simon king

The alternative to strips of masking tape is Frisket Film = which can be bought on the roll from art shops. I used the interlocking metal stencils as a template to run a craft knife around the outline, but you can equally trace round a font sourced from the web. You're left with a low tack flexible stencil mask ready for paint

You can get interlocking stencil sets, like those shown in Wally's post at

http://www.eyreandbaxter.co.uk/

You don't say if you're spraying or brush painting and if you're using a BS381c colour. I tend to spray, and I've used paint from the BS381c standard palette (298 and 499) from Finishline in Donny and Autosupplies at Bolsover in the past. At the mo I prefer Autosupplies for a topcoat. I ask them for a very matt finish, although in reality it does come out with a slight sheen -which is a good balance between originality and durability. I'm sure most suppliers can match to a sample - although it can be a frustrating process at times.

So much depends on factors such as temperature, the amount and type of thinners, whether you cover, let it part-dry and then mist on a further light coat etc etc

The acquisition of Kelsey by Key has been cleared by the Competitions and Markets Authority.

https://www.gov.uk/cma-cases/key-publishing-limited-kelsey-publishing-s-aviation-and-military-history-portfolio

Thanks Simon,

 

I'll order a copy from somewhere but if you have one yourself just answer this simple question - why were RAF Type Numbers introduced?

It says................

"With Britain poised to invade the Continent, planning staffs were concerned with the logistic support for the venture. To facilitate the ordering of the correct spares for vehicles, when such a diversity of types with varying designations existed, it was decided early in 1944 to type number the various types of vehicles."

Don't know how that would work when you have something like a Bedford OY or Bedford QL though - both are Bedford Type 1300 so you would still need the original designation anyway.

Has anyone got a list of RAF Vehicle Type Numbers, that seem to be quite prevalent on RAF vehicles used from around 1944 to early post-war, especially so for 2nd TAF vehicles. These numbers were unique to a particular vehicle type and whatever RAF unit had them the Type number was always the same - if they bothered to display it!

 

BTW - there is some circumstantial evidence that for 2nd TAF RAF Jeeps that some carried Type 1900 on the bonnet / hood (on the left hand drivers side and the RAF vehicle serial on the other side of the bonnet. The photo of the Padre may be RCAF and connected with 401 Sqn RCAF but I'm trying to confirm if the white circle and 'I' marking seen on a few Jeeps is a 'Roman 1' and reference to their previous identity as 1 Sqn RCAF. Any photos of 2nd TAF Jeeps greatly appreciated, whatever the nationality of the unit.

You need to find a copy of "Wheels of the RAF" by Bruce Robertson, published by PSL in 1983. That has the fullest list of RAF type numbers that I have seen. Jeeps are Type 1900 however, and the Type 1300 QLs are quaintly referred to as 3-ton standard tenders.....

There one here for a fiver - and another for £176!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wheels-Royal-Force-Bruce-Robertson/dp/0850596246

I went for BS381c No 298 olive drab - as a readily availably proxy for SCC15 (the British version of olive drab but more green)- on the basis that the jeep was originally in the M150xxxx series of wartime REME or contractor rebuilds

http://milweb.net/classifieds/large_image.php?ad=76160&cat=1

Swedish Pbv 301 armoured personnel carrier I think - see http://www.achtungpanzer.com/swedish-tnh-variants.htm

Well after a viewing of 3 Jeeps over the weekend I have settled on one which is a 1943 willys mb. The owner is french and bought it to the uk with him. The only later hotchkiss parts fitted are a kph speedo which he said had to be fitted to register it in france, yellow headlights for the same reason and a solex carb.

 

It is still 6v, with no ignition key and a floor mounted starter.

 

So my questions are:

 

What size sockets and spanners will I need? Up until now I have only played with modern stuff so only really have metric.

 

Imperial

 

What do you do about modern fuels? Do you use any additives to replace the missing bits in unleaded?

Use an additive like Millers which also avoids your fuel going off

http://www.millersoils.co.uk/automotive/classic-fuel-additives.asp

 

I will need some rear shocks and springs, they have gone soft from sitting. where is the best place to get these?

 

Many suppliers - Jeeparts, Dallas Autos, Universal Jeep Supplies, Jeffrey Engineering to name but four - every jeep owner has their personal favourite - or mix and match

 

It is missing its data plate off the glove box (but it does have its willys data tag on the chassis). Can I get a replica replacement for this?

 

Robert at Dataplates4u in Holland is your man

 

The glove box is held shut with a cable tie. where can I get a replacement glove box catch?

 

see above

 

the catches on the bonnet to hold the winscreen when its folded are also mia. Again any good sources for replacement?

 

see above

 

The last thing for now is maintenance. Where can I get service and repair book and a parts book from? Anyone uploaded one online yet?

 

I am sure there will be more questions when I get it home, but that wont be for a few weeks as the previous owner is going to register it in the uk for me, as its still on its hand painted french numberplates.

 

"Go to" sites

 

http://jeepdraw.com/ (drawings, parts colours and manuals)

http://g503.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=4&sid=16200bfb897e797a113eb63ee33a06a6 (the fount of all technical knowledge)

 

Enjoy

 

Simon King

The Micky does look good , wasn't this introduced late 44 ?

Dave

Mickey Mouse was in use as early as September 1942. See the picture of Canadian jeeps being assembled and camouflage painted at Olympia, Manachester.

It was a variation of the formal Foliage pattern

sk

Hello Pete

 

No luck as yet , I'm off to quite a big Auto jumble on Saturday so I'll have a good rummage around and you never know I might just be lucky...........even one would do to start with .What I'm going to do when out on the road is hang a trailer board over the tail gate and discretely hide the socket underneath. As far as the reflectors on the rear I don't think they had them War time but possibly post war ..............someone on the forum will know for sure

 

Dave

Useful piece of legislation on vehicle lighting/reflectors etc to tuck away and consult as required

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989/1796/contents/made

Needed it to determine the lighting requirements for my trailer

sk

I thought Tempo, but then I wasn't so sure when I saw the VW badge - perhaps they used an early Beetle bootlid in it's restoration

http://www.rushlane.com/photos/how-did-this-1939-volkswagen-kubelwagen-reach-india-picture-18.html

Whatever it is I wonder how it arrived in India

sk

I had a boxed canvas made for my mortar trailer by Worthings some 25 years ago. The sides are too shallow compared with the drawings in the manual but back then I had nothing to go on. It can be seen in the background of my previous Brockhouse trailer photos. The lightweight trailers had a sheet canvas cover folded at the corners.

Thanks Tony - there is a reference in the databook of wheeled vehicles to the cover being deep enough to allow for stuff to be loaded 6" above the height of the sides - but that manual drawing does give a pretty good idea of the depth of the sides as well as the positioning of the eyelets. There don't appear to be any eyelets to keep the enveloped bits in place so I'm tending towards boxed.

It's just not clear if it's boxed or a flat sheet and all the wartime photos I've seen show it without a cover. At least I've now found someone who works in brown canvas (thanks Frank!) to match the SCC2 paint.

That lightweight trailer info will be useful for the Bronco 1/35th trailer as well - just wish the hooks had been done differently.

By the way, the new Windscreen has an interesting photo of some GS trailers adapted for use by telephone linesmen. The front "bay" has been boxed in and a lid fitted along with supports front and rear for poles. There seems to be a wooden block for a shovel bracket on the side which ties up with the crumbling remnants I found on mine. The bracket was salvageable

I am now looking to have a canvas cover made for the GS trailer, but I wonder what form it should be? Is it a flat sheet or is it boxed? I can't tell from this drawing from the manual although I tend to assume it is boxed.

Does anyone have a definitive answer?

Thanks

sk

Great thread, really interesting and as I start the restoration of my Mk1 10cwt I keep coming back to it. A couple of beginner questions though. What wood was used on the floor and sides? On mine it seems to have been plywood. And is there a way of identifying a maker? I will have to at some stage have a WD number on it as well as a plate so need to discover how to choose these as none exist that I have found so far.

Thanks

Nigel

Nigel,

There's a debate earlier in this thread about the wood used - I think it was often what could be obtained. I've used ash but others have used Keroin - not a wood I had heard of but certainly used by trailer manufacturers today.

There are some differences between manufacturers in addition to the dataplates. SS Cars/Jaguar built trailers seem to have curved back edges to the brackets for the handles on the neck - whereas others like Reynolds seem to have a straight edge. Other identifying features include

• cast or fabricated spring mounts,(Reynolds have "fabricated type" on the evidence of the record shots),

• pins or screw type locks for the support legs

• where these safety pins are attached to the frame

• whether or not there are safety hooks to keep the support legs in the "up" position

• the way in which the wood is affixed to the frame

• whether countersunk holes were filled or left

- the problem is that jury is still out on who did what, when and how. Add to that the general lack of original photgraphs and documentation on these trailers, and it becomes very much a case of contemporary photo interpretation. If we're lucky, manufacturers took "record shots" - for instance I have a set of three IWM photos which seem to be record shots of a Reynolds-built trailer - judging from the census number

As with jeeps, I suspect these trailers went through a wholesale rebuilding programme post war and nobody was too bothered about for instance keeping "Jaguar parts" for Jaguar trailers. As long as a spring hanger fitted, the type probably didn't matter.

What did interest me was the extent of the handbuilt nature of these trailers. The replacement tailgate irons I used would not fit and I had to weld up and redrill the holes for the hinge pins

Simon

Interesting development............................

https://www.gov.uk/cma-cases/key-publishing-limited-kelsey-publishing-s-aviation-and-military-history-portfolio

The first edition of the "new" CMV seemed pretty much the same to me - with just MMI reference added to the front cover. What do others think?

sk

just to add petrol to the fire, I read that there are two SCC2 shades-early and late. The late is matched to 499 Service Brown, I suspect that Mike Starmer's SCC2 is the early version. I think the mix was amended to provide a stronger contrast with the disruptive colours used

Anybody know of a source of brown canvas or a supplier of items in this colour suitable for someting painted in SCC2?

I suppose it must be the same sort of colour as the original Humber sidescreens for jeeps

Thanks

sk

brass or zinc? As well as being made of steel the OE plates have only two fixing holes which I suppose could be another way in helping to determine the manufacturer from the remaining holes left in the drawbar.

It's brass - but apparently left uncoated so it patinates naturally.

I seem to have collected photos from the net of dataplates for these trailers - OEC also used cast brass plates......

Preumably it's an early vs. late thing

There are more variations in these trailers than I expected. SSC built trailers have curved rear edges to the neck handle brackets whilst other manufactures seemed to use angular edges. They're also constructed differently with the carriage bolt going in from the inside of the body, a hex nut on the outside and the countersink then filled flat - which is fine until you need to replace a plank.................

Other manufacturers seemed to be more practical and put the carriage bolt in from the outside, nut inside, and left the countersink unfilled. I suppose it had something to do with the fact that SSC had been a coachbuilder

I am about to drill the holes for the pins in the tubular support legs. Is it possible that someone could measure the distance of the holes for the "up" and "down" pins from the ground for me please. Otherwise I'll have to try scaling from photos.

For anyone with an SS Cars built trailer, Robert at Dataplates4U can supply reproduction plates from stock. Looking at surviving plates, on Jaguar-built GS trailers, it seems that the four digit chassis number is linked to the "last three" of the census number

there's a picture of one of these trailers in use on the flightline at RAF Valley with a line-up of Gnats in the book "Wheels of the RAF" published by Patrick Stevens Limited. It is referred to as a "Bristol Siddeley" trailer

At our crank-up at Thoresby Hall this year I was chatting with an elderly gentleman with a slight foreign accent who was interested in the jeeps we had brought. During our conversation it transpired he was a member of the Belgian SAS who had fought in the armoured jeeps. He had stayed in this country after the war.

It's often surprising the unexpected people you meet when you display vehicles to the public. Sadly I didn't take any contact details.

Wouldn't it be sensible to consolidate Artillery Museums at the Royal Armouries' Fort Nelson site which seems under-utilised? Wouldn't the money from the sale of the Woolwich site build something appropriate on the Fort Nelson parade ground which could also replace the temporary tents there. Portsmouth has HMS Victory/HMS Warrior/Mary Rose/Submarine Museum/D_Day Museum etc etc so footfall shouldn't be too bad.

sk

Looks as if the Landfall has been raised this week and will move to Portsmouth for restoration.

Another question - I wonder if anyone can help?

Most of the stock pictures of the 10cwt GS trailers show countersink holes in the top rubbing strips and middle stanchion filler strips where the carriage bolts are inserted "from the outside". However - was this done by all manufacturers?

I ask because the rotting wooden parts I received with the trailer seem to have the carriage bolts inserted from the inside with the resultant hole for the nut being subsequently filled with a stopper of some sort. See below picture:

This seems to tie up with a shot I captured from a BBC D-Day programme which seems to show "smoothed" rails and stanchion filler strips

Does this seem right? - or am I seeing things?

Thanks

Edit - in the absence of additional information, I decided to go with the evidence I had to hand in the old wooden sections. I therefore filled the holes once the nuts were tightened. I was lucky to find a local blacksmith who straightened up the ironwork for me.

The small plate is for the axle/tail-light switch and the tail-light itself. I'm using a Butler light pending discovery of a Lucas example. It's not original - but a bit of imagineering based on what they did with the switch on jeeps

Finished the sides and headboard as well this week. Just now need to add the rubbing strip around the top - which I think is intended to protect the canvas cover from wearing

getting there

sk