captain Roberts. On November 23rd, all 11 were ordered into battle again with the objective of taking the ‘Round Trench’ on the plain of Moeuvres. Just before noon, E3 took a direct hit and all the crew were either killed or mortally wounded with the exception of Private Davies. Afterwards, he gave his account of what happened:

“Hit at 11:45 by a shell that passed through the rear of the tank and exploded on the left side practically level with the front of the engine setting the camouflage net on fire.”

Alfred Tripe, who was sitting at the point of the explosion, died instantly. His remains were not found and he has no grave but is remembered on the Cambrai memorial in Louverval and on a war memorial for GWR employees in Chester station. The photograph shows ‘Eclipse II’ after the battle.

Don't worry about a bit of rust at the edges lifting the rubber. Our Dennis fronts were just the same. The rust dropped out very quickly but they are showing no signs of serious damage. When we stripped the rubber from the rear tyre bands they had rusted in each side by about half an inch but the majority of the width was still very well attached indeed and proved very hard to separate!

Steve :-)

On the subject of solid tyres, had you thought of using polyurethane? We had the rears on the Dennis made up by a polyurethane specialist who also does fork truck tyres. We took the rubber off the old bands and he simply moulded the material onto them before machining a suitable profile. They were surprisingly cheap and have proved to be quite acceptable. They are a bit shiny but have dulled down very quickly and are well worth considering.

You are quite right. Dan is very fortunate!

Steve :-)

I think that is a symptom of not having enough space!

We can only get to one side of the engine. Fortunately, Father had the bright idea of putting it onto a wheeled trolley so that we can get it out and turn it around before putting it back inside. A lot of our work is carried out outside using a trailer as a bench!

Other people's sheds are always fascinating!

Steve :-)

So how about the convoy, have any plans been made yet? It would be nice to drive down the Voie Sacrée with as much vehicles as possible.

 

Regards

Marcel

Something seems to be starting here. No, there are no plans. However, I think it would be nice to do something special for centenary year and it is more fun in a crowd as there is always someone to get you out of trouble! Perhaps we should put out a few feelers to see if anyone else might be interested.

Steve

Hi 'Cel!

Great to see progress starting again! As far as piston rings are concerned I am sure that making some up would be nothing to a man of your calibre. I would take some SG iron hollow bar and turn the rings to size plus a little bit to allow for cutting. The diameter would be (Bore + (Cutter thickness divided by pi)). Cut through one side and spring the ring open by 10mm or so and wedge it with a piece of steel. Then heat the whole lot bright red and let it cool slowly. On removal of the steel, it will stay sprung. Alternatively, you could make them oversize, say 4mm, and then cut out a section Pi x 4mm and squeeze them into the bore. That would avoid any unwanted heat distortion. These work for models but I have not tried them for full size lorry rings! In your situation, I would use this chap:

Clupet Piston Ring Co.

Factory B.

Solway Industrial Estate

Maryport

Cumbria

CA15 8NF

Contact: Mr. A.D. Smith

Telephone: 01900 818 361

He is a one-man-band and extremely helpful to the likes of us. He has made rings for me and quite happy to make just one. His rings are unusual in that they go around twice with a dog-leg in the middle so there is no open joint at the ends. Goodness knows how he makes them! He runs them under a surface grinder as the last part of the process so they are flat, true and accurate. His prices are very fair too!

Good luck!

Steve

We haven't done 'Quads' (Nash and Jeffrey) yet. How about this one which lives somewhere in France? It is fitted with a US ammunition body.

Steve

This was posted on the landships site. Here is a blog of his 1,200 KM journey to Switzerland.

 

http://parcoursdufront1917.wordpress.com/page/2/

 

we should do that Steve.

 

Tim

Switzerland might be a bit keen. How about the railway on the Somme or the Menin Gate if we can persuade someone to go with us? We aren't really very adventurous!

Steve :-)

It's a real pain. The anvils are not irreplaceable as both were well used. However, now we don't have one and the replacement will cost! The last substantial metalworking job on the Dennis is to forge up the steps for the body sides and I was looking forward to having a go over Christmas. Now I am stymied!

Steve :angry

About the right sort of size for Dan's Halley, perhaps?

Steve

I've finally done it. I've reached the end of the thread! It has taken many months to work my way through every page. I have asked myself... could I have restored something in that time? 'Riveting' guys. Robert from Melbourne, Australia

Hi Robert!

We are so pleased that you have enjoyed it. After all, that is the whole object of the exercise! I have recently read it through again myself and the question that keeps occuring is 'Did we really do all of that?' My favourite part is that through this wonderful medium, our many friends here posted a running commentry of our trip to Brighton. It was like being followed by the BBC!

Steve

Does the Thorneycroft restoration have an dedicated HMVF thread already? If so where should we be looking?

Thanks, Barry,

Here!

http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?13514-WW1-Thornycroft-restoration

Progress should start moving again shortly. We seem to have spent the Summer catching up with all of the things we didn't do whilst trying to get the Dennis ready!

Steve

Tim will confirm but up to 1915, military vehicles were painted grey with black lettering. I expect he will be able to find a photograph for you.

Steve

The hook on the back suggests a Great War provenance.

I have a contact in Ireland who is doing a Napier but his chassis has rotted out completely. I have just printed off the details and they will go in the post to him this afternoon. Let's hope that the chassis finds a good home.

Steve

On the subject of FWDs, I picked this picture up many years ago. It show an example owned by the late Tom Redburn. It went out and about quite a bit and appeared in a number of movies. However, it disappeared about twenty years ago and has not been seen since. Does anyone know where it went?

Steve

Yes, that is Graham Attwater's as shown here on page three of this thread, just above the Foden. He has done a very nice job on it but he has been unfortunate in running it. On his first Brighton, his magneto failed and on the second, he ran the big ends. We saw him set off this time determined to finish. He rolled off of his tender, bump starting it on the way and was off! We didn't see him again until we arrived about three hours after he did!

Steve

At the time we painted the Autocar, we took some Brasso to a remaining patch of black paint on the Thornycroft chassis and found some original khaki green. This demonstrated that the Autocar is a very close match. Unfortunately, we have no direct evidence for the colour of a US army vehicle.

We are also still keen to find out what colour the British used in Mesopotamia as we have yet to find any reference at all. We suspect that vehicles were shipped out khaki green but may have been repainted locally.

Steve

Hi,

 

I was wondering whether you'd looked at Electrolytic Rust Removal. With all the parts you have to de-rust, clean and un-seize I think, it could be really useful to you.

 

Regards, Matt

Hi Matt and Niels.

Many thanks for that one. No, we haven't tried it but it certainly looks worth pursuing. I wonder whether it might be used on the cylinder blocks as we can't get inside them at all? Very good for fragile parts I should think.

Incidentally, does anyone have experience of using molasses in water as a de-rusting agent? It has been suggested to us by one of our Aussie friends and he swears by it!

Finally, don't worry about hijacking the thread. The common factor is the lorry but any related side issues are always welcome. Anything to make the job easier is good!

Steve

Isn't that the depot at Rouen just after the war? Tim knows, I am sure! Lots of nice Liberties in the front.

Steve

I think that one goes into the second group of ex-military rebuilt for civilian use. I didn't know about that one and must add it to my master list. Than you for showing it!

How about a few FWDs. Here is ours, rebuilt about ten years ago. Genuine ex-US Army of 1918, it spent its working life in France hauling circus trailers around up until 1970 when it was laid up in a scrapyard near Nice. After fourteen years there, it went through several owners until we got it and gave it a thorough overhaul. We also built a new body to the original USQMC pattern using drawings published in 'The Automobile' just after the war.

Steve