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Sean N

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Posts posted by Sean N

  1. It might also be that the quoters aren't aware that you can delete images or bits and pieces from within a quote.

     

    Still, I suspect discussing quoting in a restoration thread might be taking things off topic...

     

    On the data plates, personally I like to see these 'tangents' discussed in such a thread. It makes the topic more interesting and alive, is relevant to the topic, exposes me to techniques and information that I might not know about, and potentially feeds new information and techniques back to the original poster, in this case the Goslings. Everyone benefits.

  2. It absolutely baffles me why things like this are still being turned into cans and why there is no interest in these sort of things from the major museums, who must surely have been aware of the situation and you would think have the clout to get them saved and the contacts to get them moved.

     

    If they did not want the vehicles themselves, they might have been able to help out other museums or collectors, perhaps exchanging them for parts they do want.

     

    For me, it's particularly important that specialist vehicles like these are saved. It's ironic that the specialist equipment tends to survive longer than the runs of the mill in service, yet tends to get converted back to the run of the mill or destroyed once out of service. Equipment such as this is just as important as gun tanks in telling the history.

     

    Absolutely full marks for effort, Rick - a brave attempt.

  3. Go for it. If the tanks can't be saved, at least there's potential to make a significant difference to the restoration of 3 - 5 other Churchills. It didn't look as though they were that far into cutting them so there's a good chance there's at least piles of major units still there, if not complete vehicles.

     

    Worth working on from two angles - see if you can get an approach through IWM, Tank Museum, Disposals Agency or other UK sources, while at the same time tackling the relevant director at the scrapyard to see if you can identify and break down the obstacles, plus maybe promise them good publicity as well?

     

    Good luck with it.

  4. Rick, I don't think you can or should kick yourself. You made a 27 hour trip at short notice to try to rescue these things, motivated not by profit but by a desire to see things preserved. Not many would have done that. Once there you did what you could with the restrictions you had.

     

    It's highly likely, as Richard and a couple of others have suggested, and as you guessed at early on, that the scrap dealer's contract specified that they had to reduce the vehicles to scrap and that once senior management got wind of a potential breach of that contract, they put a stop to it.

     

    I don't see that threatening them would have achieved anything - you always get more out of people if you work with them (I realise you're just expressing your frustrations). The one thing you might be able to do is contact the relevant director in person and establish in a constructive way what the obstacle is and whether there is any way round it. However they may well feel reducing the vehicle to parts isn't enough and releasing said parts would jeopardise their scrap contract.

     

    I don't know whether going to the press or politicians at this point might help save what's left or would just put people's backs up.

     

    I think one problem these days is not only arms limitations and demilitarisation laws but also paranoia about liability. Frequently we see usable equipment and vehicles, including historically important ones, destroyed because of largely unwarranted concerns about liability if something goes wrong.

     

    Reading the topic I didn't see where the Tank Museum came in or whether they actually had been offered the vehicles - you suggest later they had. As one guy they may well not have contacted you anyway, even if they did think of it. I have to say, it's my experience that museums (with one or two exceptions) are generally fairly blinkered and are not necessarily good guardians of the nation's heritage, sad though that is to say.

     

    Either way, as Jack says it's frustrating that important and irreplaceable pieces of history are consigned to the scrap heap almost without thought. Personally, I think it's almost worse with vehicles like this; specialist vehicles are often not considered glamorous and don't attract the attention gun tanks might, but they're just as important in telling the story.

     

    However I think you're right; the way to prevent this kind of thing in future is to intercept them before they ever get to the scrap yard, or even classified as scrap. Perhaps setting up some sort of formal clearing house for unwanted tanks and parts, and getting the relevant people - the decision makers and those with direct responsibility - in the MoD, the Disposals Agency, the German defence ministry and museums onside and aware you're doing this might be a way forward, for future cases at least.

     

    If I can help with that in any way let me know.

  5. TK and MK 4 speed box are effectively the same

    (provided the TK is not a 214 petrol or early 200 diesel, if I remember right)

     

    TK 5 speed boxes can be made to fit but you may have to shorten the prop.

     

    Part compatibility with Goddesses is limited depending what parts you want (and it'd be a shame to break up a Goddess). Goddess gearbox would have to be modified to fit.

  6. I think before you do anything you should contact Auto Sparks and check this. It may be an error has been made. It would be very unusual to either not follow the original factory colours for a coded loom, or not to label or identify the cabling for a single colour loom.

     

    No point in spending time tracing wires if it's their error, or at least something they can help with.

  7. Terry, I'm no expert on Ferret and someone like Richard F will probably advise, but in my experience B series engines have a tendency to backfire due to (excess) fuelling on the over-run. Checking the timing is certainly worthwhile, but my first thought was I wonder if the mixture is a touch rich?

  8. 'One easy motion' might be pushing it! Several pumps more like it, even with a quick lift jack. In my experience the quick lift or 'rocket' jacks often only take the arm to the point of contact quickly and then can be heavier to pump than normal ones as you're trading mechanical advantage for speed of lift. Don't forget if your diffs aren't central on the axle you may find it difficult to lift evenly on a trolley jack anyway.

     

    I would not mess about with any of the consumer market jacks with small pads and pressed side members - they may claim to be 3 tonnes (or even more), but aren't really beefy enough or big enough to be stable and reliable. Get something with a good wide heavy duty chassis, wide wheels and track and a large saddle.

     

    As Richard says, a long chassis is useful to get under vehicles without having to grub around on the floor or risk not having enough movement on the handle.

     

    Make sure what you get has enough lift - you can find even long chassis jacks have very short lift arms so you'll struggle to get a large vehicle off the ground sufficiently. Conversely, don't forget to check that it's low enough to get under the vehicle / axle in the first place!

     

    I'd have thought 3 tonnes would be the minimum you would want to give yourself a margin and make lifting fairly easy - the less 'industrial strength' the jack is, the more marginal it will be and the harder you'll have to pump even if it claims to be the same capacity.

     

    Most professional jacks have the release valve operated by the lift handle which is much easier than a separate release.

     

    If you're worried about the paint on your axles get a rubber saddle pad.

     

    If you're buying from one of the large tool suppliers (Sealey et al), remember they regularly have this sort of thing on offer. Don't buy Snap-On - their jacks are the same as other people's at three times the money.

     

    For the new cost of a decent Chinese made jack from the likes of Sealey you may find you can buy a good second-hand or MoD surplus unit made by the likes of Epco or one of the other traditional workshop equipment suppliers. If you can, and it's genuinely sound, get it - you won't regret it - everything about them is so much better quality.

     

    In my experience trolley jacks are really workshop equipment only and best on good hard (concrete) floors. The wheels can tend to sink into tarmac. If you're jacking away from the workshop, forget the trolley jack - get bottle jacks instead, with good plates or blocks to spread the load.

  9. "in the case of a motor vehicle, that it is so constructed as to be capable of attaining a speed of 25 miles per hour on the level under its own power, when unladen and not drawing a trailer"

     

    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1980/66/schedule/4

     

    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1982/1163/contents/made

     

    You can however be fined for driving too slowly if it's perceived that you are a hazard to other road users. It's probably unlikely that would happen with a vehicle that was incapable of going faster - though they might tell you to get the heck off their motorway!

  10.  

    I will say I'm looking forward to less of the "old tank smell" around the shop. A lot like the bilge of an old wooden boat: take the dirt from a few continents, spill a bunch of old gas onto it, add some lubricating oil and a dash of sweat, next get plenty of rainwater in so things can rot or rust as their nature dictates. Close up the hatches and wait

     

    Got used to that smell, with added bilge, recommissioning our M2 bridging rig - or should I say never got used to it!

  11. Generally the advice is to use acid etch primer on aluminium, and be very thorough in the cleaning and de-greasing, otherwise you can get problems with coat adhesion.

     

    I've tended to use two pack etches in the past, from Trimite or Cromadex. You'd put a conventional primer over, then build up the topcoats.

  12. Use a reputable make.

     

    Use the performance specification that was roughly current when your vehicle was built.

     

    Use the oil grade that is specified in the manual.

     

    Don't use EP if a non-EP oil is specified, or particularly a non-EP where an EP is specified.

     

    Note that the W.D. / M.o.S. / M.o.D. sometimes harmonised oil specs for convenience.

     

    Steer clear of long involved debates about EP additives and yellow metals - if in doubt, ask the oil manufacturer.

     

    I've tended to use Morris when I can and never had a problem, and they've been very helpful.

  13. ... and yes I do know that a Shielder is not a Spartan.

     

    ???

     

     

     

     

    Correct - as per construction and use regs albeit that a tractor in the minds of the public has everything to do with farms, having said that I've only heard of one Ferret hauling anything.

     

    Diana

     

    Sorry, I read you as talking about agricultural tractors.

     

     

    Antony, a 'tractor' is just a vehicle that's designed to pull something - agricultural tractors are just a specialist version. A 'motor tractor' in the Ferret etc. sense is a heavy haulage vehicle of a certain weight.

  14. Hi Sean

     

    Yes I have looked at that. As with anything DVLA/DVSA there is a certain amount of who interprets it and how.

     

    I personally don't see as a goods vehicle in the traditional sense, even more so as I don't want to be restricted by goods vehicles weight limits.

     

    I can't put it down as Historic like it seems a lot of tracked vehicles end up as.

     

    That brings me back to PLG - What is the definition of a motor car? Again in the traditional sense probably not a Shielder. But is does also say 'vehicles used for "private" (non-trade or business) purposes' OR Vehicles registered on or after 01/03/01 that do not come in to the scope of the first six tax classes, listed below (Petrol Car, Diesel Car, Alternative Fuel Car, Light Goods Vehicle, Euro 4 Light Goods Vehicle or Euro 5 Light Goods Vehicle)

     

    The second reply down on this link http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?41589-Registering-a-CVRT-Sabre/page2 the chaps Spartan came back as PLG which weighs a little more than a Shielder.

     

    I am waiting to hear from my local MVT to come out to verify it for me, hopefully they will have some input.

     

    Antony

     

    Unfortunately, what you see it as doesn't matter - it's a question of what it is, or what DVSA / VOSA / HM Constabulary see it as.

     

    Spartan is a distraction as although it's CVR(T) based, it's a different body type - it might not look it, but as a 7 seater it's essentially an MPV!

     

    I started to write a long answer here based on my understanding and previous experience, but at the end of the day I'm not a road traffic lawyer and there are a number of reasons not to get into too in depth a discussion here, not least that Jack would prefer we didn't.

     

    At the end of the day, it's your call. My advice would be:

     

    Read Construction and Use (http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/contents/made), the Road Traffic Act (http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/contents) and any other necessary legislation and guidance.

     

    Don't confuse what you think it ought to be and what it really is. A goods vehicle is a 'motor vehicle constructed or adapted for the carriage of goods or burden'. Shielder is designed as a load carrier. Draw your own conclusions.

     

    Don't confuse taxation class (essentially, what it's used for) with design (essentially, what it is) - the two inform each other, but aren't necessarily the same. For example, a Bedford MJ can be taxed private if it's used privately, but that doesn't make it any less a goods vehicle as far as driver licencing is concerned.

     

    Take legal advice if necessary.

     

    Be prepared to do something - change the body, fit equipment - to make it not a goods vehicle if you need to.

     

    Lots of people have registered lots of things as vehicle types or in taxation classes which sometimes stretch the definitions to breaking point. They may get away with it or they may not. Whether you do the same is up to you.

     

     

    Ferret and a Spartan The Ferret is classed as a tractor - but that doesn't mean it is an agricultural vehicle, personally speaking the rules are not fit for purpose as some true agricultural vehicles can go these days at up to 60MPH, things have moved on - which is a lot faster than some car drivers do.

     

    Diana

     

    I understood 'Tractor' as it applies to Ferret meant a 'Motor Tractor' i.e. a haulage vehicle, not an agricultural tractor.

  15. Make sure you're not confusing revenue weights, unladen weights and gross weights (doesn't sound as though you are, but plenty do)

     

    3.5 tonnes gross for PLG only applies if it's a goods vehicle (which strictly speaking, Shielder is, being an HMLC) - if it's not a goods vehicle, weight doesn't matter for PLG.

     

    If you're using it 'as is' privately, Private HGV sounds like the correct taxation class - it is, after all, a goods vehicle being used privately. I don't know how things work for what is effectively a tracked HGV though.

     

    Normally the only way to take a goods vehicle out of the goods vehicle taxation classes is to make it not a goods vehicle by some sort of permanent modification.

     

    Have you looked at V355/1?

     

    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/360119/V355X1_140714.pdf

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