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I have been doing various little jobs on the crane since i last posted, Hoovering all the ****e out of the crane, rebuilt the seat in the crane, sorted the crane engine air filter out and lots of other little jobs.

Today i spent 6 hours welding and grinding a small area of the chassis that had rusted/wasted quite badly.IMG_2437.jpg

Only manager a patch about 5" long, but pleased with the results.

IMG_2435.jpg

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Spotted this little group while trying to find a job sit last week.

Apologies for raking up the past; I have come late to this thread. Would that Class 50 be "Thunderer" by any chance?

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HI Dan

Since we last had contact you prompted me to look at the AEC 0854s more closely what l have found out up to now is chassis numbers 08541323 to1346 were made between FEB 44 and MAY 44 08541366 to 1451 were made between MAY

44 and DEC 44 all for the RAF as up to now all l have looked up are the ones for military use at the moment l cannot find anything on chassis number 08541352

 

 

REGARDS WALLY

 

Wally, I have been trying to trace the history and would like your help. I have had the RLC search for the chassis number O854 1352 with no luck. But there seem to be a bit of an anomaly on the old style log book.

SCN_0001.jpg

Now the chassis number 1344 is very neatly written in the correct place on the logbook. But there is a note on the left hand page stating the chassis number as 1352. Now unfortunately the chassis number is not visible as there is a mounting brakes for the crane over it. The chassis does have this on it.

IMG_2408.jpg

Now the first coat of paint on the crane is clearly Olive Drab, which i think would date it from 1944 or there about. Could the chassis number have been changed or recorded incorrectly? I guess the only real way to tell would be to cut the plate that covers the number off, But if the chassis number on the chassis is not what on the log book then that could open a can of worms. I only really want to try and find the history out.

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I should still have B&A + early Wylie , will have a look in back of my desk. Even 40 years ago they were not easy to come by.

 

 

Did you manage to find the Wylie detail?

We are still looking out for it.

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HI DAN

The number KYW 28 is from a series of registration numbers held by the ministry of supply l have a list of some of this

series of numbers but not all them the contract for your vehicle states that these were ordered by the RAF so first contact

the RAF MUSEUM using the chassis number only to see if they can help the RLC MUSEUM only hold cards for vehicles issued

to the army the log book entry does pose a question about the entries of the chassis number the plate looks right and correct l will try to shed any further light on this question

 

REGARDs WALLY

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Marvellous to see such an 'unusual' vehicle being renovated and used again . I guess everyone would love a tank or something else equally as exoctic but I can well see the attraction and the practicality of having a crane !

 

For many years I had a Coles Argus (think it was an Argus ?) on my yard. I still have the manufacturers plate on my workshop wall, she was built by the 'British Crane and Excavator Corporation of Sunderland' and was serial number 22094 ..........so I think that dates her as being an early 60s model? Supposedly rated at a 6 ton lift she would and often did get called upon to lift much more. Her personal 'best' was a lift of very nearly 11 tons but to do that ?.... and to any H&S fellas out there please don't read or at least please ignore this bit :) ........ I ran the one side of her up onto a ramp made of railway sleepers, 2 high......... then slewed her round to that side so that the whole crane was tilted backwards before I started.....then we backed the low loader under the jib and away you go :) ..

It's the 'point of balance' that will stop a Coles Cranes lifting more...

The actual lift hoists / motors etc seem to be capable of lifting way more than their factory rating of 6 tons or whatever they may be. In the case of this big lift all I did was hoist the load up so that the low loader trailer could pull out from underneath her...I certainly wouldn't have tried slewing or 'travelling' the crane with such a load on the hook.

The only time I very nearly came to proper grief and had her over?.... was due to what you mentioned above , unlevel ground ....Ironically this was with a very small, (probably less than half ton) load on the hook. What happened was :) ......... Travelling across my yard with a small cylindrical tank on the hook one front wheel went into a particularly deep pothole which caused her to 'dip' suddenly and unexpectedly sway that way ....this caused the small load to swing in that direction like a pendulum........then as the offending front wheel came up out of the pothole this caused the crane to lurch back the other way ..with the effect that the load which had swung way WAY out of the 'circle of lift' ( for want of a better description) came swinging back in the opposite direction and going WAY out of the circle of lift to the other side .....She lurched so badly that she lifted the 'outside' wheel each time the load swung....acting automatically I lifted my foot off the travel pedal which then also caused the load then to swing 'forwards' violently on account of how suddenly I had stopped and then to come hurtling back to wards the cab and colliding violently with the RSJ frame we'd thankfully cobbled onto the front of her many years before to protect the radiator and cab from such a foreseen but unexpected event :) ........It all got very hairy as I couldn't decide whether to abandon ship out of the open door or to stay put or to try and leap out of the window to my left and make my escape across the top of the engine housing .... the way the load was swinging and the crane lurching I couldn't actually decide which way to try and go as the way my luck usually runs is whichever way I went would surely have been the way she finally decided to go over :)

 

Thankfully things did calm down as the weight of the crane finally overcome the exaggerated effect of the pendulum like swinging load..... but it was a very 'interesting' 30 seconds or so and one that I will never forget :) The lesson that day I guess was 'Be thou aware of complacency' :) .....When setting out to lift what we know is a big load I think we'd always be careful ......but it was the complacency that day of it being a very small load and shifting that little tank from one side of the yard to the other was something I didn't even think of ...

.. So ...you are very correct to wary ....watch out for potholes and any other discrepancy in the ground you may lift and travel over ! :)

Edited by RattlesnakeBob
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The other odd thing is that under the penciled amendment for the chassis number it states the colour as Yellow. I have now done a fair bit of work on the vehicle and at no time have i seen the colour yellow. The first coat over the undercoat is drab green, then Deep bronze green and then red.

I know from the log book that the first registered keeper in 1950 was the Ministry of Supply, the next was The Department of Atomic Energy and then The Atomic Energy Authority.

Now could it be that the Ministry of Supply took it from Surplus RAF stock? and registered it for road use in 1950?

I really could do with finding the stamped chassis number. I have looked, but it is not in the same place as my Matador.

Does anyone know where to find the chassis number on an AEC O854?

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Marvellous to see such an 'unusual' vehicle being renovated and used again . I guess everyone would love a tank or something else equally as exoctic but I can well see the attraction and the practicality of having a crane !

 

For many years I had a Coles Argus (think it was an Argus ?) on my yard. I still have the manufacturers plate on my workshop wall, she was built by the 'British Crane and Excavator Corporation of Sunderland' and was serial number 22094 ..........so I think that dates her as being an early 60s model? Supposedly rated at a 6 ton lift she would and often did get called upon to lift much more. Her personal 'best' was a lift of very nearly 11 tons but to do that ?.... and to any H&S fellas out there please don't read or at least please ignore this bit :) ........ I ran the one side of her up onto a ramp made of railway sleepers, 2 high......... then slewed her round to that side so that the whole crane was tilted backwards before I started.....then we backed the low loader under the jib and away you go :) ..

It's the 'point of balance' that will stop a Coles Cranes lifting more...

The actual lift hoists / motors etc seem to be capable of lifting way more than their factory rating of 6 tons or whatever they may be. In the case of this big lift all I did was hoist the load up so that the low loader trailer could pull out from underneath her...I certainly wouldn't have tried slewing or 'travelling' the crane with such a load on the hook.

The only time I very nearly came to proper grief and had her over?.... was due to what you mentioned above , unlevel ground ....Ironically this was with a very small, (probably less than half ton) load on the hook. What happened was :) ......... Travelling across my yard with a small cylindrical tank on the hook one front wheel went into a particularly deep pothole which caused her to 'dip' suddenly and unexpectedly sway that way ....this caused the small load to swing in that direction like a pendulum........then as the offending front wheel came up out of the pothole this caused the crane to lurch back the other way ..with the effect that the load which had swung way WAY out of the 'circle of lift' ( for want of a better description) came swinging back in the opposite direction and going WAY out of the circle of lift to the other side .....She lurched so badly that she lifted the 'outside' wheel each time the load swung....acting automatically I lifted my foot off the travel pedal which then also caused the load then to swing 'forwards' violently on account of how suddenly I had stopped and then to come hurtling back to wards the cab and colliding violently with the RSJ frame we'd thankfully cobbled onto the front of her many years before to protect the radiator and cab from such a foreseen but unexpected event :) ........It all got very hairy as I couldn't decide whether to abandon ship out of the open door or to stay put or to try and leap out of the window to my left and make my escape across the top of the engine housing .... the way the load was swinging and the crane lurching I couldn't actually decide which way to try and go as the way my luck usually runs is whichever way I went would surely have been the way she finally decided to go over :)

 

Thankfully things did calm down as the weight of the crane finally overcome the exaggerated effect of the pendulum like swinging load..... but it was a very 'interesting' 30 seconds or so and one that I will never forget :) The lesson that day I guess was 'Be thou aware of complacency' :) .....When setting out to lift what we know is a big load I think we'd always be careful ......but it was the complacency that day of it being a very small load and shifting that little tank from one side of the yard to the other was something I didn't even think of ...

.. So ...you are very correct to wary ....watch out for potholes and any other discrepancy in the ground you may lift and travel over ! :)

What a great story and a happy ending, with some good advice thrown in. I alway air on the side of caution, but like you say you really need to watch for complacency.

I have done a few lifts with my old girl now and she seems very stable. I have not tried moving with a load yet. I think that if i do it will only ever be with the load at the back.

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Remember that it is important to keep the load as near the ground as possible so that if it does get too hairy you can put it down very quickly! Also it is - of course - a good idea to have at the very least a couple of helpers with tag lines to keep the load under control.

 

With my Iron Fairy 6, if I have to travel any distance, I jib-in until the load is resting against the front of the crane and secure it with a ratchet strap or similar so that it can't swing.

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Remember that it is important to keep the load as near the ground as possible so that if it does get too hairy you can put it down very quickly! Also it is - of course - a good idea to have at the very least a couple of helpers with tag lines to keep the load under control.

 

With my Iron Fairy 6, if I have to travel any distance, I jib-in until the load is resting against the front of the crane and secure it with a ratchet strap or similar so that it can't swing.

 

I have driven a MK6 Iron Fairy. They are quite unique. More like a forklift with a jib. you can't help moving with a load as the slew is so limited. Bloody useful bit of kit for getting into tight spaces and low hight. There really is nothing like them.

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"The British Crane and Excavator Corporation of Sunderland"

 

Sounds like a proper old school company name, from way back when we did quality engineering. Conjures up a vision of big old factory, high walls with loads of windows. Big chimney belching smoke. And crowds of workers coming out the front gates just after the knocking off hooter sounded. All looking like some forgotten Lowry painting.

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Hello,

 

The AEC 0854 chassis number is on the nearside chassis rail like the Matador but is usually located higher up. Although in my experience it tends to be partially obscured by one of the crane bed mounting brackets.

 

Ian.

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Hello,

 

The AEC 0854 chassis number is on the nearside chassis rail like the Matador but is usually located higher up. Although in my experience it tends to be partially obscured by one of the crane bed mounting brackets.

 

Ian.

 

Thanks for that, I will take another look on Monday.

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  • 3 months later...

I know its not green but.

 

Our Coles 15t Crane has just been completed after 3 years.

Full brake gear overhaul, All motors checked.

Major jib repairs done by contractor.

All Lub points cleaned out and renewed.

Cab electrics rewired.

Coles DE2524 Newbridge NYMR.jpg

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  • 1 year later...

Hello 

I am an ex RAF Aero Engine Fitter AWDS & 74 Squadron, 1954 -61, Retired Mechanical development Engineer and serious model maker.

I am looking for Three view drawings, dimensions & specifications for the WW2  RAF AEC 6 x 6 6 & 10 ton Coles cranes. 

I cannot find anything on Google and would appreciate any help  even with the dimensions wheel sizes and crane details.   

Thanks in advance 

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Mike, I can help with wheels, they are 20" in diameter and 10" wide and consist of two bolt together sections, one is about 3" and the other about 7". the front wheels are fitted with the 3" section on the outside while the rears have the 7" section on the outside.  The two sections are held together with 20 bolts and the wheels are retained on the hubs with 10 studs.  There are also 4 additional holes in the rims to clear the nuts that retain the drums. Tyres  were usually 14.00x20 although I have seen a Matador specification which mentions 13.5x20  

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@radiomike7

Thanks for that - very useful Notes

What I really need are Length Height Width dimensions and a three view scale drawing of the 6 x 6 chassis with the Crane fitted which would be  more accurate than mine are have done a side view from photos.  Asfar as I can see Plastic modellers never talk about scale drawings let alone do any or publish them 

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AEC 6x6 is basically a pre war 6x4 fitted with a Matador front axle, There is a dispparity in differential ratios this is corrected with a special transfer box. I think it was very early Matadors that were fitted with the 13.5.20 tyres.

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Thank you  I know that BUT I have not seen any drawings of a 6 x 4 on the Google-bug,  so I have been asking for drawings preferably OR dimensions of the Coles Crane version Chassis at least,  to get the accurate wheel base dimensions and possible Length Width and Height  to see any variation from a standard 4 x 4 Matty wrecker - if any -  rather than do my own DIY drawings by Guess-tonomy :-)      

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Thanks John How true but meanwhile I have asked the Meccano fraternity 

Here's my website - not updated since 2006 as it used to be run for me FOC as I am not too clever with Computers and  hopeless with website design stuff.

Even the so called Easy DIY ones may as well be written in Martian & Klingon :-)  

   http://hisg.50webs.com/ 

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