Desert Rat

I was asked the other evening if anyone knew what happened to a Martian Gun tractor called 'Aladdin' ? It used to be in the Norfolk area but it hasn't been around for a few years. Does anyone know what became of it ?

Hi, It might seem like a daunting task but it does seem rather complete. Cabs and back bodies can be rebuilt and i doubt it will take much to get it running. Have a search and read some of the blogs about restorations and i'm sure you will be spurred on. :-) If you look at what some of the guys have started with, it makes your one almost ready to rally !

Steve, My 981 used to run clean until your opened her up or climbed a hill. In all honesty, if your fuel is clean, your filters are good and the power doesn't seem to be lacking, i wouldn't worry too much. Remember, its not a modern diesel and a lot of the old boys used to say "If there's nothing coming out, you haven't got enough going in !" DR

Hi Mick, Thats great info, thanks ! I know the Royal Engineers in Italy had a mix of Scammells, Macks and Diamond T's for pulling the plant trailers. I know the markings of one of the units in the 46th Div who were part of the 8th Army (which ties in with your info) but was just curious about the paint scheme. In all honesty, it appears that 'anything goes' from Mickey Mouse ears, to O/D through to desert sand and in Italy i don't think any one scheme would be better than another as they moved onwards due to the variable landscape. Once again, thanks to you all for the info. DR

Niels, in the bottom picture, what colour do you think the cammo scheme is ? Also, does it say where it was taken ?

Some great pics Neils and Mick. So are we assuming that there may have been a mix of colours in 1944 onwards when in Italy ? I know that some of the Diamond T's kept their desert colour throughout. There is a pic elsewhere of a Pioneer in a collecion in Rome which is in olive drab, i suppose it ended its time in that region and was not repainted. Anyway, thanks for the info so far. :-)

Does anybody know what paint scheme was employed in Italy during WW2 ? The Royal Engineers ran several Pioneers, both SV/2S and R100's pulling plant trailers on which they carried equipment and dozers, a lot of which had come from North Africa along with some DT 981's etc. Did they remain in desert colours or were they painted in olive drab ?

Nothing much has changed since WW2 as the Rogers trailers in Italy suffered constant blow outs when hauling plant over the mountains and normally had a Bedford QL (sometimes a Matador) full of spare wheels and tyres. There is discussion at high level at present concerning the future of the current Oshkosh/King outfits. DR

Cheers, will do.:-D

Evening everyone, I have searched all the usual suspects but have been unable to locate a decent 6x6 S26 grab loader/tipper. Does anyone know of any currently for sale ? I want one to use, not just to play with so i can do without having one which will be in the workshop all winter. Thanks, DR

Its very refreshing to read opinions that are 'aware' of the twisting of history, be that accidentally, intentionally or for profit and gain. Just as an example, i once spoke to a Lancaster crew (all except the Mid-upper guner who had passed away a few years back). We got onto the subject of an individual raid during the breakout from Caen in 1944. Their aircraft had flown a daylight raid and then was hit by anti-aircrat fire but made it home. Certain parts of the story they remembered like yesterday and all agreed on, but if you had spoken to them individually, you would have thought they had been on different aircraft !! Such is the diversity of memory and personal opinion. The one thing to remember about Harris is that, as a generalisation, any commander in WW2, be that British or American, Army or Navy, only probably had to make the hard and grave decision to send their troops into battle and certain death in large numbers maybe two or three times during the whole six year conflict. (El-Alemein, D-Day, Market Garden, Pacific islands etc) Harris had to send the majority of his force into full-on battle, night, after night, after night for the entire war. That takes a strong type of person. Its very easy to sit in front of a computer, sixty years later with a cup of tea and a biscuit and judge that what was decided over half a century ago was wrong etc. I wonder what peoples opinions would be if they were trying to decide if Harris was right or wrong whilst being sat in a damp Anderson shelter listening to enemy aircraft droning overhead, feeling the pressure of the blasts as they are bombing your town, your workplace even and wondering if your family on the other side of town had been lucky or maybe they were now buried under the remains of their house...... Or even worse, just carrying on unaware that in a few minutes, your street is going to be flattened by a V-2.... I wonder what public opinion would have been then to 'ease up' on the Germans ? Be thankful we now have these choices. Anyway, excellent thread. DR

Totally agree. Strangley i saw a Catalina today stooging around and it makes you think about the lads from Coastal Command. Be it on anti-submarine duties or out in weather that was not fit for flying looking for downed crews, those lads had a bloody thankless task. Also, you hear about the Battle of Britain lads but what about the night fighter crews ? As you say though, it ain't no vote winner..... DR

I dont think you are alone in your sentiments. Its nice that we are able to sit and swap opinions, stories and ideas. Lets not forget the price that was paid so long ago to allow us to do this. On a personal level i also think its time that the men (and women) of Bomber Command were properly recognised. DR

Berna, This is a view which over time, has to be expected and rightly so. However, a large majority of writers have produced books on Dresden and each author has tried to give his own slant on the proceedings. 20,30,40 and even 60 years after the event, people start to use previous writings as 'fact' despite them often being the personal view of an author. The facts however (from war diaries, logs, Red Cross figures etc of the time) show things in a different light. Firstly, the Germans were not a 'spent force'. Their land and air superiority may well have been such, but try telling the people in London and the south coast that the germans were 'spent' as hundreds died as the V-2's came over. Put yourself in the shoes of someone who's street has just been levelled and has lost many friends and members of your family.... On the dates of the main Dresden raid (12/13 Feb 45') 16 'V' weapons were fired and impacted on England. In March alone, an average of 10 V-2's were fired each day from the base at Statenkwartier. The V-2's didn't stop falling on England until nearly April 1945. In total, 1358 V-2 impacted on London and a further 44 on Ipswich and Norwich. This is NOT including V-1's..... The figures given as casulaties in Dresden are also wildly exaggerated. When interviewed, Albert Speer said that Goebbels told Hitler that the Dresden raid was an 'opportunity too good to miss' (There were a lot of POW's in the area and he saw it as a chance to indicate that the allies had scored an own goal) and he said that the figures of 15-25,000 dead (original German sources) would be announced as 150-250,000..... So called historians, eager to make a name for themselves have jumped onto this and are happy to quote figures (sometimes even more than this) which came from the head of Third Reich propaganda !! However, lets not forget, be it Dresden, Berlin, Hamburg, London, Coventry etc even a single life lost in war is a life too many. No one will ever know the true number, but educated guesses put the figure somewhere between 20 and 40,000 people lost their lives in Dresden over 3 days (not on a single raid as often reported) The single most evocative and lasting image to any member of Bomber Command who flew on these raids (and i have spoken to nearly a dozen) was the intensity of the fire storm. Thats what they remember most. Anyway, as i have said, one life lost is one too many but as far as history goes, factual history and not the history to make a name for ones self and a good profit on the way, the IWM researchers and various leading historians are trying to rectify a long and growing myth surrounding Dresden. By the way, the USAAF were due to bomb in daylight first, but bad weather prevented it so the RAF went in at night and the Americans followed up the day after. I wonder how 'history' would have been written if the original plan had gone ahead ?..... As for 'war crimes' ? Isn't any war a crime ? Regards, DR