montie

Hi Richard, I was planning to go camping this weekend but too many unforeseen had us cancel. This gives me time again to have a closer look at the problem. Here are pics of the tool for the reduction box.

Hi guys, Something that came past me via e-mail and I can't resist adding it to the post. I copied it from the mail for your benefit. If any of you have ever been to a military funeral in which 'The Last Post' was played; this brings out a new meaning of it. Here is something everyone should know. Until I read this, I didn't know, but I checked it out and it's true: We have all heard the haunting song, 'The Last Post.' It's the song that gives us the lump in our throats and usually tears in our eyes. But, do you know the story behind the song? If not, I think you will be interested to find out about its humble beginnings. Reportedly, it all began in 1862 during the American Civil War, when Union Army Captain Robert Ellicombe was with his men near Harrison's Landing in Virginia . The Confederate Army was on the other side of the narrow strip of land. During the night, Captain Ellicombe heard the moans of a soldier who lay severely wounded on the field. Not knowing if it was a Union or Confederate soldier, the Captain decided to risk his life and bring the stricken man back for medical attention. Crawling on his stomach through the gunfire, the Captain reached the stricken soldier and began pulling him toward his encampment. When the Captain finally reached his own lines, he discovered it was actually a Confederate soldier, but the soldier was dead. The Captain lit a lantern and suddenly caught his breath and went numb with shock. In the dim light, he saw the face of the soldier. It was his own son. The boy had been studying music in the South when the war broke out. Without telling his father, the boy enlisted in the Confederate Army. The following morning, heartbroken, the father asked permission of his superiors to give his son a full military burial, despite his enemy status. His request was only partially granted. The Captain had asked if he could have a group of Army band members play a funeral dirge for his son at the funeral. The request was turned down since the soldier was a Confederate. But, out of respect for the father, they did say they could give him only one musician. The Captain chose a bugler. He asked the bugler to play a series of musical notes he had found on a piece of paper in the pocket of the dead youth's uniform. This wish was granted. The haunting melody, we now know as 'The Last Post' used at military funerals was born. The words are: Day is done. Gone the sun. From the lakes From the hills. From the sky. All is well. Safely rest. God is nigh. Fading light. Dims the sight. And a star. Gems the sky. Gleaming bright. From afar. Drawing nigh. Falls the night. Thanks and praise. For our days. Neath the sun Neath the stars. Neath the sky As we go. This we know. God is nigh I too have felt the chills while listening to 'The Last Post' but I have never seen all the words to the song until now. I didn't even know there was more than one verse . I also never knew the story behind the song and I didn't know if you had either so I thought I'd pass it along. I now have an even deeper respect for the song than I did before. Remember Those Lost and Harmed While Serving Their Country. Also Remember Those Who Have Served And Returned; and for those presently serving in the Armed Forces.

Hi Richard, I have stripped off the hub cap from the reduction hub. There is no evidence of any metal particles in the oil that was drained off. Also when turning (rotating) the wheel, one can hear the motion being transfered, the sound of items grounging elsewhere at/in the body and not in the reduction hub. I have also made up the tool as shown in the Unit repairs Technical handbook in anticipation of having had to strip the reduction box assembly. I think your suggestion that it might be a tracta fork (one of four per wheel station?) or a tracta joint that is broken up, is on the nose. The exploded drawings I got from Oily shows the parts of the bevel box. Maybe there are additional drawings for the parts (Tracta forks) in question?

Hi Richard, Haven't gotten round to trying that. Access is a wee bit difficult. Surely the pinion itself could not be turning alone. There is evidence of damage to the bearing cage though and the pinion did move longitudinally (maybe 1/4 inch or so) before dismanteling. The exploded drawings from Oily is a big help, it does add more questions though, like for example, if the crown wheel turns, what else could be sheared off?

Continued from previous post. Some more details from the Saracen. The Gilmer belt set-up on the fans, alternator and pumps. The watertanks as added, One on each side on the rear. The water trap and watersensor in the fuel supply line. The engine controls and instruments. The air cleaner set-up. Not working on the GT40 as can be seen by the mess in the garage! Till later.

Hi guys, Just an update. The R/h front bevel box was stripped in situ. The results was not as bad as I expected! These machines are durable! Next question, how on earth did the pinion rotate so freely( really!) if only one tooth is broken? The front wheel was not lifted or turned.

Hi guys, I think this question I have absolutely fits this topic. I can get hold of a Bedford flatnose 4x4 truck very cheap. It was bound to be cut up as scrap metal and I can't allow that! It's mass plate states around 8500 kg's, it has no engine, gearbox or loadbed. It has the cab with windows, chassis, axles, wheels with fair tyres, transferbox with all propshafts, airbrakes or air-assist, I'm not sure. It appears that the motor and gearbox was removed for whatever reason and then towed to the scrap-metal dealer to be cut up. We used to have similar trucks when I was an infantery soldier in the late 70's in the South African Army but have very little knowledge on these trucks. I saw, when searching about that one gets MJ, MK and TK versions. Can anybody give me a quick breakdown of these vehicles and the different models? I really would like to know what I am getting into. Dang, and I am still busy with the Saracen! I will look for more particulars on my next visit but it will rather be to remove the vehicle from site before somebody goes crazy with a cutting torch! I saw an ad in a national newspaper for one in a fair condition with dropside loadbed for R 20 000.00 (about 1 700 British pounds) Maybe less trouble? About the "Hi guys", I have been wondering for some time, are there any female members on the forum? Just curious.

Hi Matt, You are a star! I got the E-mail as well, the pictures are excellent, I'm busy downloading it and will make copies to add to my meager (but growing, thanks to you!) collection of info. Now down to some serious studying of these pics!

Hi all, Here are some pics of the work over the weekend. My brother-in-law came to visit and together we tackled the bevelbox. We decided against stripping out the steering assembly, opting to cut the panel above the gearbox to allow access. Two small strategic cuts were made in the panel and on refitting it, it will be Tig welded up and treated for corrosion. This gave us enough room to work. The rear colllar came off easily but the front one took a lot of persuasion to remove. This front bevel box has a very large amount of play on the stiub axle and the stub can be easily turned by hand, confirming earlier suspisions that it is totally U/S! The Centre box front oil seal was removed and inspected, indeed showing that a lot of wear and no lip evident any more. It has now been replaced thanks to the seal size given by Robert. Turning our attention to the R/H Centre wheel reduction hub, inspections revealed that the bearing cage has been rubbing againt the hub cap. A very good flush and a new bearing should sort the problem on this wheel. Research on the Internet for bearing cross reference part numbers showed that a lot of manufacturers carry this bearing (RMS 10). Upon phoning the first Bearing company, I was told that they have one bearing in stock! At a price of R 154.00 (more or less 11 pounds), I thought it was a give away. Now for removing that bearing without major disassembly! This photo reveals the mod done to replace the in-tank Tokheim submersible fuel pumps which were both U/S. These must have been installed by the South African Army together with the stainless steel fuel tank. Quite a good mod I think! Pity that I could not obtain two new Tokheim pumps. The two sets of Facet pumps were connected in series, fuel wise and electrically, to get to the required 24V. It works like a charm with each set operating depending on wether the Reserve or main tank has been selected. I constructed two stainless pick-ups with screens for the intank inlets, replacing the pumps. I might have to install a pressure regulator though on after-thought. This photo shows the specs of this Saracen. It was English built (280 of them!) and exported to South Africa. I am sure that there should be similar models around Europe, it can't only be South Africa that has these. Till next time, gents.

Hi Richard, You are right, a lot of accesory systems were modified. My problem though, is with the basics which remained untouched. I don't have any hassles with the modified parts. I have contacted Richard as you suggested and he indeed has the seals and packings that I need. Thank you very much for this helpful info. The EMER set is still an obstacle, I have some parts and is still scrounging for the others. Does anyone perhaps have an exploded drawing of a bevel box? I think that could go a long way in clarifying some of my queries. I am planning to tackle the centre bevel box over the weekend, armed with EMER V613 with some bevel box info. I just hope the current good weather holds up!

Hi all, Seems like everybody is busy as there were no takers regarding info. Guys, the Saracen is just a ordinary Mark3 but with a longer nose, no other funny stuff. I have not heard from Val yet, he also has a Saracen on which he worked and should also know a lot. Could anyone maybe suggest suppliers where I could purchase the required oil seals for the bevel and transfer box, it would also help if it is a web address since phoning overseas would be problematic.

Hi all, I'm back, I have just started the Saracen, I had such an adrenalin rush! The oil pressure reading is beautiful, the air compresser supplying the brakes picked up the air pressure into the green zone on the pressure gauge, the brakes seem to function BG and the alternator reading indicates 28V when picking up the revs! Everything in the engine compartment seems fine! For the driving bit, I still have the problem with the leaking R/H centre bevel box which I need to sort. I have to call on all you guys with experience in this field, Oily for one comes to mind. Can I remove this bevel box without removing the engine and gearbox? Would I be able to remove the bevel stub shaft housings, powering the front and rear wheel drive shafts in situ? I suspect it is the oil seal on the stub to the front wheel that is the major culprit although the intermediate seal between transfer case and bevel box is shot as well. I welcome any info or manuals in this regard since the ones I have falls short regardin this info.

Hi all, Bad news since I last wrote. After having drained all boxes and hubs, (mostly muck and a little oil), I proceeded with filling the bevel boxes excluding the R/H centre which I want to strip (Evidence of metal (flakes from a bearing?). When getting to filling the R/H centre bevel box (again!) , I noticed oil in the filler tube of this box that was supposed to be drained. Leaving everything for daylight hours (weekend) for closer inspection, I found to my dismay, that the floor covered with oil! Now what! Some seal must be shot between the transfer and bevel box and some seal on the bevel box to atmosphere must have given up the ghost as well! No wonder there was such a greasy mess in the belly when I first opened it up. I imagine I will have to strip the motor and gearbox from the hull for a look-see. It appears that the vehicle must have had a hard time in the past from idiots driving??? it. Wish me luck!

Hi guys, Thanks for the mails. Oily, thanks for the PM, I have been off the air for a while and will answer you shortly. Apparently, the Saracen's nose was extended 150mm to accommodate tooth belts and a front tow hook. A lot more work has gone into the "Sarie" and a few nasty surprises came up. On draining the wheel hubs, bevel, transfer and main gearboxes, only three bevel boxes had some traces of "oil", the rest just a little bit of muck that had been a mixture of oil and water. The transfer box had no oil at all and only a little bit in the gearbox. On servicing the fluid drive, (a hell of a battle to get the plug out without the special tool), it needed about 3 pints of oil. The oil in the R/H middle wheel hub has a lot of steel flakes in it and on closer inspection, my guess is that it is probably a bearing that got damaged because of the low oil levels. Now I have 2 wheels on the R/H side needing attention. The R/H front wheel hub cover was removed with me anticipating to find a stuffed planetary system. It appears fine and the culprit seems to be the bevel box indeed. Bad news! Oily could probably tell me whether it can be removed without disturbing the engine. Fingers crossed though! I got some manuals and they have been a big help. I also located a guy/company in the USA, he returned my money though saying that he doesn't ship outside of the USA. BIG dissapointment, I don't mind paying additional postage if that was the problem. Yet another challenge. I am including pictures of originals. Untill later.

Hi all, Here are some pics. Niels v, Yes, it is a R/H drive with the gear-lever on the sill. At the moment all attention is diverted to the "Sarie" , though.

Hi, thanks for your posts. I have done some research on the subject but mostly find descriptions. I did locate a place for buying manuals and have done so, now awaiting delivery. It has a lot of greasy water in the belly. The lefthand front wheel seems to have a problem as I can turn it if that wheel is lifted. I really hope that it is not the bevel gearbox but rather a side shaft or U-joint. Any comments?. About the engine mods, I really dont know. It definitely is a Mark 3 with a dry sump. The belts are Gilmer belts and the vehicle is fitted with an alternator. the brake system also has been modified. It has an air compressor supplying two large air tanks housed behind the seat backrests. This air is also supplied to the brake master cylinders (no hydraulics on these master cylinders) and then to two brake boosters with a hydraulic tank. There are also hydaulic as well as air pipes going to the brakes on each wheel. The vehicle must have seen a lot of water on the inside at some point as both the hand brake and the transfer box gear lever was siezed. This has now been removed and serviced. The panel on the foot gear select also was found to be removed. I thought there were problems with the gear change(initialy thought it was the Brake until I traced the linkages to the gearbox!) but on closer inspection found marks on the starter such as those when hitting the starter with a rod or spanner when having solonoid trouble. After removing the starter and opening it, again found that a lot of water was present causing items to stick together (sieze is probably closer). So, after a lot of cleaning and figuring out how the starter works, I tested it last night and it now seems fine. The initial problem seems to have been too close tolerances locking up the armature when bolting the starter together. A 0.5mm stainless steel spacer solved that problem though. I now need to refit the fuel tank and service all gearboxes as well as the engine before I can try to start the "Sarie". This brings me to the next obstacle, I have no idea how to drive this vehicle! The two instrument panels have been figured out?? and I imagine I will be able to start the engine. Please help!! :help: I got a pleasant surprise when starting on the vehicle though. All identification plates on the gearboxes, transferbox, engine ans engine accesories shows that the vehicle has been rebuilt in 1987. The tripmeter shows a little over 2 000 km and the hour meter of the engine shows 9 hours. Too bad about all the water though. I have some photo's but stem from the "BC" age. "Before Computor" that is! I will have to ask the kids to assist. Till next time.

Hi all, The Saracen I came accross, I can purchase at a good price. It does need a lot of work, though. I understood that the Defence Force purchased 270 MK3's in the 50's, stored them, upgraded them, used them as a basis for new designs and then sold them. A lot was used in the security industry as bullion carriers after even more mods. A few of them are still around but I have never seen one been driven around.