Sean N

Never mind the railway wagons, Willowbrook bodied Bedford VAS - or is the second one an Alexander body?

This sort of nonsense happens whether you keep things under your hat or not - you can't guarantee the other side of the deal isn't talking. Best just to do what you've got to do and not get wound up about it.

Lizzie, you'll know this already, but if you're scanning this stuff do it as high quality and large as possible, subject to going OTT, even if it takes longer. You won't want or possibly be able to go back and do it again, so it's one of those do it once and do it right things.

Oh - and post them here every time.

Well' date=' would you believe it? We have a new comment on this exciting and captivating thread![/quote']

 

Well, Magnakater sadly is playing doggo, not even answering PMs, and as no one else is playing (not even AndyB anymore),

Well, I think we are all waiting for you to post more!

I suspect they are all playing silly b****rs for the Pioneer photo given the sign and the fact one of them seems to be inflating the tyre by the power of lungs alone!

Two Mk2 Hippos in the background

.

Apparently the plates are worth a few bob ect.

Only if you MoT it, I think. As it stands I don't think you can transfer them.

...there's how many of these in the world, half dozen?

Possibly not even that. I can only think of the Bovington one that came from the same hole and the two bridgelayers in Oz.

The first image looks (to me, on a calibrated monitor) grey with a blue tint, while the second looks greenish but is clearly sky blue with a green tint rather than eau-de-nil

I determined TDC by the "see when the piston stops moving"; normally I'd do this with a piece of wire through the spark-plug hole, but since I was laying underneath the truck, turning the engine over by the flywheel, I used my little inspection camera through the spark-plug hole and watched for the piston stopping... splitting the difference between rising and descending.

Good try but that'll be where your 10 - 15 degrees has gone. The piston travel is so small close to dead centre that you can't reliably determine exact dead centre by eye.

The normal way of doing it, if you have to, is to mark piston position either side of dead centre at a point much further down the stroke (where the piston travel is much larger for each degree of crank rotation) and then split the difference. Even then, it's difficult to do by eye, particularly through the spark plug hole, and I'd normally expect with this method to use a dial gauge to determine piston position for accuracy.

A thought had crossed my mind, actually... the timing pointer on the underside of the engine, was it offset to one side slightly -- i.e. not exactly 180° to the timing window at the top? Could it be an older engine, refurbished, and with the flywheel turned 180° to make the timing mark line up with the window in the clutch housing; or am I dreaming up nonsense?

I don't know about nonsense but I think you are overthinking it. Unless you can demonstrate that the wrong parts are on the engine I would assume that the timing marks on the flywheel and casing are correct to start with, get the right condenser, get the points set up and time to the marks, then see how it's behaving at that.

To narrow it down, I tried just fitting the clamp alone; and that was getting smacked about by the points cam. I don't think I have the condenser that was on the truck when I got it, any more, but off the top of my head it had a smaller diameter.

Oh, OK. Sounds like the wrong condenser supplied.

At this point, you could probably tell me it's running backwards and it wouldn't surprise me all that much. :rotfl:

 

I'm going to check that I don't have a fuel related malady somewhere; it'll probably turn out that all my trouble since I sorted the leaking gasket, is down to me kinking or pinching the fuel hose to the carb, or something. :n00b:

 

I swear, it did run last night...

Didn't someone say upthread that most fuel problems are ignition problems, or was it the other way round?

Clive, exactly so. The light source - whether that be natural light, flash, workshop lighting, whatever - changes the white balance and therefore the appearance of colours - and that's only the start of it!

Is that generator sky blue in real life?

I think that's definitely the case; to muddy the waters further, the sky blue is (to me) really obviously sky blue when new, and I would say is definitely blue not greenish in colour, but ages greener; while the eau-de-nil ages to a lighter colour closer to an aged sky blue!

I did a Google image search to see if I could find any good examples for this discussion; I didn't really come up with anything reliable, but did see a couple of photos of LandRover engines which were said to be, and I think must have been from my experience, sky blue - but looked distinctly green in the photos.

Hi Richard, yes; I think the question is more how these things appear on screen and how the paint ages rather than what eau-de-nil and sky blue look like new in the flesh. That engine in your link is definitely eau-de-nil on my screen.

Took it to TDC on No. 1, and marked the flywheel against the notch in the viewing window. It looks like #1TDC is about 10~15 degrees* after the U.C. marking on the flywheel. * (Total wild-ass guess. not measured it to find out. It's definitely after, though.)

Tamber, I'm not sure I believe this. How are you determining TDC? The flywheel is held on by six bolts, so assuming the flywheel was correct originally and it's not on correctly it must be at least 60 degrees out if it's out at all. Moreover, if I remember correctly there are also two dowels, which would mean even if the dowels are the same and equally spaced, it can only be right or 180 out.

Distributor cap was off while I was doing this, to check that I was definitely coming up on the compression stroke for #1. (Didn't want to take the rocker-cover off and have to re-seal it.)

Not wanting to teach you to suck eggs, but you can also insert a plug loosely or put a thumb over the hole while you (get a mate to) turn the engine so you can hear or feel it compressing.

Now, both the modern replacement condensers I got for this -- one that I got a while back, and one that I got along with the new points -- were physically larger than the one that originally came out; so they won't go back in without fouling the points cam.

It's a long while since I fitted a condenser to a Delco distributor, but if I recall correctly the condenser will slide in its clamp, and if it's in the wrong position it will foul. I may be misremembering though, or that may not be the problem.

Rasm-frasm. Clearly, I jinxed myself. Doesn't want to start, now, and when it does start; it only runs with throttle at least halfway open, or it just ... slows... and... sputters... .... to a halt. Oh, and if I keep the throttle held open so it runs, eventually it scares the bejeezus out of me with an almighty bang from the tailpipe, and then usually stops anyway.

Timing wrong ... ?

Richard,

I bow to your vastly superior experience. To be honest, now you make me think about it I'm not sure I'm remembering right.

I noted the engine colour when I went to look at it, thinking of this discussion, but I should have reported it immediately I returned. I may be remembering wrong, perhaps led astray by the photo (not withstanding what I say below!). At least I'm not sure enough of my ageing memory to stick to my guns, so I'll withdraw this as a data point!

Clive,

It looks eau de nil on this screen, but I'm not sure I'd set too much store by looking at images on a computer (despite what I've said immediately above). There's too much opportunity for the colours to be wrong; camera calibration, white balance, colour gamuts, screen calibration and so on.

I might try to get a couple of images of known colours so we can see what each other is seeing, as it were.

Hi Richard,

I went to see the truck. Certain it was Eau-de-Nil. It is a 214 though!

Would the rebuild date always be the same as the preserved date? I know little of the meaning of these stencils.

Another data point - Eau-de-Nil (presumably replacement) engine in the 1952 Bedford OLBC tanker sold by Bovington

The factory method for setting the timing is using a light. I'm pretty sure (without looking it up) that the advance curves don't start until above idle so you're OK to time using a light, though blanking the vacuum off never hurts. If you're unsure, time it static.

You can fit a 330 diesel almost as a straight swap, and they were a factory option for civilian models. Plenty of other engines will fit, but with varying degrees of modification needed. That 300 petrol is such a lovely engine though...

Neils,

I can't point you at an O type tractor unit, unfortunately. I do know of a couple, but they would not be for sale. However, they do come up now and again - occasionally even examples for restoration, though these are getting increasingly few and far between. I would think it's a matter of keeping an eye on the usual sources to see what turns up.

Have they contacted other museums who might have information or sources, such as IWM, RAF Museum or Bovington?

If I remember rightly, there is a lot of difference between the truck chassis and the tractor chassis, which might make it impractical to convert a truck.

Somewhere I have an original book of Bedford drawings for the tractor, though I have a feeling it is for the Scammell coupling version not the fifth wheel version; I will try to dig it out and have a look.

Several Crossleys have come up recently and been discussed on this forum, and I think there were a couple for sale though in extremely poor condition. It would be worth doing a search here to see what you can find. Here are a couple to get you started:

http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?54107-Crossley-Q-Type-Chassis-%A31000-(nr-Bristol)

http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?19324-Crossley-Q-type-4x4

I have to say I thought that one in the Carlton Colville photo looked metal.

Sounds a lot easier though - thin wall tube and solder?

Marco,

I'm not clear; are you building these cranes, or just operating and maintaining them? If you are building them, it might be time for a redesign as these are now very old parts!

A possible reason there are two numbers engraved on one of the crownwheels is that they were sold as a pair with the pinion, usually under a collective part number for both parts; for example, the part number for a K9 CWP pair is K2-430.

I notice that both new and old have 1K7013 on, and that the ratio is 7/41, which is the correct ratio for a K9; so it may be that a K9 CWP will fit your existing housings. However, as you know it's possible to have the same ratio and yet be totally different parts. Do you have any dimensions?

It would also be interesting to know your supplier's involvement and where he is (or was) sourcing parts from - presumably he has none and can't get any now?

It might be worth talking to BMC Trucks in Turkey, who used to make Austin / Morris / BMC trucks under licence. It's possible they made these axles much more recently and may have more information.

The next time I am at the workshop I will look to see what K9 differentials I have.

Must have been good - I went into Smith's thinking I'd buy a CMV for the first time in a good few years and there were none to be had!

Hello Marco,

These are Austin, definitely, you can tell by the part numbers e.g. 11K7384, 1K7013. However I do not think they are K9 as the design is not the same. The K9 differential carrier is angled, so the gasket face is at 45 degrees to the axis of the pinion shaft, and the pinion shaft enters the housing very near to one edge, not centrally as this one.

I also can't get the part numbers to match K9 parts, and I'd have to check, but I don't remember K9 parts being MOWOG branded as these are - that happened some time after the merger with Morris.

I think these differentials are from a later Austin truck, possibly the Series 3 but more likely something BMC built from the 1960s like the WE, WF, FE, FF, FG, FH, FJ or even the Leyland Terrier; and probably the heavier weight models as I seem to remember the smaller trucks had Morris style axles.

The Tube for the wires will want some thought. The original one on the Dennis was made of a Cardboard type of material ... the cardboard was obviously sealed and painted and has been fine in service. What we do for this one has yet to be decided...

Papier mache? Would be easy to do, easily mouldable and if made with the right glue and sealed would be just as resistant and mechanically strong. You could make up some bucks out of dowel or tube which you could arrange so they could be pulled apart to get them out of the finished tube. Alternatively, plastic pipe cut and glued - you could use filler to reproduce any curves etc. and might be able to flare it by warming and moulding gently? More difficult to paint though.

Wot 'retriever' says. As the firing order is 1 5 3 6 4 2, 1 and 6 are at TDC at the same time, so it's just a matter of which one's on the compression stroke. Easy for plug leads to be swapped around etc. and not unknown for assembly mistakes to be corrected on the leads, particularly since on some vehicles no. 1 is flywheel end.

This is a Delco distributor:

This is a Lucas distributor (though I don't think the right one for your vehicle, but similar):

The cap clips are one easy way of telling them apart.

If you have a dwell meter, setting average dwell not points gap is one way.

Marco,

Austin K9s are quite commonplace but there are not as many scrap ones around as there used to be.

Is it the differential itself or the housing you need?

I may have one, I will have to look. I know I have some axles but I don't know how many and I would like to keep spares for our K9s.

I'd be interested to see photos of your cranes if you have any.

Hi Tamber, glad to hear you're making progress.

The U|C mark is TDC, the ball is the timing mark.

It could be that it's been timed to 6 instead of 1 - you can check by popping the distributor cap off and checking what cylinder the rotor is pointing to when you have it on the timing mark.

You can set the timing static to see what's going on, and if needs be pull the rocker cover off to check which cylinder is on compression (though that will mean buying a new rocker cover gasket)

My experience is that the Lucas distributor in early engines is more reliable than the Delco distributor in later vehicles. The Delco is prone to wear in bushes or cam lobes causing variable dwell (points gap). However, they can be made to run well even with worn distributors.

If you have been doing a lot of idling and moving around in low gear cold they do go through fuel very quickly...