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Ferret engine seized, anyone got some top tips to free it off?


Rubberduck
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Hi

What's the best way to un seize a stuck b60 engine? I've got a 3 foot long socket on the starting dog nut but I don't want to put too much force on it as it seems a bit weak. Has anyone stripped the threads on one before? I've got the bores soaking in diesel so help lubricate it. After that it's the head of or engine out me thinks.

 

Thanks for the help.

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Hi

What's the best way to un seize a stuck b60 engine? I've got a 3 foot long socket on the starting dog nut but I don't want to put too much force on it as it seems a bit weak. Has anyone stripped the threads on one before? I've got the bores soaking in diesel so help lubricate it. After that it's the head of or engine out me thinks.

 

Thanks for the help.

 

Depends where it has seized, could be crank bearings, pistons seized due to lack of oil or just rusty.

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Buy a cheap borescope, or at the very least pull the plugs and look down the bores from every angle you can.

You might have a stuck valve, or something else that forcing will make much worse.

 

Assuming you are sure it's just stuck from light rust and inertia I'd suggest pulling the rocker cover and lubricating and then thumping on each valve so they all move. Try something lighter than diesel, "Kroil" works better than I'd have expected.

 

Then rocking it back and forth. If you are really determined I've used an impact gun to good effect in similar situations but often by that time you are resigned to stripping the motor down anyway.

 

good luck,

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When you have put your 'Freeing Agent' of choice down the bores. Jack the vehicles rear up on the starting handle.

I have done this successfully a number of times.

 

The combination of the 'Lube' etc. Trying to get past the pistons. & the vehicles own weight trying to turn the engine

Via the starting handle.

Is a good combination to unstick in many cases.

 

It might go in an Hour, it might take a month! But, USUALLY unless Badly seized. Then do in most cases free off.

It is then easy to see as the vehicle will drop back down to it's 'Normal sitting profile'.

 

It's easy to do. And on any repair, Always try the Easy method first! You might just save your self a LOT of work?.....:undecided:

Edited by ferretfixer
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The tops of the pistons look a little rusty. I've fed it with diesel over the last few days. I'll try warming some light oil and see if that help. Hope it frees off.

Is their any point taking off the flywheel to get a better grip further in? Can't find an exploded diagram of the b60 engine to see. Not much point undoing all those castle nuts to find even less grip.

Thanks.

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I get the impression from the way you have just posted. That the engine is OUT of the vehicle? Is this the case?

In which case, you MIGHT like to try putting a heavy duty pipe wrench on the starter dog. & a length of pipe on the handle with a VERY Heavy weight on the end of the pipe. Your 'Freeing Agent' of choice down the bores, & leave to 'cook'. For however long it might take to do the job.

 

If you were to do the 'Warm oil' method. I wouldn't waste my time with making it 'warm'.

I would get the oil as HOT as you possibly can, SAFELY! because as soon as you pour it down the bores.

The heat transference leaking away into the metal. Will draw a LOT of the heat away. The Hotter you can get the oil (SAFELY!) The better your chances are for the heat to expand the metal so allowing the pistons to free enough. For the oil to bypass them. And lubricate the bores.

 

Just my own thoughts on this difficulty............:undecided:

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Wow what an amazing bbq you have. I've seen this done before and will probably be on cards if it don't free of before then.

I've been told tipping a drop of petrol in the bores with the sparks out and then lighting it can result in a quick and sudden jolt that can help free it of. Might try that before the hot oil method.

Does anyone know if there is anything more substantial to grip after the starting dog?

Engine is still in the ferret but it's looking more likely it's going to have to come out. Only good side I can give the engine bay a clean. It's inches deep in crud. I'll post a pic later on.

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I subscribe to the boiling burnt oil poured down the plugholes technique, worked for me a couple of times.

Heat a pail of it over a primus stove and gently gently aiming the plughole!

 

Do so at your own risk etc.

 

Alec.

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When you have put your 'Freeing Agent' of choice down the bores. Jack the vehicles rear up on the starting handle.

I have done this successfully a number of times.

 

The combination of the 'Lube' etc. Trying to get past the pistons. & the vehicles own weight trying to turn the engine

Via the starting handle.

Is a good combination to unstick in many cases.

 

It might go in an Hour, it might take a month! But, USUALLY unless Badly seized. Then do in most cases free off.

It is then easy to see as the vehicle will drop back down onto it's rear wheels.

 

It's easy to do. And on any repair, Always try the Easy method first! You might just save your self a LOT of work?.....:undecided:

 

Really? I did a quick calculation. I guess it would take 2000 to 3000 lb jack force to lift the rear end of a ferret up by jacking on the crank handle. The handle is, what, 1" diameter, with a 12" offset? The shear stress would twist the handle like a pretzel. What am I missing?

 

Malcolm

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Really? I did a quick calculation. I guess it would take 2000 to 3000 lb jack force to lift the rear end of a ferret up by jacking on the crank handle. The handle is, what, 1" diameter, with a 12" offset? The shear stress would twist the handle like a pretzel. What am I missing?

 

Malcolm

 

 

Yes Malcomb, REALLY!....I have bent a couple of jack handle's doing this. BUT, it worked & the handles were bent back into original profile. Under a hydraulic press afterwards.

 

Forget your calculations & TRY it! ( the wheels do NOT have to come off the floor. Just as long as you have a huge amount of pressure on the handle. Forcing weight to the crank via the dog)

 

You DONT have to keep jacking until the handle until it 'Twist's like a pretzel' as you put it!.....:undecided:

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If its seized in the bore Coke and brake fluid cocktail is worth a try .

If you have access to a steam cleaner make up some unions and run it through the water jacket it will bring the engine gently up to running temperature .

The expansion may free it off and its better than using force .

Failing that I would do a strip down to avoid damage

 

 

Steve Clifton

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Some fantastic tips thanks. I'll probably end up trying them all if needs be. Still unsure how much force I put on the starter dog. Looks as if it has a gap before it gets chance to lock

1436983959775-2109977424.jpg

Edited by Rubberduck
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Lack of use I imagine. Only had it a few weeks and it's history is a bit vague. I was told it came of an army base in South Wales. A major had it for a while and we think it was used as a gate guardian at some point. Got plenty of other jobs to be doing so not in a major rush. Need to get it road registered yet!

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Have to say if it was me I would not use any of the methods requiring force or shock, unless I knew I was going to dismantle the engine - you don't know where it's seized and you don't know what will give.

 

Often an engine that's seized through lack of use does so because the rings have stuck in the bores. It takes very little rust for this to happen - not enough to damage the engine - but it takes very little force to break a ring, and the consequences of then running with a broken ring can be major and expensive. Soaking and heating will usually free things off without needing force.

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  • 1 month later...

Having just freed off my fuel tank, I can confirm that there are only the 4 mounting bolts inside the fighting compartment. I put a tyre lever between the bottom of the tank and the top of the gearbox and gave a little wiggle and it came free. Don't forget to remove the level sensor (which will not clear the rear hull during removal), the tank filler and the breather pipe on top of the tank (inside the fighting compartment). I did find that I had to remove the fuel pipes from the bottom of the tanks as they fouled things.

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  • 7 months later...
Removing the crank shaft to free the pistons out of the bores. The end shown in the pic does this have to be pulled from the crank shaft end to aid extraction? I take it a large puller will do the job?

 

Thanks.

 

There is a special puller to remove the crank pulley as an assembly. It screws into the pulley after removal of securing sleeve/starting dog then a screw in the centre pushes onto the end of the crank. If you do not have access to one of these pullers then you will have to improvise with another puller, or make one. There is no way you will remove the crank without doing this as timing cover has to come off as well.

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