question CB 365/5 Work shop Body...Thread sizes used question.

[DafT 244]

Yes, this has been driving me nuts for ages!

Can anyone please put me out of my/your misery and identify the type of thread used that is found in the framework of the workshop? (see attached pic) It looks like M8 but isn't...I have just been told yesterday it is 5/16 UNF so went to my local 'JR Webster's and they tried same and it isn't that either? It has been suggested I re tap to M8.

Thanks in advance

Gaz

 

[johnwardle]

Yes, this has been driving me nuts for ages!

Can anyone please put me out of my/your misery and identify the type of thread used that is found in the framework of the workshop? (see attached pic) It looks like M8 but isn't...I have just been told yesterday it is 5/16 UNF so went to my local 'JR Webster's and they tried same and it isn't that either? It has been suggested I re tap to M8.

Thanks in advance

Gaz

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]112826[/ATTACH]

c

 

Have you tried 5/16 BSF? a lot of people think that BSF & UNF are the same. They have a different thread pitch and are not compatible. As your workshop body was made in Britain, probably some time ago I think that BSF fixings would have been used. If for some reason they aren't BSF, drop me a PM letting me know how many & what length you need as I still have a bucket full of bolts left over when I converted my Radio Repair body to a camper.

Edited February 9, 2016 by johnwardle
More added

[fv1609]

I have parts catalogue in front of me FAESP 2510-C-030-711 but its a bit difficult to see as my viewer is packed away & I'm holding up hand viewer to the light.

 

Can you indicate about how many of these fixings there are? Knowing that will make it easier than just squinting trying to read one line at a time.

[fv1609]

I've persevered & can't find anything would correspond.

 

I have also gone through COSA Section W5 that has a lot of vehicular workshop, frames, tables, fittings etc but nothing there.

 

The trouble is even finding it might only result in a NSN with no mention of a thread!

[DafT 244]

I've persevered & can't find anything would correspond.

 

I have also gone through COSA Section W5 that has a lot of vehicular workshop, frames, tables, fittings etc but nothing there.

 

Hi fv1609, Thank you very much for your time and quick reply!

I have 2 data plates on the body...there is one mentioning the NSN number but it's blank on the plate!

I have found this info (on here): C 039/23 Shop Equipment, Electronic Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/5. Misc.Instr.No.1.Apr.1982

and it seems my 'box' is thirty four years old! The other data plate says FV727343 on it!

Having mostly stripped the formica covered hardboard, it looks to me this was a later mod from all the swarf that I have found behind it!

Here are the pics of the data plates.

Cheers

Gaz

 

 

[DafT 244]

c

 

Have you tried 5/16 BSF?

 

Hi John and thanks for the quick reply!

5/16 BSF...That's going back a bit isn't it?

I am doing the same as you with the conversion to a motorhome/camper...

there must be a couple of hundred at least, all I want to do is identify what thread they are so I can use the existing holes where my cupboards etc need to be secured!

Today,I have eliminated 5/16 UNF as a contender so will order a handful of cheap bolts off Ebay and try them!

And thank you for your kind offer! It's easy to get obsessed with things like this isn't it?

Cheers

Gaz

[johnwardle]

Hi John and thanks for the quick reply!

5/16 BSF...That's going back a bit isn't it?

I am doing the same as you with the conversion to a motorhome/camper...

there must be a couple of hundred at least, all I want to do is identify what thread they are so I can use the existing holes where my cupboards etc need to be secured!

Today,I have eliminated 5/16 UNF as a contender so will order a handful of cheap bolts off Ebay and try them!

And thank you for your kind offer! It's easy to get obsessed with things like this isn't it?

Cheers

Gaz

SHi Gaz, I see you are from Cheshire, I have to do a delivery/collection at MOD Sealand on Thursday, is that anywhere near you? If so I could bring you some bolts up.

[DafT 244]

is that anywhere near you? If so I could bring you some bolts up.

 

Hi John, that is so kind! I just need to know the size I am dealing with! Sealand is just 10 mins away from me, you could do your biz and then let me know where to meet.I will bring my section of frame with the tapped threads in, and we can sort which one's fit! Will PM you with my mob no.

Much obliged

Gaz

[Richard Farrant]

Yes, this has been driving me nuts for ages!

Can anyone please put me out of my/your misery and identify the type of thread used that is found in the framework of the workshop? (see attached pic) It looks like M8 but isn't...I have just been told yesterday it is 5/16 UNF so went to my local 'JR Webster's and they tried same and it isn't that either? It has been suggested I re tap to M8.

Thanks in advance

Gaz

 

 

 

Hi Gaz,

It could well be M8, as you originally thought, but a different thread pitch. This is the annoying thing with Metric, at least you know where you are with BSF/BSW or UNF/UNC. You will see the pitch marked on your thread tap. A thread gauge should tell you.

[DafT 244]

Hi Gaz,

It could well be M8, as you originally thought, but a different thread pitch. This is the annoying thing with Metric, at least you know where you are with BSF/BSW or UNF/UNC. You will see the pitch marked on your thread tap. A thread gauge should tell you.

 

Hi Richard, I am thinking it is possible you are right...it may be a metric fine...I know these were tapped after the 'box' was built as there is swarf behind the formica/hardboard cladding!

I don't have any bolts Richard, only the threaded holes, I don't think a thread gauge would fit in the hole!

This is turning into a crusade now Ha Ha!

Gaz

[David Herbert]

In the UK we have largely standardised on the metric course pitch standard - to the point where "M8" is recognised as a single standard. However there is also a metric medium pitch and a metric fine pitch. Looked at quickly, the medium pitch is similar to BSF and the fine pitch looks like UNF, but they are not compatable with either. Metric medium is very common on VW vehicles but almost nowhere else that I have seen.

 

I would have thought it very unlikely that BSF would have been used on anything built or modified after 1982 but we had not then properly settled into metric course as the British standard so anything is possible.

 

David

[DafT 244]

 

I would have thought it very unlikely that BSF would have been used on anything built or modified after 1982 but we had not then properly settled into metric course as the British standard so anything is possible.

 

David

 

Hi David and thanks for the info!

I have just ordered 2 of 5/16 BSF and 8mm Metric Fine (1.0) bolts....For a couple of quid, I will be a bit wiser!

Will keep you posted!

Thanks

Gaz

[Richard Farrant]

In the UK we have largely standardised on the metric course pitch standard - to the point where "M8" is recognised as a single standard. However there is also a metric medium pitch and a metric fine pitch. Looked at quickly, the medium pitch is similar to BSF and the fine pitch looks like UNF, but they are not compatable with either. Metric medium is very common on VW vehicles but almost nowhere else that I have seen.

 

 

 

I remember when the 90/110 Land Rovers came in to army service and at REME workshops we had only limited equipment with metric threads until then and anything required was demanded on the job. So one of supervisors decided to order a selection of metric fasteners for the consumable bins in the workshop. When we came to use the M8 bolts, the nuts were a different pitch!

[ruxy]

It is very common on modern cars to find fine metric threads esp. on suspension components , and the fine pitch selected varies between manufacturers . Often "flange washer hex. nuts" are used , some with integral (but loose until secured) washers of the Bellville type or serrated locking type. The hex. heads of the nuts are smaller than standard metric fixings where you would use - the common size 13mm 17mm 19mm spanner / socket.

 

A Peugeot 10mm flange nut would need a 16mm spanner , IIRC a Ford 10mm flange nut would need a 15mm spanner , also you will find a use for a 18mm spanner ,, small car exhausts (Fiat for example) - often 12mm spanner , bigger car exhaust manifolds etc. 14mm .

 

So - you can see - a full range of sockets / spanners in metric do have a use

Edited February 10, 2016 by ruxy
spelin

[Brucie]

When I was posted to MVEE in late seventies which I still refer as an Alladdins cave for REME mechanics, I worked in the B workshops and knew virtually nothing about nuts, screw or bolt sizes as it was unheard of at the time for any small units to hold any stock of them. The divvy foreman named Eddie would not let me have any at all unless I could tell him the correct size, length,type and pitch and you soon learned very quickly what you needed otherwise you went without and it could be a bit of a challenge considering .the type of vehicles we worked on at MVEE, I did invite Eddie and hi s fellow storeman to my farewell drinks for the knowledge they forced on me

[DafT 244]

Hi Guys, I met with John today and he had kindly brought some bolts with him for me to try on a piece of framework but the answer was no....When I got home, the postman had been and delivered a couple of bolts I had ordered....

Still no luck!

So far, I have tried M8,5/16 UNF,5/16 BSF and lastly M8 Fine (1.0 pitch)...BA only goes to 6mm in diameter so it looks like I will have to try the first suggestion and that was to tap them out to M8...will have a go now and let you know! (Would be a lot simpler I suppose!)

 

 

 

However, I did find some thing that does fit! There are lots of smaller rivnuts installed and i found a bolt that fits perfectly but, here we go again, its NOT Metric Ha ha!

 

 

Regards

Gaz

[DafT 244]

God, that was So easy!

 

 

Many Thanks to you Guys for your time!

Cheers

Gaz

[ruxy]

M8,5/16 UNF,5/16 BSF you should be able to make a educated guess by comparison. You probably just have a strained thread , if it were me - then I would just roll the thread better using a HT bolt , S grade or 8.8 may do it , a cap head screw would be better , gear oil on the threads , enter and screw it in tight. If it fails - then re-tap.

Edited February 11, 2016 by ruxy
spelin

[DafT 244]

M8,5/16 UNF,5/16 BSF you should be able to make a educated guess by comparison. You probably just have a strained thread , if it were me - then I would just roll the thread better using a HT bolt , S grade or 8.8 may do it , a cap head screw would be better , gear oil on the threads , enter and screw it in tight. If it fails - then re-tap.

 

Hi Ruxy! I tried quite a few threads with the bolts expecting the same...I even tried some from the back but no luck there! As you can see from above photo, the tap went through ally and steel really easy!

Cheers

Gaz

[kw573]

I am in Australia (now metric), am rebuilding a USA truck (UNF/UNC), but finding a lot of old standard (BSW/BSF {fromthe mother country!}) bolts/nuts/threads. So I am always juggling these. I avoid BSW/BSF like the plague as it needs its' own set of spanners, and is not right for USA stuff. I throw even new ones in the scrap.

 

The chart below is something I very frequently consult. A thread pitch gauge is also invaluable to me.

 

Except for 1/2", BSW and UNC are more-or-less interchangeable on low tech stuff, eg frame/chassis fittings. There is only 5 deg difference in the thread form.

 

If your threads are not BSW or BSF or UNF or UNC or metric coarse or metric fine, then someone has used a specialist thread on a non-specialist frame, eg, conduit, or cycle, or optic, or pipe or . . . .

Change it to the common thread of the day!

 

 

 

 

 

From one who has been caught a few times!

 

Sam, downunder.

[Richard Farrant]

I am in Australia (now metric), am rebuilding a USA truck (UNF/UNC), but finding a lot of old standard (BSW/BSF {fromthe mother country!}) bolts/nuts/threads. So I am always juggling these. I avoid BSW/BSF like the plague as it needs its' own set of spanners, and is not right for USA stuff. I throw even new ones in the scrap.

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

 

Crikey Sam, throwing BSF bolts away, wish you were near to me I come round to your scrap bin! I use BSF all the time.

 

When we get out of the EU they can take all their damned metric threads back as well

[kw573]

Yes, you'd be welcome to them.

 

There is nothing wrong with BSW/BSF, or Metric, or UNF/UNC.

 

But the major pain is when they are mixed.:nut: