thedawnpatrol Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Hello Guys Having now been able to play with the Norton and BSA at Beltring a bit, well, the BSA, as I broke the Norton within the first day ! But with some great help from one of our North Oxford and Cotswolds MVT member, we got the M20 running after 20 odd years of not ! I must say, i have been bitten by the bug, and am considering taking my Bike test just so i can ride one on the road. Whilst looking into the procedure of taking a test, i was informed that if the bike was 'old' and was below 14.6 BHP then i could ride it on a provisional licence, all be it with 'L' plates, The Norton's BHP is 14, although it is a 500cc bike. The Law states for a provisional licence the bike has to be either 125cc or below 14.6 BPH So, although it would spoil the look to have 'L' plates at least thats a start until i take my full test in the future ? Any comments on this ? is this correct or do i have the wrong end of the stick ? Cheers Jules Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Whatever you do you will need the Compolsury Basic Training ticket. Might as well do the full test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 You have the wrong end of the stick! I'm not aware of any loopholes regarding older bikes as all of the bike learner laws now focus on engine capacity rather than power alone. You will need to complete a CBT before you are allowed on the road. If you passed your car driving test before 1 February 2001 then you can ride a moped (50cc and below) on L plates on that licence, but to ride anything bigger you will need to do the CBT. If you have a full car licence you may ride motorcycles up to 125 cc and 11 kW power output, with L plates but you must still do the CBT course. You will then need to do your bike test before being able to ride anything bigger. If you want to ride the Norton then you'll need to do the A test. Quoting from the links below.... "There are two types of full motorcycle licence: a light motorcycle licence (A1), which restricts riders to any bike up to 125 cc and a power output of 11 kW a standard motorcycle licence (A), is obtained if the practical test is taken on a bike of over 120 cc but not more than 125 cc and capable of at least 100 kilometres per hour (km/h per hour).. After passing the standard motorcycle practical test, you will be restricted for two years to riding a bike of up to 25 kW and a power/weight ratio not exceeding 0.16 kW/kg. After this you may ride any size of bike." http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/LearnerAndNewDrivers/RidingMotorcyclesAndMopeds/index.htm http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/LearnerAndNewDrivers/RidingMotorcyclesAndMopeds/DG_4022568 If you wanted to ride anything more powerful within that 2 years then you would need to take a direct access course, but the Norton should be well within the 25kW limit! [h=4][/h] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike65 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Assuming you are over 21 there is the direct access scheme If you are going to do it you might as well get a license with no restriction [h=4]Direct access scheme[/h]Direct access is a scheme which allows a person over the age of 21 to avoid the two year/25 kiloWatt (kW) restriction by taking a test on a machine of at least 35 kW (46.6 brake horse power (bhp)). A pass allows you to ride any size of bike. Any instruction given on a machine that exceeds the normal learner motorcycle specification must be supervised at all times by a certified motorcycle instructor who should be in radio contact. You should also wear fluorescent or reflective clothing and follow all other provisional licence restrictions. However this does present a problem. You will need a more poerful bike to take the test on.:shocked: Mind you the other route would be OK as the 2 years of low powered motorcycle riding 25kW (33 BHP) still exceeds what you want to ride. The restriction is power and not engine capacity. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
private mw Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 direct access works better then you can ride anything thats what i did ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
79x100 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 The law is of course an ass as you'll have to learn to ride with Japanese standardised controls and then re-learn with a proper right-foot shift and 'one up and the rest down' pattern. By the way, if you're getting 14bhp out of the Norton, can you list your tuning mods as they only left the factory with 12 ! They have a bit less power than the M20 but generally better gearing for maintaining main road speeds on a gradient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedawnpatrol Posted August 4, 2011 Author Share Posted August 4, 2011 Thanks Guys, your all right, i need to do it properly. 79x100, i got the 14bhp from a web page on 16h's ! Cheers Jules Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NHSbiker Posted August 27, 2011 Share Posted August 27, 2011 (edited) Sadly the last Govt made a right mess with the change of the main bike test in 2 parts. Do your CBT which is approx £90 - £100. As you are over 21 yes you can do your Direct Access, but it means paying out £500 - £1000 for a 4 or 5 day course where you do your intensive training on a 500cc or 600 cc bike from 9am - 4pm for those days and then take the test on the last day. However some people have to travel 50 - 60 miles with the instructor to do the off road hazard swerve test on a test centre built for that purpose. However the new test is in 2 parts as you have to do the off road hazard swerve test and then do the main road test. This came in to play a few years back, however there have been no end of accidents on the off road hazard swerve test that the Govt have been advised to change the test back to the old Direct Access method. So what I would advise you to do, is a) Get provisional motorcycle entitlement on your licence if you haven't already got it. b) Take your motorcycle theory test - Yes you have to take it is the law, even if you took the driving theory test. c) Do your CBT on a 125 it is vaild for 2 years so you can ride a bike no bigger than a 125 for 2 years on L plates (Not allowed to carry pillion) d) Wait until the DfT change the bike test back to what it was before then take your Direct Access on a 500 or 600 bike, which should be done by then. After 2 years is up, if you wish you can re do your CBT assuming you have not taken your main bike test. Which is new as you couldn't years ago, as back then if you didn't take your test within that 2 years, you had to wait another 2 years to re take your CBT and then do your test. I did my old DAS with Circuit Based Training when they were at Donington Park. They are now at Mallory Park. Edited August 27, 2011 by NHSbiker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Farrant Posted August 27, 2011 Share Posted August 27, 2011 Glad I took my test in the good old days, when the examiner watched you from the roadside. He told me to go around the block until he stopped me, on second circuit, I spotted him queueing in the bakers shop !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted August 27, 2011 Share Posted August 27, 2011 Glad I took my test in the good old days, when the examiner watched you from the roadside. He told me to go around the block until he stopped me, on second circuit, I spotted him queueing in the bakers shop !!! My test was just like that too!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David B. Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 Glad I took my test in the good old days, when the examiner watched you from the roadside. He told me to go around the block until he stopped me, on second circuit, I spotted him queueing in the bakers shop !!! On the morning of my test I had to borrow a BSA C12 with a clutch that was either in or out and a fibreglass fairing that gave virtually no steering lock. In torrential rain my examiner sent me up a sidestreet to do a U-turn while he watched,huddled under his umbrella at the end of the road. My only chance of turning round without stalling was to pull into the driveway entrance of a large house and out of the exit. After the test, the examiner remarked " A very neat U-turn showing good machine control " and passed me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike65 Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 I took mine when they had just brought in the 125 learner rule and the old 2 part test. Part 1 was ride around some cones and the only real way of doing it was with a rider training course. The second part was on the road with a vloke standing on the street corner. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scammellmark Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 hi. would like to pass on my experience. firstly i have always taken a number bikes to shows,alongside my scammell. then i was made aware that the show site,when open to the public,is a public place, and the bike is subject to the road traffic act,ie road legal. so should be insured,for this it must be taxed,moted and operated by a licence holder. so iam afraid you will have to do as i did and bite the bullit. i now dont take more than 2 bikes to any show. this is in part because of kids and youths jumping all over them,and in case one falls over on some kid. so even on static display they could be a liability. personaly i dont travel alone or far on my wm20,as it is not safe in modern traffic. and it would be a shame after surviving 70 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RattlesnakeBob Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 loving the recollections of old bike tests.. ..mine was a bit of laugh too....At the test station I went to the examiner usually followed you around a route on his own motorcycle observing your riding etc....but.....on the day I turned up for my test his bike had broke down.... so.... the tester fella asked if I had any objections to him following me in a car? if so, you could re-arrange your test for another day but ...seeing as I didn't wanna hang about anymore waiting to 'get legal' ....I said "no thats fine by me" and we set off ..... I followed a route that he told me to ....."up to the next roundabout straight over turn, left at the T junction" etc..........and as the traffic was really heavy in that part of town I very easily (and legally and safely) left him way behind after less than a couple of minutes............ I did as he'd asked though and waited for him about 3 miles up the road and sat on the bike having a fag whilst he took another 15 minutes or so to appear.....when he eventually arrived he said something along the lines of... "this is bloody useless son...you seem pretty sensible....do me a U turn here and get the emergency stop done and we'll head on back...." He arrived back at the test station once again at least 10 or 15 minutes or more behind me and said " lovely riding young man ..keep it up and you shouldn't have any problems" Befire he told you if you'd passed or not he always tried the same old trick though... I'd been advised by mates that he'd always ask the same question to every person before finally passing them..." what is sensible clothing to wear on a motorcycle?" and you had no chance of a 'pass' if you remembered everything you could think of but failed to mention "a helmet" ! I made sure I did and replied "well ..I think a helmet is the most important item of all !" ... ...to which the wily old fella gave a subtle little smile and handed over my pass ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griff66 Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 when i did my test it was just ride round the block and instructor would jump out in front so u could do emergency stop all was fine got license ,then heard story of lad doing same test examiner jumped out bloke on bike crashes into examiner ,turns out it was not the guy doing the test!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
79x100 Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 personaly i dont travel alone or far on my wm20,as it is not safe in modern traffic. and it would be a shame after surviving 70 years. I'm a little puzzled Mark. What is it about the M20 that you consider makes it unsafe in modern traffic ? The 16H has a pretty similar performance and I ride mine as often as I can, mostly alone. Obviously, motorways are things to avoid but it'll stand the odd blast to 60mph. On-road presence is much better than many modern scooter things and I regularly scrape my boots so the cornering can't be too bad. With modern linings, the brakes are safe, if not startling in their power. I honestly don't find bikes of this era a problem if ridden in an assertive but defensive manner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scammellmark Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 hi. i like riding the old m20, and i have held a steady 55-60 over distances of up to 80 miles. problem is with other drivers/riders, who have no patience and overtake/undertake at the daftest times. from past experiences, i have been forced of the road when a car and caravan overtook me at over 60,then pulled in with the caravan alongside me, i braked but the caravan clipped my bars and sent me into a stone wall. on more than 1 occasion cars have overtaken,only to then slam on the brakes,also bike riders undertaking and overtaking(no mirrors) on corners. i also driver a scammell constructor, towing 2 or more trailers, all up 9ft 6 wide and upto 96ft long.being a biker makes me very aware of all hazards, and in 12years i have not as much as clipped a kerb. i also own and ride 2 military police bikes, i have no such problems when riding these !!!! i do preffer to ride to arrive safe. so i prefer the pans. all fun, just different kind. mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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