ajmac Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 (edited) As I didn't managed to visit Bovington this year I have been looking through the YouTube posts, looks like it was a good day. However this brought about a question over the number of German tracked vehicles 'live* in captivity'.... I am sure you guys can update the current brief list... *fully operational condition, bar main gun. Tiger 1: Bovington Kingtiger: Saumur (talk of other, but I'm not convinced...) Jagdtiger: None..... Panther: Wheatcroft, Littlefield, Munster, Saumur Jagdpanther: Sdkfz, at least one other I have seen on YouTube, but who? 38T: at least two..... PzI: ? PzII: Bovington? PzIII: Bovington, ?? StuG: Sdkfz, lots of others... more details... PzIV: lots of others... more details... JagdPzIV: at least one... YouTube Hetzer (WW2 vintage): 3+ ?? Not considering Self Propelled Guns, Nashorn, modified french chassis etc... Edited July 1, 2009 by ajmac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcspool Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 PzI: ? Isn't the PzKpfw I at Munster a runner? I know it was rebuilt from a lower hull wreck which was dug up sometime. Hanno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajmac Posted July 1, 2009 Author Share Posted July 1, 2009 Your probably right. http://the.shadock.free.fr/Surviving_Panzers.html The above site is great! Just what I was looking for..... Everything you ever wanted to know about surviving Panzers; very well researched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runflat Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 That is a great site - looked at it many times myself. Here's another to keep you amused: http://preservedtanks.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajmac Posted July 1, 2009 Author Share Posted July 1, 2009 Tiger I: The wedsite mentioned above states: 'There have been a number of recent reports of at least two Tigers being kept in Russia, either by the authorities or private dealers. A number of museums, such as the Panzermuseum at Munster, as well as private dealers have made attempts to buy or trade them. One has recently been sold to the USA and another may be destined for Great Britain. (Sources: R. Fleming, W. Schneider). ' Any 2009 info on these possibly phantom vehicles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tichenor Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 The Kingtiger from Saumur is a runner again See: www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5p3KCli6YM www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gmoktx5WR0 Michel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Thanks for the links, very informative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stone Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Italian rather than German, but I saw this one at (free public militaria show put on by the government, they do things a bit differently there!) was a runner. No idea what it is though...possibly a M15/42 with no turret? Stone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 Its called a Semovente. Assault gun. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semovente_75/18 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stone Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 Ah, thanks for that. "The SPG 75/18 was a successful design, and despite the modest quality of Italian armoured vehicles, performed well in service." :rofl: Stone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radek Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 Another one before finish http://www.sturmgeschutziv.pl/galeria/view/51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve 82 Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 I recall photographing a Pzkpfw III and Jagdpanzer IV at Beltring during the first couple of Beltrings I attended (late 1990`s). Wounder who these belonged to ? Cheers, Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoelH Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) Tiger I: - Bovington TM. (Vehicle: 131) Video Link: here. [*] Tiger II (King Tiger)(Vehicle: 233): - Saumur TM Video Link: . [*] Jadgtiger: - Non Running. [*] Panther: - Saumur TM (Vehicle: 211) Video Link: . - Munster TM - Modern MTU Engine - J. Littlefield (Vehicle: 501) Video Link: . - Flick Collection - Wehrtechnische Studiensammlung Koblenz (Vehicle: 801) - Kubinka TM (Vehicle: II011) Video Link: . [*] Jagdpanther: - SDKFZ association (Vehicle 411) Video Link: . - Munster Panzer Museum - Wehrtechnische Studiensammlung Koblenz [*] 38T: [*] PZI: [*] PZII: Saumur (Vehicle 304) Video Link: . [*] PZIII: - Bovington TM [*] STUG: - SDKFZ association [*] PZIV: [*] JagdPZIV: [*] Hetzer: - Not including G-13 Pansarmuseet, Axvall Private collection Kevin Wheatcroft Collection ASPHM Association, La Wantzenau Kubinka Tank Museum [*] Hummel - Munster TM. Edited July 5, 2009 by JoelH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centi521 Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 there's not more? what's with the stug's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoelH Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) Sorry, I am updating the list as I am going along Edit: One thing I have noticed is there is a large number of running Panthers. I have also added photo's to give people some chance of ID-ing them from the you tube videos. Edited July 5, 2009 by JoelH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abn deuce Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 Great idea Fruitbat , very comprehensive listing all the resources connected Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoelH Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) Great idea Fruitbat , very comprehensive listing all the resources connected Thanks, maybe we can get this turned into a web page at the end of the day. A good point to note comes from You Tube: There are about 28 fully operational Panthers in the world today. About 24 more are currently being restored. In the Ardennes Forest, there are about 20 Panthers in museums or permanently situated in the middle of town squares like Houffalize. In the USA, quite a few Panthers exist in museums like the famous Patton Museum in Kentucky. There are also Panthers in Samur, France, and Bovington, England. Edited: Above quote from You Tube is completely inaccurate. There are 28 surviving examples, but not all of them are "operational" - not sure where that guy got his numbers from. But I believe the current list to be nearly accurate. P.s. need picture of J.Littlefield Panther. Edited July 5, 2009 by JoelH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajmac Posted July 5, 2009 Author Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) Thread is going rather well..... Nice touch with the photographs. It is starting to look like there is preaty much one running example of eveything, bar the Jagdtiger and Elephant, considering how few were manufactured AND survived it isn't much of a surprise. Now here is THE question.... what would be the possibility of getting an example of each at one event in the UK? It would need some inter-museum co-operation as there is only one Tiger 1 and one KingTiger... I doubt the two museums could ever agree which one should host the event :-\ I remember going to Duxford in the late 90s, the draw of the day being the largest number of Spiftires flying in one place since the 50s, IIRC there was 11 doing the circuit, quite a site and sound. Edited July 5, 2009 by ajmac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoelH Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 Thread is going rather well..... Nice touch with the photographs. It is starting to look like there is preaty much one running example of eveything, bar the Jagdtiger and Elephant, considering how few were manufactured AND survived it isn't much of a surprise. Now here is THE question.... what would be the possibility of getting an example of each at one event in the UK? It would need some inter-museum co-operation as there is only one Tiger 1 and one KingTiger... I doubt the two museums could ever agree which one should host the event :-\ I remember going to Duxford in the late 90s, the draw of the day being the largest number of Spiftires flying in one place since the 50s, IIRC there was 11 doing the circuit, quite a site and sound. When I was compiling this list, I had just the same idea. But think of the logistics, if we are honest, the central and most logical location would be main land Europe. But you just wouldn't want to send the Tiger and Panzer 3 all that way :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFowler Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 Any one know what ended the Jagdtiger at Bovington being a runner ? :-D Something went wrong... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoelH Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I Think its the lack of engine? :-D Want me to ask where the engine went? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajmac Posted July 6, 2009 Author Share Posted July 6, 2009 I don't know to what extent Wheatcroft / Littlefield invested in Engine patterns, it all depends how poor the originals were. In building a vintage engine the show stopper is always the lack of viable block / head castings. Back in 2000 I worked on a project for an Aluminium foundry who were making the first Merlin heads, cylinder blocks and crank cases that had been manufactured in years. All it takes is for someone to stump up the pattern manufacturing costs, machining is peanuts. Most... no ALL VSSC vehicles haven't had any original parts in there engines in decades :-) Rough and ready I'd say a NEW Maybach V12 would set you back £100k turn key. If you had a perfect examble to base it on. New Castings. Billet: Crank, Rods, Pistons, with dimensions adjusted to fit off the shelf shells and rings (again following VSSC) My Dad is currently casting new Ford Essex V6 blocks, and they only faded out in th 70's so you would have thought there were still lots around for rebuild! It all depends how much money you have :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centi521 Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 my dream is to restore the jagdpanther from the tank museum thun i think that's easyer then a tank with a turred ^^ but that's not now, i see where we were in 5, 6 years 800px-Jagdpanther_Thun_1.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woa2 Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I recall photographing a Pzkpfw III and Jagdpanzer IV at Beltring during the first couple of Beltrings I attended (late 1990`s). Wonder who these belonged to ? I believe the Jagdpanzer IV went to the USA soon after the show, but I don't know it's current location. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 About the black/white vid. I am surprised it runs considering it misses 3 roadwheels on 1 side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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