JPMulders

2 hours ago, matchlesswdg3 said:

"Any suggestions on a specialist to send these to for refurbishment."  I have only had motorcycle instruments done and I hesitate to recommend the guy I use, but there are a few specialists in UK and it is likely that someone on here has a recommendation for Jeep ones.  Maybe even just try ringing one of the trusted restorers and ask who they use - like Jeffereys.  I presume you would rather use the originals.

I will call around here in Belgium or NL first. I was at BAIV last Saturday but forgot to ask. Most impressive workshop I have ever seen. They restore tanks and heavy armored stuff for the hi-end market.. They had a '44 comet and 2 Pershings in the shop. 

3 minutes ago, Jerry Jeep said:

yes late type lights you get new wires in the wire harness kit and you can now get the parts to go inside if you need some  parts  

Learning every day from your posts. 😃

17 minutes ago, steviem said:

One of those little jobs, I think original to the jeep, these need to be stripped and re built 

Guess some epoxy primer after sandblasting/brushing and these are new again. I guess the internals are available in repro,. 

12 minutes ago, steviem said:

I think it looks great bud and appears to be complete,  have fun i will follow your progress. Steve 

Thanks!

2 minutes ago, matchlesswdg3 said:

Looks a nice practical project and best of luck with it.  As to instruments, that would be something I would not tackle myself as it is very easy to make a right mess of them and end up with something that looks naff.  I prefer to put them the way of trusted specialists who make a fantastic job - either just get working (properly and reliably) retaining the patina or a full restoration.  Its good to keep these people going, but good for you if you think you can tackle it.

 

I| doubt if I can handle, 'not my cup of tea', Any suggestions on a specialist to send these to for refurbishment. I found the name of a French guy (Laurent) on G503.com but he is not responding. Somebody else warned me that your speedo might not return at all.. 

11 hours ago, Jessie The Jeep said:

The instruments may have radio-active paint on the dials. Approach stripping them down with caution as you don't want to be breathing radio-active paint dust.

Good tip! Like jeeps but a bit early to die for it. 

4 minutes ago, Jerry Jeep said:

it all depends on the type of restoration you are after lets call it after the battle look or as it came of the production line look most i do are  production line look a friend he decided to rebuild the body all he is left with is the bulk head and a ton of work and he is just learning to weld with a mig set is that something you can do weld also you need to shrink steel so you will need oxy O2/ Acetylene c2h2 took me a long time to work that one out  its a lot to think about but you will get there working on jeep is all good fun you will be pulling your hear out at times i have done over 50 jeeps and at times they still do my head in like the one in the workshop but that's anther story for anther day just remember that its your jeep and as long as you are happy with it that's fine i will all ways  help any way i can all the best jerry

Hi Jerry,

Thanks for the motivating words. Indeed I go for factory fresh condition. I am an engineer and I got lots of Arc, tig and mig welding experience. My father is the acetylene man and he has a set for it so we should be ok although shrinking is new for me as well. Plenty of videos online and I will practice first. I like welding and looking forward to get the bodywork straight again. The sharp bent in the hood is something I will need to think about how to handle that..

thanks guys!

Beside the hat channels, the body is in a very good shape, completely hard.

I got the time for sourcing but since that might take time, I already start looking for GPW top bow, back seat and an original auto-lite regulator. I will need these anyway. The instruments seem to be ok but need refurbishment, something I need to dig myself into as I am not familiair with fixing instruments. 

Really a nice project. Completely original, even the glass window. The only thing that has been replaced is the oil pump and the transfer case. Everything is F marked. 

Happy man.

7 minutes ago, Rootes75 said:

JP have you found one then?

Iscthis the one you mentioned on your thread?

Yup, I decided to go for it! I just updated my own topic as well. more info will follow but wanted to share the news as I am very excited! 

Deal done! The GPW matching kept occupying my head and it is the kind of project that offers me just that bit extra. So now the games begin! Will move first so it will have to wait till the workshop is moved but meanwhile I start sourcing like the GPW top bow, back seat, auto-lite regulator, Sparton horn, etc etc. 

It will be taken apart completely and rebuild part by part. I see parts of the original hood-number so eager to start scraping/sanding and see if I can recover it. Nevertheless it will dressed like a jeep of the 1st Polish armored division of General Maczek. They liberated my birth village and I want to honor them. It will be completely original and authentic. Picture of the original jeep I got from the Maczek museum in Breda (NL). 

Wow Jerry, nice things you are doing over there. Keep the pictures coming as I am just as eager as Steviem to learn from it. Looking at bodywork repairs, Often you see waves in the panels or an area with small dents. Would you remove these kind of parts and weld in a new section? Or would you be able to 'straighten' them? 

Another tricky one I have is a sharp bent at the front side of the hood, like it hit a pole or something. good luck with the project Stevie and I will follow this.topic! see pics

Wise words gentlemen, Decisions are sometime taken by the heart rather than the head indeed. I try to find a balance though and your input is just great!. 

I had a few things passing by but this GPW seems to make the heart ticking just a bit faster like you feel something special is coming your way. The seller is a recognized specialist and was very active on G503.com in the past. I am bringing a very experienced guy with me that I visited before and we started WA'ing back and forth and he helped me understanding the value or risks of buying a project. It is great meeting these genuine people. At least it is a far better feeling spending your money with such a guy vs some business guy or via the local Ebay. 

We will see, the feeling is good so far. He sent me 60 pictures of litteraly every bult and nut and he gave me a detailed list of pro's and cons. He was honest enough to tell from the start that he wants the GPA transfer case to be switched for a GPW, fair enough. He owned a GPA before by the way. 

gr

JP

10 minutes ago, matchlesswdg3 said:

Bear in mind that if you miss this one or it turns out a bust then the market can only be working in your favour.   I see a lot of highly priced hardware not shifting from week to week and eventually the message will get through to sellers that prices peaked probably six months ago and economic conditions are hardly likely to create demand - quite the reverse, I suspect.  Jeeps are hardly rare - even good or potentially good ones!

Interesting perspective, I would think that with economic downturn lots of capital is stored in save investments like Art, Gold and Classic cars. Not sure if this counts as well for restoration projects to be honest. Talked to Wildenberg, they have an incoming shipment of 5 restoration projects from Midwest in the US. They sold 2 in advance and have 7 on the waiting list for the remaining 3. bizar but through. All what comes online in the UK is sold as soon as they get online. 

The one I am after is not officially for sale. It was imported earlier this year and the guy was just waiting if anybody in his network would be interested. He will not sell it for a euro less than 15.000 which I think is a serious price, even for a matching one in original state. When I told somebody about what I found he said that he would buy it if I will not.

Am I too eager and should I wait for a cheaper option or is this something I will regret for ever? (question to myself). Seeing is buying probably. 😊

7 hours ago, Pete Ashby said:

I think Steve has summed the whole expenditure versus value for money issue pretty succinctly.

Your purchase has to be driven by your budget, your ability, tooling /equipment and as steviem above has found out available  working space. 

Pete

Indeed, the relation to your budget is most important rather than the 'business case'. At least for me it is, since I have no intention to resell it whatsoever. But first things first, getting started. Cashflow wise it's a choice wether to go with a basic project and source the rest over a period of time or a rather complete project. 

How do you guys look at the availability of original/NOS the coming years? If I start digging into the jeep world, it feels like thousands of people are looking for the same parts. I want to rebuild a jeep historically accurate and plan to work mostly with original parts for as far they can be found. Might take years so here and there a temporary repro part might be the only option to get the project going. 

Working space and equipment I am sorted with a large workshop including overhead manual crane and pit. As an engineer most stuff I should be able to perform myself as that is part of the fun.

Meanwhile things moved on and came across a nice project. A 1945 completely hard GPW, fully matching incl engine with Title. Never taken apart and original hood number still visible. Even the original toolkit and jack. 15k euro is a lot of money so I take a very experienced Jeep restorer with me. All I came across started with a very incomplete jeep with rusty holes for around 8k, reasonable around 10-12k. Had a barn find in The Netherlands for 12k that was a salad mix but in a barn for 40 years without moving. So looking at these as a reference the 15k euro is not too overly expensive although being on the high side of the range. It fits budget as it is rather complete and would be a great start. Just have to accept that prices have been rising. Have to notice that UK prices seem to be the highest somehow. No facts here, just my 2 cent.

Had found a 1000USD Willys MB 45 (bad condition but rolling) with 3 spare engines and lots of loose parts from a farmers fair in Michigan. Closed the deal with the guy to get it picked up but due to Corona he cannot get a scrap Title and the expeditor claims it is a former US DoD vehicle and therefor needs a specific export License which is 750 USD as well. So not sure if I will pull this one off without buying 1000's of euros on shipping. (All these port/handling fees add up quickly). It would be a project to use parts from and somehow finance part of the cost of the GPW. At least that is the theory.. 

Keep you posted on the progress but very excited on the GPW! will visit it Thursday and he is keeping it for me. 

4 hours ago, 67burwood said:

I believe Jeep finder buy there stock from AMD, hence the similar pictures but higher price, I can definitely recommend dealing with Mike and Anthony at AMD.

Thanks! I will check it out. Indeed a 1200 GBP premium for the same jeep/same pictures. Not sure what the added value is. I will mail AMD for more info. cheers!

15 minutes ago, Jessie The Jeep said:

So many times at events I hear..."I'm waiting until I find the perfect Jeep for me", so another little piece of wisdom I share at events is this - There's no such thing as the perfect Jeep for you. You have to just buy a Jeep that fits your budget at the time and make it the perfect Jeep yourself.

Depending on your budget, it may be a runner that you tinker with, or it could be a wreck that you spend years sourcing parts for and rebuilding. Either way, you'll spend a good chunk of cash, but one way is expensive initially and gets you a vehicle you can drive, the other spreads the cost and is a long term project.

Guess you are right there, in that sense it is a sort of cashflow management decision. Nevertheless I remain picky in order to get the jeep as complete as possible for a bit more money so I can really start. I did that with my Unimogs as well, somehow I like that approach. we will see. 

Got something upcoming.. no starting project but something I couldn't resist! More news later.

7 minutes ago, matchlesswdg3 said:

I have quoted this one before, but its apt!  "Jeep that is a good price; Jeep that is a Good vehicle/project; Jeep that is available now.........you can only ever get two out of those three!"  But my (note - MY) sense of the market in UK is that prices for Jeeps have peaked and with the way the economy is - and likely to be in the next three years - price falls will be evident, if not actually happening already.  As always, the really good (original and genuine) stuff will tend to retain value but everything else won't (IMHO).  The slide will likely start (started?) with the WW2 wannabes......the Hotchkiss, etc..  On the other hand, it is highly unlikely that the cost of new parts and restoration services will do anything but rise - somewhat, at least.  What that tells you, if I am right, is that financially it makes sense to hang on and buy a sensibly priced good running Jeep that can be gently upgraded.  Of course, head and heart are two different things!  Good Luck!

Hi Ferg, very wise words and I agree to that. Most flexible out of your three is time. I will not act before I am convinced I found what I am looking for. The post on this forum and on G503 can be seen as a fishing hook for that one PM or mail that will drop one day in my mailbox with the right deal. Speculating on price dropping I find a bit of a gamble as I am not sure it will make a difference. Looking at the known players in the Benelux, all they can find in the US is shipped in 40' containers to Rotterdam and sold before arrival at 15k euro price levels for a rolling jeep in poor state. Then it is not even matching etc. It is like the housing market in crowded areas like West Holland and London.. no effect from a crisis and prices higher than ever. 

Actually one factor comes in play though.. I have euro's to spend and the Pound sterling is expected to drop with Brexit and covid doubling up the troubles on the island. This might favor my perspective. Having that said... it is a terrible situation we are all going through and I really regret Brexit as I have worked 15 years for a company based out of Chester.

JP

1 hour ago, sirhc said:

You may think that buying a complete Jeep will save you a lot of money, but bear in mind nearly everything will be worn out or need work in some way. Engine, gearbox, axles, steering box etc parts are not cheap, NOS may not be available and reproduction parts vary a lot in quality. Whatever you think it may cost to do a restoration... it will cost more!
 

Chris 

Hi Chris, Did some homework indeed, never thought it would be cheap but indeed some pricy stuff around there. I expect it will be a serious cash burning project but do not tell my wife pls. 🤫

41 minutes ago, steviem said:

Yeah that's the guys Mike and his brother they normally have a lot more available i went to their barns there were loads there tell them exactly what you are looking for.

I am in touch with Hugh, so let us see where he comes up with. Wildenberg in The Netherlands is expecting a shipment of 5 restoration projects but they have a waiting list of 8 people. 🤪

2 hours ago, steviem said:

Welcome, i have not long started mine, it is a long long road to go down, 

I got mine as a running project compete but needs almost a full restoration from these guys

https://www.amdfourwheeldrive.co.uk/vehicles/

Are these the same guys as jeep finder? I see similar pictures but different price tags. I am looking at this one: https://www.amdfourwheeldrive.co.uk/1945-willys-mb-jeep/ but it is really far gone. I have asked for more detailed pics and some information. The 42 scripted one is tempting as well but the picture of that backpanel hurts the eye as they patched over the logo. What do you think?

2 hours ago, Jessie The Jeep said:

Welcome to the forum and good luck with your search for a vehicle. From watching adverts over the last few years, Jeeps now seem to fall into two categories - those up and running demanding high prices and complete wrecks needing a lot of time and money spent on them. All the "running restorations" seem to have long gone.

I bought a Ford in 2012 and after a complete strip and rebuild, got it on the road again in 2014. I got the wreck for around £4,700 and including the purchase price, it ended up costing around £13~14,000. People selling wrecks for rebuild these days seem to be asking a lot more for the basic restoration project. 

Of course you may find a project at a sensible price, but you could be looking for quite a while, especially if you start narrowing down options with "matching numbers" or "complete Jeep". These days, I'd expect to be spending £10~15,000+ on top of your purchase price to end up with a good running restoration. Adds for restored Jeeps seem to start at around £27,000.

Hi Jessie, thanks for the nice words. Indeed it seems so because many people claim that good projects can be 'scored' for sub 10k prices which does not seem the reality today anymore. Or I am not patient enough. (true)

I am convinced that a most complete Jeep will at least save me on sourcing all the bits and pieces. For the matching numbers, I will see if that will hold when time elapses.. It would be a 'nice to have' though. 

I am not after a business case, just a challenge and something I will get emotionally attached to. Hobby cost money they say and that is what I keep in mind. I have no problem with paying for good parts and make it a fine jeep but the money needs to be spent right and not on useless stuff to save a bit. Left and right some options start popping up but all in the 15k range for a complete one in reasonable state. Will start checking these options and check if they are worth the price vs the current market conditions.

gr

JP

Hi guys, just found your forum and enjoyed all the great historical stuff brought to life again. After some post war restoration projects, Unimog 404s mainly, I want to realize my dream of restoring a WW2 vehicle. I got a workshop and I am an engineer so I am able to handle a nice challenge but what I really need is people who know people and they know people etc... I am new to the WW2 community but have spent many hours on browsing and watching YouTube, calling and e-mailing around, visiting other hobbyists, etc just to get myself know and come across a nice opportunity. I do not want to start with a huge or expensive exclusive project but ready to invest and get started well. So currently my goal is to find a honest original complete Willys/GPW 42-45. bodywork, mechanicals, etc I can manage but it should not be a heap of scrap. (Hard time to explain the wife that I burned 10k on a rusty bunch of parts). It should also be a complete jeep in order to prevent a cash drain on sourcing parts to complete it.

Plan is to rebuild the car from scratch and as original as possible. (I know this costs). Matching numbers would be a great deal of course but I am aware of motorpool swaps that might be more realistic. 

So a long story short, If you know somebody selling a project, let me know. Transport can be arranged so I look in the US and all over Europe. I found a good list of middle men and importers that I contacted but so far nothing much. I appreciate all the help, tips and tricks.

Thanks and greetings from The Netherlands!

JP

Greetings from The Netherlands