attleej

Dear All,

Some of you will be aware that I am rebuilding my Antar TMU371Y, or 33BP08. I bought her direct from Ruddington in 1983. I have used her fully freighted at 107 tons gross train weight carrying the REME museum's Conqueror ARV. Sadly I have had to keep her outside for many years and the time came for a complete rebuild. There is very little wrong mechanical with the major assemblies. The biggest problem was the dried out, flaky paint and rust on the chassis. There was no alternative to a complete strip down. I think that this project qualifies for the term a 'nut and bolt' job.

Below are some of the photos that I have taken during the process. I have taken many more, particularly of the brake pipes. There are about 100 of them so there are about 10, 000 ways they could go together. Fortunately they are all labelled and photo'd.

John

Dear All,

The reason why I suggested a ref book is that the subject is complicated AND it is easy to get in trouble. Not least because it is easy for the authorities to check!

For instance, if you look at back of Bedford MK / MJ you will see a black brake hose permanently fixed to the vehicle pugged into the 'blue' socket. It is called, I think, the bridge. Its purpose is if a two line braked vehicle / trailer is connected rather than a three line one, the air will come out of the aux socket, through the black hose, and then via a double check valve out through the service yellow palm coupling. The result is that if you operate the aux hand control valve in the cab, the trailer brakes will still be applied as well as the vehicle brakes, (even with a two line trailer).

If you are towing a two line trailer with a three line towing vehicle it is important to consider what the blue aux line is doing!

IMPORTANT CHECK.

With a two or three line air braked trailer, the brakes should apply automatically if the trailer should break away and this is effectively a legal requirement. To test this function fully charge the trailers air tanks. Turn off the shut off valve on the red line and then disconnect the red line palm coupling. The trailer brakes should immediately come on fully. If they do not you MUST rectify the fault. Since the driver can test this functionality at any time, you cannot claim that you did not know fault existed.

Next steps.

I have an air brake ref book and will see if there is anything that I can usefully scan.

John

Dear All,

These are normally for radio sets however I have no idea which ones!

John

Dear All,

The blue line is the auxiliary. I think that it should operate all the brakes on a trailer. It is quite a complicated subject and it would be worth finding a reference book on the subject.

John

Keith,

I served for many years at 240 Sqn. Shortly after I arrived the DTs went but we had the Antars for a while after, especially 54BH04 and 05. That is why I got into Antars. My Antar was 33BP08 and is now reg TMU371Y. It is under rebuild and up until last week, no two parts of the chassis were bolted together!

John

Dear All,

I don't think that it for a Conqueror. It is too spindly and would bend at first corner. How about a vehicle with a long jib? Also are we sure that the extensions are to be joined together? Can we have a close up of the butterfly at the apex?

John

Dear All,

Having driven many miles in a Bedford RL I can assure you that a heater is not necessary. The engine will keep you as warm as toast!

John

Dear All,

I hope to bring the REME Museum's Centurion ARV on the little trailer towed by the Scammell Contractor.

John Attlee

During the summer I shot blasted my Antar chassis and no two parts of it are currently bolted together! I used Scangrit grade 2 superfine copper slag. I used about 3 tons for the Antar chassis and a Scammell Contractor ballast box and had a bit left. The base price is £170.50 per ton. With the VAT the 3T came to £613 delivered to Bordon.

With a decent seized pot you need a 250 cfm compressor ie a four tool type. I hired it. Check the weather forecast for humidity. If it is too high you can get problems with the flow of abrasive due to it clogging up.

The paint and rust will just fly off. The surface is then ideal for painting. You need to prime as soon as possible after blasting as the surface starts to go off immediately. This grade was OK for doing tin work provided I was sensible. Even with tin work the finish is not too rough, certainly for a mil vehicle. If the tin work is rotten you will end up with a lace curtain. The alternative is to polish it with a sanding disc or wire brush and pretend that it is not there! I have no experience of using the other media mentioned in the string. You should be able to blast all the outside of a 432 in a day.

The Infra Red Reflecting (IRR) paint may have some health hazards. The blaster will be OK in his air fed hood (you must use the proper hood). Do not allow others to inhale the paint dust as it may have unhealthy components. Sweep and shovel up as much as possible. Pay attention to removing every bit of abrasive after blasting or will come back to haunt you!

Personally I would love to strip an AFV down to a bare hull and then blast it! Wherever you have oils seals wrap string around them so that the grit does not get in. Duct tape, carpet tape, black nasty or whatever you call it is good for protecting machined surfaces. Where you have exposed male threads it is not a problem blasting them. However, make sure that you mask all exposed threads after blasting as the paint will stick so well it will hard to remove even with a die.

If you have suitable facilities, in my opinion blasting is the ideal way of preparing a vehicle.

I hope that this is helpful.

John Attlee

Robin,

I am indeed looking after the Conqueror ARV. The main winch rope is very good indeed but I doubt that the auxilary winch rope will pass inspection. However, the Samson has the same size rope and we have one as a gate guardian at Bordon. Hopefully I can just pull the rope off the winch and leave a short bit for show. The Conqueror's winch rope is too heavy to pull by hand.

I have not taken the Conqueror out of Bordon since 2008. However, it is nearly ready to be operational and I hope to be taking it out next year. The next step is the winch inspection and test. I will probably start a thread on it soon.

John

Dear All,

I have almost no experience of CVR(T). Does anyone know if or how you can remove the winch rope if the engine is not running and never will? If it can just be free spooled and pulled off, what has to be done?

John Attlee

I think that you find that the problems arise when first registering. I don't think they get very excited about changes in taxation class unless the new class needs an MOT.

John

Dear All,

We have a Mk11 at Bordon.

John

Dear All,

Points gap could be wrong but timing correct, giving too much dwell so coil is passing current for too long? I am not convinced that this is the problem however.

John attlee

Dear All,

I have posted an extract from the relevant EMER on the forum.

I will check our AEC at the museum to see if there is the space to fit an alternator on the compressor drive.

There is always a debate about 100 % original or not. There is also one about safety and keeping the lights on and bright is very important if driving on today's modern roads. I quite like doing modifications that could have been done but for the bureacracy and pig headedness at within the MOD. It would have been possible to modify the AEC 10 ton fleet by fitting the alternator and regulator from the Bedford MK. It might have been possible to use EXACTLY the same parts as used on the Bedford. The relevant alternator and regulator should not be too difficult to find. Technical info about this alternator is easy find on the internet search "AC5R alternator".

On the other hand, if you want the alternator that is most easy to sustain for the long term, go for the most common Bosch alternator fitted to the contemporary truck fleet. A commercial auto electrician could advise.

For my money, I would go for the Bedford MK alternator as it was very reliable and is something that could have been done when the truck was in service.

John

Please see EMER excerpt about the generator panel No 1 Mk as fitted to AEC and many other mil vehicles with FVRDE electrics.

John Attlee

Dear All,

I have an EMER covering this and a simple precis from SEME at Bordon. In my time in the TA with an AEC and Leyland Martian recovery these units gave nothing but trouble. My earnest recommendation is to fit a modern 24 Volt alternator. It might be possible to fit with the compressor leaving the generator to run the fan belts. I will look at our AEC at Bordon on Tuesday.

I will scan and post on the forum the literature that I have got. It is very detailed and will enable anyone with the right skills to repair these items.

John

Jeff,

I would be very surprised if the seals were anything special. I can't remember if I still have a parts list but it may only give a manf pt number but not size. I would strip it down and measure it up. Should be a cheap problem to solve.

John

Barry,

In my opinion the pump at engine at rest should have max fuel delivery. As soon as engine starts the governor will move the rack and control the revs. Many engines, I think inc a Gradner, have an excess fuel device which allowed the rack to move even further than the normal full power position. Normally these devices are arranged so that they cannot be used when being driven along the road. Usually the device is operated on the pump itself and not from the cab. It resets to normal on the first time the rack is moved to reduce max fuel after starting.

If the rack was at min fuel position at rest, it could never start from cold!

Out of interest, in the TA with Bedford TM 8 tonnes, we found that we could operate the excess fuel device from inside the cab when on the road. It was arranged so that the handbrake valve lever was in the way. Unfortunately, it was still possible to obtain excess fuel! I can tell you it was like another 50 % of power! Very naughty!!

John

Baz,

Good advice from the forum as ever.

I took mine civvy H test using a 432. On observation, I stood up in the driver's seat to check all round and was careful to be observing all round from start to end of test. In other words, I knew if there was a pedestrian anywhere near. I don't think getting out helps much because by the time you get back in someone else could have got in one of your numerous blind spots!

If you have passed a C+E recently you should have no difficulty. However, watch the key difference with an H vehicle, ie a track laying vehicle steered by its tracks. When you pull away from rest near the kerb, be very careful not to swing the rear into the kerb because that would be a serious failure.

John Attlee

Dave,

I have the FVRDE schedule of recovery equipment and it has GA drawings of most of the bits of recovery equipment. I should be able to e-mail a copy of it later this week. Feel free to chase if I forget.

John Attlee

Dear Mike,

Very interesting!

Check the wire between the coil and the distributor very carefully. It could have a poor connection between the wire and the terminations. Alternatively there could be a short between the wire and another live wire or the metal work. The short could be very subtle or due to insulation breakdown. Perhaps do a substitution test with a new wire.

If the fault is present, with the coil disconnected and the contact breaker closed, measure the resistance between the end of the wire normally attached to the coil (and going to the distributor) and the negative terminal of the battery. The resistance should be very low (compare with a running vehicle).

Does not sound as if you have an alternator problem. If the alternator is producing far too much voltage the bulbs will start blowing before the ignition system starts playing up.

I won't insult you and everyone else by suggesting all the standard tests because you obviously know what you are doing!

We are all surely dying to know what the fault is!

John Attlee

If you were not worried about external originality you could do electronic fuel injection with a "megasquirt". It would give you excellent starting, probably more power and efficiency and you would not need to mess around with the guts of the engine. All you would have to do mechanically is to fabricate an inlet manifold. AND the manifold would not have to be jacketed or anything. Also if you wanted to revert to a carb that would be quick and easy.

John

Ian,

We had this problem with the REME museum's AEC militant. I had to do some things that you won't find in the text books. I have got a feeling that was to remoove the delivery valve holders, and free the plungers (up and down) by a combination of rotating the camshaft and tapping the plungers down. Trying to move the rack does not work since the rack is trying to move all the seized plungers at once. The good news is that despite what I did, the engine now runs well.

Are you sure that the rack is stripped? Send me a photo and I can see what we have left in terms of pump.

e-mail is attleej@parliament.uk

John

Dear All,

Some time ago "Series2joe" said that he had a CN6 Compressor set for disposal. Does anyone know what happened there?

The reason is that I need a big compressor for shotblasting parts of the Conqueror ARV, the Antar and the "Big" trailer at Bordon. By a "big" compressorI mean at least 250 Cubic feet per minute, ie at least a four tool machine. A classic CN6 compressor or similar would be great. Perhaps one that needs attention? It could be skid mounted.

If anyone can point me in the right direction I would be very grateful!

John Attlee