Sidewinder

Just been out to warm the 432 up after the long cold weekend, and discovered she can levitate snowballs! Always knew there was something 'mystical' about it! Picture to follow if I can work out how to get the photo off my phone and onto the computer!

Sorry to chuck water on your bonfire, but as stated in an earlier post your 432 is not road legal, even if it is already road registered regardless of what fuel/tax/insurance you might have. They do not comply with construction and use regulations in that fact that they are overwidth, and do not have a separate steering, braking and secondary braking system. These vehicles were registered by mistake, now you might well get away with fooling your average copper if you get pulled, but get involved in an accident in one of these and they'll bend you over a barrel. One of the reasons I won't run mine on the road, if you've not any land to use it on if you've not already bought it I'd save your cash. Not trying to ruin your night, just save you from a lot of aggro in the future. Plenty of information on this forum about them not being road legal. Cheers, James

Trying not to take too much of a the glass is half empty view, but as you said yourself it is a 'hobby'. Most of us want to drive these vehicles on the road for the enjoyment of ourselves and others, not for any particular purpose. We do not NEED to drive them on the road, there are other ways of transporting them to and from shows. Ways that are legal, such as on the back of a low-loader. As such if the vehicles don't meet the required standards (of which we're taking pretty important issues such as steering and braking, not just little niggles). Are the politicians really going to rewrite the laws to accommodate what is a pretty small minority, just so we can go for a jolly every now and again when, as stated in previous posts we really have no real grounds for running them on the road in the first place?Sorry, but I don't think so. However, if we are going to try and fight this, which despite the underlying theme of this post I'm not against , we do need to get organised and get as much weight behind us as possible. I'm not trying to be negative, but if we are to have a chance of succeeding then we need to be prepared for and understand the arguments that will be used against us. OK, just for example we might entertain and educate the public, but it makes no difference at all whether the vehicle is driven there or transported to the show on a flatbed. We might be preserving history, but again does that require having to drive it on the road...? As it is I am struggling to justify a reason for having no other choice than driving it on the road, other than our own personal fun which unfortunately, I can't imagine will make a good arguement for convincing the politians and anti's. James

I think I have to agree Robin. It is looking increasingly likely no more tracked vehicles will be allowed to be registered, and that those that have were done by mistake. I tore up my V55/5 application a long time ago for my 432 without even taking it to the DVLA, yes I'm a bit annoyed, but that's life. Yes, I would have loved to taken it for a spin on the road on a summers afternoon, and no doubt a lot of people do enjoy that pleasure. How their vehicles ended registered, well thats their business, but my intereptation of all my research/reading is that its doubtful that they are legal. Speaking strictly for myself I certainly don't want to be the person who ends up testing the legal system and setting a precident by having an accident in one of these things. I think unfortunately low-loaders and private land is looking increasingly like the future, as Withams et al do clearly state! James

I imagine because they are registered in catergories that make allowances for things like C&U but as a result heavily limit there use, or have other restrictions on the them that would not be appropriate for trying to use a track MV on the road. When you think about it, yes, you do see mini-diggers and other tracked plant by the road side, but they don't actually travel between job sites, perhaps maybe just a few hundred meters around the site itself. James

The dual circuit brakes makes sense, as you say if one circuit fails you'll still have braking on either the front or rear axle, as found on all modern cars. However, I'm sure I've owned several Series Land Rover's (a long time ago now so the memory might be playing tricks) that only had single circuit brakes. So if you loose a brake line/wheel cylinder the whole lot goes.. surely that means there's quite a few Landy's driving about out there that don't meet C&U regs? Think the best way, as said, is just to get it booked in for a voluntary inspection. I'd want to know one way or another, that it definitely was legal before taking it on the road regardless of whether the DVLA had registered it or not. In this day and age, its just not worth the risk. If somebody got hurt and they later found the vehicle to be non-compliant, I wouldn't want to be in your shoes. One of the reasons it makes me angry that even now there is a 432 on eBay for sale as a limo service! James

Right, so it sounds as though the quality of the kits isn't an issue. But as a not very experienced modeller, my skills in putting it together could well be, and as you say no point in wasting money. What exactly are the skills and tools needed to work with these materials then? Are they vastly different from plastic kits? James

Just wondering, and maybe I am being a bit niave, but could it be worth writing a polite letter to the Secretary of State (Theresa May? As if I understand correctly she has the power to grant exemptions?) explaining the situation that essentially we are a responsible hobby, who get a lot of joy from our vehicles and in turn give a lot back to the general public in the form of shows, events and fundraising etc. That mostly we do very little mileage on the road (as previously stated not many people would be willing to take tracked armour on much more than a 10 mile round trip) perhaps a few times a year. And that we maintain and restore our vehicles to very high standard and would represent a tiny percentage of total road traffic, of whom, judging by what I saw on my 60 miles of motorway driving tonight, mostly don't deserve to ride a push-bike let alone be allowed a driving licence! Although maybe miss that last bit out! But you get the idea, just generally putting across our message as has been stating in previous posts.. James

Thanks for that Andy. It would appear so, there's still a little bit left to clear out but theres nothing major left in there I don't think. It's been very disappointing all round really. The only thing I've found was a few fired blank SA80 rounds under rear floor by the fuel pump. Oh, and some mouldy shreddies! James

Continuing the clean up and tidying of my 432 since its demob, I removed the drivers floor panel today to clean out god only knows how many years of old oil, grease, sweet wrappers, fag butts etc.. and noticed that of the five grease nipples to the right of the steering tillers the bottom two (nearest the rear door) weren't actually connected to anything as the lines had been cut. Does anybody know where these two grease lines run to? I know they lubricate the steering linkages and bearings, but I can't actually see where they run off to or trace what little remains of the lines. Cheers, James.

Glad to hear the low pressure at tickover isn't necessarily anything to worry about, my oil pressure warning light comes on when the engines hot at a slow idle. My first thought was that the oil may be of the wrong grade and too thin. Was going to change the oil anyway, but sounds like there's no need to worry... yet! James

As a regular driver of steel tracked excavators, steel tracks do cause a lot of damage to tarmac surfaces, and all surfaces for that matter. There are ways of limiting the damage, by doing slow gentle turns etc. Rubber tracks do still screw the ground up but not to nearly the same extent as steel particularly on concrete or tarmac. While yes, you do see excavators by the side/on the road, all the ones I have seen recently either have rubber tracks or steel tracks with rubber pads bolted to the track shoes. Whether this is to limit the damage the contractors vehicles cause to the road (which they would then have to repair at cost to themselves) or because thats what the law says I'm not 100% sure but I would imagine its the latter. Probably one of the reasons for the wheeled 360 excavators 'rubber ducks' being so popular for roadwork. James

Good to hear they are as good as they look then. I'm not too worried about the building of the model, think as long as I take it steady and don't try to rush and built it in one sitting after coming home from the pub it should be alright. Its the painting aspect where I'll fall down, where as you say it'll probably look like its spent a day paintballing! Might start dropping a few hints ready for Christmas then.

I would love to have a well made, detailed model of my 432. I've been looking at the Accurate Amour model kits for this vehicle, which do look very realistic. However, I'm not a massive fan of buying by pictures over the internet, I prefer to see and feel items in the flesh. At the best part of £100 for their FV432 model kit, its not cheap and I don't want to buy one only to find when its built it ends up looking like the cheap plastic model kits you used to do as a kid. Has anyone got any experience/opinions of their models? Cheers, James

When you stick your dirty overalls in the washing machine without realising you'd split some diesel on them... Everything that went in with them now has a faint smell of fuel. I'm now going to go and hide in the shed until she who must be obeyed has cooled down a bit! :blush: And next time I'll check the contents of the washing machine more carefully before just randomly shoving dirty work items in!

Okay, I would love a CVRT, preferably a Scimitar or Sabre, but would settle for a Scorpion. I've found a project Scimitar, not entirely sure of the condition apart from a few photos from which I would say it would need a ground up restoration which I don't have a problem with. It is nearly complete though apart from the RARDEN. Doesn't look as though its had any work done to it so far since it was sold off from the MOD. Track pads look worn right down, am I right in thinking they aren't replacable like on a 432, but you have to replace the whole track? The only downside is the price which is well over what I had in mind, but then I'll admit I don't really know much about the sort of prices they fetch, so what is a reasonable price for a project Scimitar? A year or two ago I could have bought one in running and driving condition and road registered for the same price. Cheers.

Just had a thought, admittedly its not ideal, but it'd be cheap and as far as I can figure wouldn't need planning permission, although I'm prepared to eat humble pie if I'm wrong. Possibly just change of use on the land, depending on what it is at the moment. Two 20ft shipping containers side by side but about 4/6metres apart. Bolt some lengths of timber to the tops of the containers to span the gap then sheet out with corrugated roofing material. Block off one end in the same fashion, and hey presto. Ok, its not completely weather tight, but it'd be cheap, easily moved, you've still got secure storage in the two containers, and it'd help keep some of the wind and rain off. Or have I finally officially gone mad? James

Even if its only used for private storage/workshop? Surely as long as its not used for commercial gain I don't see how they can charge business rates... you're bound to the type of use granted by planning permission, otherwise they tell you to pull it down which I'd have thought would be incentive enough to only use it for what you've got permission for. James

As long as they take the 432 for scrap as well!

Plenty of food for thought, thanks for all the replies so far. Security (or lack of) is definitely something I had I thought (and worried about). All the neighbours and the local farmer are usually pretty switched on to any strange goings on. However, I imagine those steel buildings are pretty vunerable to any pikey with a petrol Stihl saw. I could build a breeze block wall inside the building, but the doors would still be vulnerable so why bother, as I imagine they'd be the first point of attack anyway. I suppose apart from those 12guage blank alarm mines and relying on the neighbours there's not a lot that can be done. Thanks N.O.S, will go and do some research! Cheers, James

Just out of interest, does anyone take tracked armour Poppy collecting? I was thinking the other day after buying mine about getting in contact and offering to take the 432 to our local High Street next year if they were interested. Or is it yet another thing that requires, risk assessments, council approval, public liability insurance etc.. Cheers, James

Realised my mistake as soon as I clicked post, just done some rough costings for a brick building and it made my eyes water! I think a quick chat with the local planning office then and neighbours, see what they all say. With regards to services, should everything go ahead I wasn't going to bother. I think the cost of running an electric/water supply etc to the building would be prohibitive considering how much use the building would actually have. I'd probably just end up settling for a generator to provide power, and a portable gas powered heater. Fingers crossed all will go well, main thing is how much the land owners will want for the land. I'm hoping 4800metre2 of waste land shouldn't be too expensive or am I delusional!? Thanks again, James

Thanks for all the replies so far... To clarify a few points the land isn't in my back garden or anything, its a small hardcored yard in open country side. There are a two houses nearby on the opposite side of the road, but its outside of any village boundaries. That said the site is pretty much well hidden, high trees and hedges as well as being in a dip mean apart from an overgrown gateway from the road you'd never know it was there. I did enquire a few years ago about planning permission from the local council to build a house on the site and was told it'd probably be a no, however an argicultural dwelling/farm building etc would most likely be accepted. I'm fairly confident, that as long as the application was sensible and the building wasn't too intrusive something should be workable. At the end of the day, the land is overgrown, used for flytipping etc so I would imagine the council should be keen to see it tidied up. Hm, I hadn't considered a brick/breeze block construction might be an even cheaper way to go and would match the local character a lot more than a steel building.

For a while now I've needed/wanted a nice warm dry workshop... all my previous projects have had to sit outside and currently my 432 is parked outside in a nice cold muddy quarry which doesn't do it much good, or encourage me to go and work on it. Now not far down the road there is a yard about 40mx120m that is owned by the company I work for, its sat unused since the 60's when it was used by the council as a storage yard for machinery now assuming I could persuade them to part with it, I've been looking at these DIY steel building kits about £5/6k for a 6mx8m workshop with 3.5m wide manual roller shutter door. This seems like pretty good value to me... but bearing in mind the old adage if it seems to good to be true it usually is.. so does anyone have any experience of them? Laying a concrete pad as hard standing I can do relatively cheaply and easily so depending on the price of the land it seems like a fairly easy/cheap way of owning a small yard and workshop. I suppose there's always the possibility of renting out storage/workshop space as well to help fund. Where exactly do I stand with planning permission? I might be imagining it but I'm sure someone told me that because they are a temporary building that bolt to the floor you only need permission for the concrete pad? And I suppose change of use for the land? Cheers, James

Just don't do what my mate did and forget to take all the drill bits out before trying to start the engine. Many happy hours trying to fish bits of broken drill bits out of the timing case before admitting defeat and stripping it all down again.:nut: