Historic Vehicle status question

[matchlesswdg3]

I would be grateful if someone could confirm my understanding in the case of a Land Rover that IS over 40 years old (as per stated date of manufacture on V5c) but has had a new chassis some 6 years ago.  I think it IS eligible for Historic Vehicle status and therefore zero tax, but needs an annual MoT.  Correct?  Thanks!

[67burwood]

Why would it still need an MOT?

if it’s registered as Historic it should be tax and mot exempt 

[matchlesswdg3]

No, if its had a major change, like change of engine or chassis, it will need an annual MoT even if its over 40 years old.  Thats as per DVLA notes, but its not specific on whether such a change affects eligibility for nil tax. 

[67burwood]

Has it ever been recorded by the dvla that it’s had a chassis change?

Land Rover chassis’s get changed all the time without notifying dvla. 

[robin33ba07]

exactly

[utt61]

I thought that as long as the chassis was a new replacement and effectively "like-for-like" - as similar as possible to the original - it didn't make any difference to the status of the vehicle.

If the chassis was different (such as a different wheelbase, or coils instead of leaf springs, etc) the situation is not as straightforward.

If you fit a new replacement chassis and it carries the same chassis number/identification markings as the old, and the old chassis is scrapped, I don't think you even need to tell anyone. It's just a replacement part.

[matchlesswdg3]

This is what DVLA says and looking at it closely, I guess the key phrase is: "......to change the way the vehicle works."  I just wondered if any of you had actual experience of this situation.  As you say, how would anyone know if a like for like replacement was made.  I guess the only difference to the way a military Land Rover would work when it has a new chassis is that you could not track it from the trail of rust and lumps of bitumastic underseal?

"Vehicles that do not need an MOT

You do not need to get an MOT if:

• the vehicle was built or first registered more than 40 years ago
• no ‘substantial changes’ have been made to the vehicle in the last 30 years, for example replacing the chassis, body, axles or engine to change the way the vehicle works

If you’re not sure if there have been any substantial changes you can:

• read the full guidance on MOT exemptions for historic vehicles
• speak to a historic vehicle expert

Vehicles exempt from vehicle tax

If your vehicle was built before 1 January 1981, you can stop paying vehicle tax from 1 April 2021.

If you do not know when your vehicle was built, but it was registered before 8 January 1981, you do not need to pay vehicle tax from 1 April 2021.

[Richard Farrant]

1 hour ago, matchlesswdg3 said:

You do not need to get an MOT if:

•  
• no ‘substantial changes’ have been made to the vehicle in the last 30 years, for example replacing the chassis, body, axles or engine to change the way the vehicle works

 

Hi Ferg,

The above phrase does not apply in your case as the replacement chassis is a 'like for like' and does not change the way the vehicle works.

 

[Rangie]

Chassis is like-for-like, so its acceptable. 👍

 

Alec.

[Ron]

I changed just the front frame section on a WD WM20 some years ago as the original was bent. The frame I used was not a new one as in Ferg's query. It was a correct original period part, but as the "stamped" frame number was obviously different, DVLA insisted it must be re-registered. A riveted on VIN plate would make a World of difference as the plate could be reattached to a new chassis and no one need be any the wiser.  Ron  

[7VHU]

Hi Ron,

is it possible to remove (cut out) the section of the chassis with the stamped number and the corresponding part of the damaged chassis and weld-in again.

Possibly stretching the definition of “repair”, possibly not… : )

swopping a removable ID plate would not be a repair.

Rgds

peter

[Ron]

Sorry Peter I should have mentioned that the WM20 is a motorcycle and trying to cut out a section of the curved part of the head stock where three tubes meet would be very difficult indeed.

What I'm getting at is that the number stamped or riveted to a chassis is for that chassis only. To the DVLA a new or different chassis, effectively makes it a different vehicle. You can change the engine (as is often done with a straight forward change of number in the V5C)..... In fact you can renew any part of a vehicle that is worn out......But NOT I think the chassis.

There is a firm in UK who make perfect replicas of Citroen 2CV chassis and I know of a person who got into serious hassle with DVLA after he erroneously told them that he'd rebuilt his car around one. Ron  

[7VHU]

Fair point Ron,

no doubt going to get harder as 2030 approaches.

BRgds

Peter

[Johnny]

Shouldn't be too difficult to re-frame a bike, or re-chassis a car and get it registered, but we all know what DVLA are like!!

Vehicle registration: Rebuilt vehicles - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

 

A rebuilt vehicle can keep its original registration number if you can prove you’ve used:

• the original unmodified chassis or bodyshell (car or light van)
• a new chassis or monocoque bodyshell of the same specification as the original (car or light van)
• the original unmodified frame (motorbike)
• a new frame of the same specification as the original (motorbike)

You must also have 2 other major components from the original vehicle from the following lists.

For cars or light vans:

• suspension (front and back)
• steering assembly
• axles (both)
• transmission
• engine

For motorbikes:

• forks
• wheels
• engine
• gear box

 

Edited August 5, 2021 by Johnny

[Ron]

The problem I had was with changing the frame on a motorcycle that was already registered with it's original transferable reg number. DVLA would not simply change the frame number on the registration document. They told me I'd have to re-register the bike and I would lose my transferable number and be issued with a non transferable age related number.

So my slightly complicated solution was to get the bike MOT'd and pay to put the number on retention under the cherished number scheme. As the bike had been laid up, and therefore not taxed or MOT'd for well over a year, it had to then be inspected by DVLA before they'd accept the number transfer...Sheesh!  

After I rebuilt the bike with the other frame, I transferred my original number back on it. This was all done before they closed all the local offices and my local office was only 1/4 mile from my home. Ron