vintary

Seen this for sale on Donedeal Ireland

I know nothing about it, I just seen it for sale and thought it interesting.

http://cars.donedeal.ie/vintagecars-for-sale/old-chassis/5483922

Comming on nicely

There were in fact at least five Lorrys supplied by Guinness in the 1916 Dublin risings and all five would appear to be Daimlers. I welcome any futher information on these impresssive lorry's.

http://improvisedmilitaryvehicles.blogspot.com/

Excellent short video on the restoration.

The recently restored RollsRoyce armoured car Sliabh na mBan was unveiled at the Curragh Camp in Co Kildare at the weekend, following the annual ceremony paying tribute to deceased members of the Defence Forces’ Cavalry Corps.

Originally destined for service with the British army in Mesopotamia, Sliabh na mBan along with a large number of her sisters were diverted to Ireland during the War of Independence. In 1922 at least 14 of these1920 pattern Rolls Royce armoured cars were acquired by the newly formed Irish state.

Sliabh na mBan is the most historic and evocative vehicle in the State "said Irish Taoiseach Mr Kenny who attended the ceremony".

It is a matter of tragic irony that Collins, who refused to take shelter in the Sliabh na mBan, was evacuated from the ambush site in this very car, having been mortally wounded moments earlier. And thus, in the loss of one of our greatest patriots and leaders, Sliabh na mBan was a silent witness,” Mr Kenny said.

Sliabh na mBan, along with12 other armoured Rolls Royce cars, were procured by the National Army from the departing British forces, although it came under the control of anti-Treaty forces for a brief period during the Civil War.

By 1936, the Rolls Royce squadron was superseded by Landsverk L180 cars. However, the Sliabh na mBan and others were returned to service in late 1939, by which stage imported armoured vehicles were almost impossible to procure due to the conflict in Europe. The vehicles were later retired in the Curragh Camp.

In April 1954, most of the armoured Rolls Royces were auctioned off, fetching values of between £27 and£60, but the Sliabh na mBan was saved from the scrap heap and was worked on inthe Curragh Camp’s workshop, known as “Tin Town”.

Helping to care for the car were three generations of the Lynch family: Paddy Lynch, a driver in the National Army who drove Collins when he was posted to Dublin during the CivilWar, his son Pat and Pat’s son Padraig. Restoration expert James Black, from Lisburn, Co Antrim, was also praised by the chief of staff of the Defence Forces, Lieut Gen Sean McCann.

Put together some information that I had gathered up on the armoured Lancia along with some interesting photos. Rather than change it around to post form for the “HMVF” I just put a link to my blog page.

I welcome any feedback or any further information on the armoured Lancia…….

http://armouredlancia.blogspot.com/

The Grey Ghost

On the 15th of October 1922 while patrolling the line between Thurles & Clonmel near fethard an armoured lancia nick named the grey ghost found its way blocked by a pile of stones her retreat also became blocked by the same means and it began taking fire from all sides including fire from two hump back bridges in front and behind. A typically well placed IRA ambush carried out by the 3rd IRA Tipperary brigade and unknown by the cars crew at the time, a landmine had also been placed on the line but failed to detonate. After several hours of fighting the lancia crew surrendered but only after their ammo was spent, the crew were well treated and released by the IRA after been relieved of their guns and heavy over coats and the lancia set on fire.

The lancia was later towed away and damage is said to be miner.

An unconfirmed but popular account suggest that both the attacker and defender of the incident, drank to each other’s health later that evening in a public house in Moyglass Co Tipperary.

Bernard Share (In time of civil war "The conflict of the Irish railways 1922/23)

A letter sent to the army CinC from Colonel Russell dated Friday 29/9/1922 reads

I have pleasure informing you that the first lancia car converted for railway work is a complete success. This afternoon during trials we obtained a forward speed of 45 mph and a rear speed of 20 mph. as previously arranged we are proceeding with the conversion of 11 other cars.

The car on the left (AL 23) fitted with rail wheels is a standerd Irish National army "Armoured Lancia 1922 model" which were better known as "Hooded Terrors" (see photo AL 25).

The photo appeared in several newspapers of the time and is dated November 1922 and the location is outside Mallow Co Cork. The car on the right is also a lancia. There were several different variants of the original armoured Lancia (see photo Ballybough Boys) that were converted for rail use, two of which had turrets. The video supplied by Charawacky can be dated pre 3/12/1922

It is accepted that there were only seven armoured rail cars converted for rail use, although one book by a Bernard Share (In time of civil war "The conflict of the Irish railways 1922-23") suggest there were Twelve. I have photos of six including a copy of the original Mallow photo.

To add futher mystery to the armoured rail cars, a newspaper article of the time suggest that both Crossley & Lancia were used but this is unconfermed.

On studding the original photo it is my opinion that the Lancia on the right is the "Grey Ghost". The Grey Ghost was original painted in a camouflage patern. The Lancia in the photo matches the description and from what I can make out the name on the left of the car appears to read "Grey Ghost"... But I could be wrong-??

Interesting stuff Charawack.

Did you notice what club the Crosley owner was from, I mite track him down for more info.

Where is the Queen of the west now?

 

Tom

Thats where the trail end's. I would imagine its long gone but something mite turned up in the future.

here is a second photo of the "Queen of the west".

Not quit a RFC Crossley but an interesting newspaper scan of a retro build that did auctually see action in Ireland.

The “Queen of the west” was an improvised armoured car, built by the irregular IRA on the chassis of a Crossley tender. She is probably the most well known of the improvised vehicles that the irregulars built during the Irish civil war.

Constructed with a boiler that was taking from the Mulranny hotel in Co Mayo and mounted on the chassis of a Crosley, the boiler been reinforced by fitting extra metal plates with concrete in-between, loopholes been added for weapons to fire through, with metal plates fitted to protect the engine. The work been carried out at the garage of a Thomas Moran which was next to the Mulranny hotel in Co Mayo. A small slit for the driver to see through can be seen as well as the door to the rear of the vehicle which has several spare tyres droop over it.

Taking part in the fighting in and around Clifden Co Galway in October of 1922 the “Queen of the west” fell into the hands of the Irish national army after a successful attack on positions held by the irregulars at Clifden.

Her new owners renamed her “The girl I left behind me” and used her temporarily before been abandoned in a bog in north Mayo where she lay partly submerges until 1934 at which time an attempt was made to retrieve her with the intention of placing her in a motor museum.

After the civil war Thomas Moran attempted and failed to claim from the Irish state £1,156 in damages caused to his public house and his garage which was next to the Mulranny hotel.

Moran claimed that national army troops arrested him, broke up everything in his premises and fired their rifles through the roof and windows, three motor cars and a lorry were smashed, gallons of oil were spilled and his premises looted.

Military Modelling magazine 1971, JH Sparshatt and his crossley.

As has been indicated, David dunnes RUC book is the one you will find of interest. Karl Martins book would be handy but it does not cover much reg or chassis numbers of the Lancia. The new book by Ralph Riccio " AFVs in Irish service since 1922" also handy to have but with regard to reg and chassis it quoats David Dunnes book.

Ralph Riccio does suggest that the figure quoted in David Dunnes book of 137 Lancias in RUC service (1922/23) is incorrect. This figure refers to the original RIC inventory at the formation of the RUC. 67 were transferred to the Irish national army with 70 to the RUC.

Karl Martins book has gone big money now. I did see some for sale not too long ago in an Irish museum for €35. Handed in by Karl Martin himself. PM me if you want their number.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=afvsc+in+irish+services+sence+1922&x=15&y=18

Great photos well done

Here is nice one of an early armoured crossley, RIC barracks no date

Would anybody take a chance on putting names to the vehicle line up, in the compound photo of thet web site.

The Ford mk 6 was recovered a fue years ago by a group of military history enthusiast from the field in Wales and its restoration is almost complate and the car should be on show this year. The car originally belonged to the Grange Cavern museum in wales. Check out the web page for more info.

http://www.waryearsremembered.co.uk/home/WarYearsRememberedBringingHistorytoLife.htm29.htm

What a great picture. Was Mr Coombes A. S. C.? The Royal appelation wasn't applied till 1918.

thanks tony. he joined up in june 1915 ASC-- ret april 1919 RASC

Blowing the picture up reveals it to be 1556.

thanks runflat

The Austin is a Series 3 Truck, built from the mid to late '50s; they later became the BMC WE and then WF. They had the same cab as the Series 2 / Loadstar but with the nose stretched, I think to accomodate the BMC 5.1 diesel though they were also available with the 4 litre petrol. The WF had a single piece screen.

well done sean thanks

Some further 'in depth' info. on Daimler 'CB' production, although Motor Traction buyers guide of July 1913 quotes a CB 2 ton model production appears not to have started until about March 1914 with serial numbers from about 800 following on from the 'CC' and 'CD' chassis. Production continued until about April 1917 by when serial numbers had reached almost 2900, an assumption from this is that about 2000 units were built. The sleeve valve engine was rated as 30 hp by the makers and 22.4 RAC rating hence there is sometimes confusion over engine sizes. A smilar situation exists with the 'Y' type engines being 40 hp and 30hp rated respectively. Unfortunately no factory records exist form this period and much present information has come from the records of subsequent civilian owners.

Richard Peskett.

thanks richard

I was enquiring about this photo on a web page for use in my photo album, the onwer of the photo "Graham Strong" asked would I repost it here with the hope someone may have more details on it ,like year or model, or anything at all about the photo. Also on his web page there is a 1950s austin lorry (railway section) he needs help with. This is a nice good quality photo of the daimler with driver TW Coombes who is Graham's Grandfather.

http://www.the-strong-family.110mb.com/

BT WHITE has a little bit about the automitrailleuse minerva in his 1970 book ( tanks & other armoured fighting vehicles 1900-1918)

Its in india. last entry on this site

http://the.shadock.free.fr/Surviving_British_Early_Armoured_Cars.pdf