SimonBrown

Kind of, but in a far less practical way I think. 4 cylinder Gardner in the X Craft I think. From what I have found out so far the 8-cylinder was a development to make the torpedo run faster - around 50 knots or so. Which for an underwater weapon is quite a feat. Designed for short burst of high speed and then bang, rather than long endurance.

Agreed, but the concept is so insane it is begging to be done.

Yes, this point had been bugging me too. Turns out there is a good reason. 4-stroke radials have an odd number to keep an every-other-piston firing order for smooth running. The 4 and 8 cylinder torpedo motors in this thread are 2-stroke diesel engines and have twice the number of power strokes per crankshaft revolution when compared to their 4-stroke cousins. More here at Wikipedia. Personally, I think an open pipe 8 cylinder 2-stroke compression ignition engine is going to sound awesome on full chat. The neighbours might not agree mind.

Yes, in a few minutes it was over. Amazing level of engineering for such a short time. We do know very torpedo built at Whiteheads was fired at least 4 times before being shipped to the customer, just to make sure it would function as intended. We have found a few in Weymouth Bay that went missing. All of them had lead segments replicating the weight of the warhead. That one is a real gem, and so far the only other 8-cylinder example I can find. Because of where it came from (Weymouth) we are pretty sure it came from the Whitehead Torpedo Works at Wyke. Whitehead were taken over by Vickers Armstrong and as far as I can tell work on an 8-cylinder engine started in 1938 and continued after the war. So current thinking is UK/experimental/test & development unit. I had not considered a captured/foreign unit, and is possible. Nor had I considered the nylocs being a recent(ash) edition. Some of the studs are not long enough to fully engage with the nylon insert, so thats a possibility too. There are a few documents to look up in the National Archives, so a trip is planned soon. And thanks for a clear and simple description of how and why it works the way it does Watercart - that was a big help in understanding some features I was scratching my head at. Nice find with the Japanese motor too - glad its been saved.

Oh yes, nice find - its a close match but the main body in that one is bronze/gunmetal and mine looks like steel. Plus it looks like the standard 21" 4 cylinder variant, whereas my beast has 8 cylinders.

Yes, compressed air, burner cycle with or without enriched O2,, HTP (High Test Peroxide) and electric are all examples of fuel used. I did have an electric Mk44 air dropped torpedo for a while and connected the motor up to a car battery to see if it was still viable. The contra rotating props worked a treat. But the missus drew the line at an intact, complete and functioning (less the warhead and original battery) torpedo in the garage, so it was donated to the local Sea Cadets who thought all their Christmas and birthdays had arrived at once, so it went to a good home.

Not strictly a vehicle, or even a vehicle part...but in absence of anywhere else I thought I would share the latest acquisition on HMVF - it may be of interest perhaps? Thanks to the generosity of a very good friend, I have acquired a vintage 8 cylinder radial engine that would have originally powered a torpedo. Its pretty much complete but a little scruffy. As just about every other British origin torpedo motor is a four cylinder radial arrangement, this eight cylinder version is - I suspect - a bit of a rare beast. It is most likely an experimental model and quite possibly originating from the Whitehead Torpedo factory in Weymouth. But as of now, its history and origins are unknown. One thing apparent is the the threads look like UNF and the nuts are nyloc variants, so the first obvious question is when was the nyloc nut invented? That would help with a date range, if nothing else. Will update the thread as restoration gets underway, but like most projects it won't be rushed. The intention is to make it a runner (heaven knows what fuel!) and possibly fit it into a Suzuki GS750 rolling chassis that might be available at some point.

Well if its in a lake, sounds like a nice dive & recovery project?

Every day, without even realising it, I draw on the skills my apprenticship instilled in me. There were times during the four years when I nearly threw in the towel and got another job, but I didn't and now reap the rewards. Nowadays I work firmly in what can only be described as the 'knowledge economy' and work with software and what can only be seen as abstract ideas. Looking from the world of RR CV12 rebuilds (Piston A1 serves as a pen holder on my desk) and Ferret fluid flywheel seal replacement the skills needed in the world of IT and massive data management seem irrelevant, but they are not. Logical and considered thought combined with analytical skills were embedded by the apprentice master as we diagnosed the root cause of why the Bedford MK was blowing engine oil on the workshop floor via the exhaust pipe (early turbo version with failed seals). We walked the path, thinking things through before touching the spanners knowing that when we did the minimum number of bolts would be removed to fix the part. Same with computers and software really. Learning a skill or a trade will always have crossover but this is completely overlooked by anyone looking from the outside. This lack of vision is indeed lamentable. Do I miss the spanners? Short answer is 'yes' and thats in part why I am here. I read the restoration pages and love to see the antics of others rebuilding things. When the time is right things will come full circle and a piece of wheeled (tracked...please say tracked...you know you want it...) military history will be acquired, of that I'm sure.

You might have already found this, but just in case here's a link: Alamy image

Over the past few years various members of HMVF have very kindly assisted Alex Mustard and myself in confirming the identity of the types of vehicles carried on the SS THISTLEGORM, a merchant vessel bombed at anchor in the Red Sea during October 1941. For this we are extremely grateful indeed as we are now able to state with some confidence what the ship was carrying at the time. A small team of us have been working on an iBook for the last 12 months or so, and the result is now published as a guide as to what can be seen, and where to see it: SS THISTLEGORM We are also grateful to Peter Gaine and Paul Burns for kindly supplying photographs of their Morris Commercial CS11/30 and Albion BY5 FBE respectively. The forum and its members are duly acknowledged for their assistance in the iBook.

Duplicate post.

They missed at least one, although the practice of tying a mooring line to the barrel has resulted in the nylon rope sawing its way through and shortening the gun. I have dived four of the tanks and there are 3D scans of them here: Valentine Tanks Studland Bay

Good question. A handwritten partial copy may have turned up but its not complete and has not been fully released for scrutiny by the chap who found it. In this case, it appears not unfortunately.

Not yet, no. The mystery object has remained exactly that...and left alone they have gone and bred another one at the back of hold No 2.

I have checked the Observers Fighting Vehicle Directory (what a gem!) and it says the 500 gallon variant appeared from 1943 onwards. The ship sank in 1941, thus could only have been loaded with 350 gallon tankers. So it will be a 350 gallon variant we seek - if one survives?

Thanks all - much appreciated. The Bedford OYC on the Thistlegorm was originally thought to be a petrol tanker, but evidence has been uncovered that questions that view - hence the request to see if there are any preserved examples to compare. As much as I would love to restore something like a Bedford, I fear other projects will keep me away from the spanners for a few years. One project I can now reveal is a book all about the SS Thistlegorm and her cargo is being worked on by the team ready for publication very soon. This forum has been particularly generous assisting Alex Mustard and, to a lesser degree myself, on vehicle identification. For this we are really grateful and is duly acknowledged. Being an iBook it means we can include the 3D models of the cargo and vessel such as these: 3D Models of the wreck and cargo

Does anyone know if a 1940's era Bedford OYC Water Carrier has survived and been preserved at all? Anyone know of a survivor or two?

Duplicate again...

There are just over 48 hours to run on our Kickstarter project and with just over £200 to go I think we will hit the target. The project is not just about finding the crash site. We have more leads to follow up since the publicity and will be heading to places and speaking to folks we never dreamed of when this started. If you have already backed us, then please accept my thanks and get ready to be part of a journey towards the truth. If you want to back the project in any way then please use the link:

Thanks for sharing that. Good to be reminded just what a great dive it was...mind you, I dived it in winter and it was -12 topside with a good 6" of snow on the banks. The lake had not frozen over but had to break ice to wade in. Getting out, my kit froze as stiff as a board in seconds. Character building stuff. Or mad. Whichever suits.

Yes, dived a few aircraft wrecks: Goodwin Sands Dornier before it was raised - that was in very good condition. Pair of Heinkel HE-115 in Trondheim - scuttled so in reasonably good nick. Grumman Wildcat in Scapa Flow. It fell off a carrier and would have been in good condition if a trawl had not gone through the tail section - 3D model of Scapa Wildcat P47-D Republic Thunderbolt in Weymouth Bay. Crashed on the 7th May 1944 but the cause of its loss is unknown. Pilot bailed out so we think this one went in very hard. 3D model shows fishing gear snags too - Weymouth Bay P47-D. The engine remains have been reduced to just the ferrous parts - Pratt & Whitney R2800 radial engine. P51-D Mustang in Portland Harbour. Still researching and diving this one, but we know it went in at a speed in excess of 450kts and the recovery operation picked up tin foil. The best underwater aircraft I have ever photographed was a Junkers 52 in Narvik. That one had landed on the frozen lake in 1940 during the German invasion and before it could fly out the ice melted. It was sitting on the lake bed on its undercarriage. Fresh water had helped preservation no end - it looked brand new. So the common thread amongst all of these, and how much is left of them, is two fold: How did it crash? Controlled ditching like the Dornier increase chances of an intact find whereas a high speed crash is like going into a shredder. What's happened since? Fresh water preserves airframes much better, but trawling and fishing gear snags will do no end of harm. If the Hercules is in pieces then that alone may well tell us something about its demise. We can almost guarantee it will have been snagged by a trawl at some point which won't help matters...but only when we find it can we start to look for answers. One thing in our favour: The Herc is designed for carrying cargo and landing on poorly prepared strips. Its a tough old bird in its own right. It will be very interesting to see what remains of a C-130 after 50 years.

Finger trouble - duplicate.

We are long way off the French coast and nowhere near their nuclear power station thankfully. The report of crashing near Alderney is not strictly accurate and a better description might be 'mid Channel'. Easy? No, otherwise it would have been done. We have spent 10 years on and off reducing the odds to a point they are very much in our favour.

We are quietly confident he didn't end up in Hurd's Deep. But yes, a former dumping ground for all sorts of nasties.