schliesser92

Dougy I've just looked at your pictures. The one with the mast is the Radio Relay (RR) version, the other two vehicles looked identical from the outside. The internal view shows the Message Centre vehicle. The other vehicle, with the 20 line automatic exchange, didn't have a lot of room in it. Also, BRUIN has absolutely nothing to do with LARKSPUR or CLANSMAN - these are "steam radio" systems. I'm onto the diagrams, so you'll be able to understand the complexities of the system we came to love and hate during the heyday of the "Cold War" Roger

The idiot's guide to BRUIN: Bruin was a multi-channel , secure commuications system. This involved connecting users (HQs, WHA, WSP) together using communication centres (Comcens). The Radio Relay (RR) systems used were C50/R236 (which operated in the 225-400 MHz range) providing links from Brigade HQ to Comcen (hence the RR versiion of the FV439), and sometimes inter-comcen links (aka Inter-City). At divisional level the C70 was used (560-910 MHz), mainly from Division HQ to Comcen and from the comcen back to Corps level. The system was "secured" by the BID200 (Dakota) system, which gave 6 channels. Usually Channels 1-4 were used via the automatic exchanges (20 line at Brigade, 40 at Division), Channel 5 was "manual intercept" (via the telephone exchanfge in the Message Centre vehicle) and Channel 6 for multi channel telegraphy (Siemens T2100R teleprinter connected via the Telegraph Terminal Voice Frequency (TTVF4/12)). There were a number of comcens, the main ones being: Alpha & Bravo - Main Corps (7 Signal Regt - Herford)) Charlie & Delta - 1st Division (Verden) Echo & Foxtrot - 2nd Division (Bunde) Golf & Hotel - 4th Division (Herford) Uniform (Rear Corps) (22 Signal Regt - Lippstadt) Kilo - logistics train (16 Sig Regt - Krefeld) Whisky - 3rd Division (Bulford, UK) (it was an airportable unit used for BAOR reinforcement then) When 3 Div converted to the Mechanised role, it received another Comcen. Also 21 Signal Regt (Air Formation) had one to deploy with the harrier force in the field. I'll try to do a couple of diagrams - that'll make it easier. Basically - BRUIN was a tactical, multi-channel, secure trunk communications system, whereas PTARMIGAN, although providing secure, multi-channel capability is much more flexible in use, relying on NODES instead of Comcens. ps WHA = Weapons Holding Area, WSP = Weapons Supply Point (references to tactical nuclear weapons dispersal points)

The FV439 was purely BRUIN ! and useed by the following Units: 4 (Guards) Bde HQ & Signal Sqn, 6 (Mech) Bde HQ & Signal Sqn, 7 (Armoured) Bde HQ & Signal Sqn, 11(Mech) Bde HQ & Signal Sqn, 12 (Mech) Bde HQ & Signal Sqn, 20 (Mech) Bde HQ & Signal Sqn, plus the two brigades that 3 Division reformed with when it lost it's airportability role and deployed to the Soest area Roger

The 46 on the Militant is in fact a "Tac Sign" - on the other side should be the Division flash. 46 indicates one of the field artillery regiments that formed the divisional artillery. Later, in the 60s, this number would have been "66". ie in 1965/66 - 1/66 was Ist Division, 18 Fd Regt RA (based in Munsterlager)

The second vehicle from the left has a British civvy VRN.

A friend of mine, sadly now passed away, used to be Luftwaffe during the war. He was working in a maintenance depot where a lot of captured stuff was held, subsequently evaluated by the relevant departments, and sometimes incorporated into Luftwaffe aircraft. The rest was just junked. He managed to retain some "souveniers".

The FV439 is, as far as I know, NOT used for Ptarmigan. FV432s are used for the "nodes". Whether the FV439 is used for the Triffid RR set, I don't know - as this was fielded after my demob. The FV439 in the RR mode (2x SRC50/R236) had a 40ft Clarke mast and 2x Onan 3.5 KVA generators mounted on the roof (the latter in an armoured bin). It wasn't capable of swimming with the flotation screens (too heavy) Each Brigade HQ (both Main and Step-up) had 3 FV439s (1 of each type). With only 8 Brigades active during the 70s , there weren't that many built. Basically they were used to provide a multi-channel, direct-wave, secure communications liink between Brigade HQ and the Division Communications Centre (Comcen). Six secure channels were provided - 1 for multiplexed telegraph links, 4 via the automatic exchange and 1 "manual intercept" (manual exchange in the Msg Centre vehicle) Below is a pic of the "Log-periodic" antenna used with the C50. The mast it's on weighed about 1/4 ton. some pics of FV439s in B&W can be found on the "Panzerbaer" website Roger

To go back to your original question, during the 1970s/early 1980s, I came across the following trailers: 3 (Airportable) Div HQ & Signal Regt, Bulford - equipped with C50/R236 radio-relay station (2 banks) equipped as "Radcon" (Rado control) for the radio comcen 8 Signal Regt, Catterick - 3 trailers equipped with SR C41/R222 for a specific "Wartime Role" 34 (Eastern) Signal Regt (V) - equipped with SR C41/R222 The trailers were used in the C41 role, and in the C50 role (Bruin and non-Bruin). Triffid was introduced after the requirement for an airportable force "disappeared" so were never put into trailers. The construction of the Triffid would probably make it difficult to put into a trailer.I've never come across a repair trailer, and the only C50 non-Bruin (ie without an RFA13 but with CST1+4 No3) I've ever seen is in Blandford. The role of the TA units was to provide a line of communication from the Channel ports to connect into 1 (BR) Corps logistics train - and thus into 16 Signal Regt -hence the C41s. In detail- C50 (Bruin) 2 sets each with - C50, R236, RFA13, PSU49, PSU50, Frequency Synthesiser set, BID200/10 C50 (Non-Bruin) 2 sets each with - C50, R236, Frequency Symthesiser set, CST1+4 No3 C41 - 2 sets each with - C41 , R222, associated PSUs, CST1+4 No3 In the last picture, the box on the extreme top left contained the lighting kit.Also in the C50 (Bruin) version, a loadout deviation was not permitted. The RFA13 had to be nearest to the drawbar due to weight considerations. Some idiot built the system up the WRONG way around, and the trailer started swinging like mad, and nearly got written off!

Here are a couple of shots of a radio-relay detachment (SR C50/R236) from 3 Div HQ&Signal Regt - taken in Bulford in 1971. It was part of the Bruin set up and therefore had the BID200/10 fitted and NOT the CST1+4 No3. Pics are in B&W. There is a C41/R222 equipped trailer displayed in the Royal signals museum in Blandford. Landrover + Antenna Trailer: Landrover + Equipment Trailer: Detachment in location: C50 equipment trailer: hope it is helpful Roger

One thing I noticed is that one or two of the K9 RAF ambulances seem to have survived - but to date I haven't seen a preserved Army ambulance. They did exist, with slightly different bodywork. I saw a whole yard full of them in Catterick eons ago, and whilst in the Outer Hebrides (1969-71) we had one assigned to the RAGW Range to temporarily replace our Bedford J1, which was in the workshops. Are there any out there in captivity?

You'll find that in WW1 , a lot of ambulances, particularly in the rear areas and serving at home were, in fact, crude conversions of civilian cars donated or "impressed". The majority of ambulances, both service and civilian , at the outbreak of the war were horse-drawn. Conversion was the simplest way to get a lot of ambulances into service to cope with the increasing casualty figures , without delaying production for more important war equipment.

I thought that the floatplane was an ARADO, but the British roundels are confusing me. I can't think of any wartime monoplane floatplanes that were in Empire service

I think it's still known as COUGAR over here - if it's going to be a GS truck version.

I'm Roger, 59 and am a prison officer in the Remand Centre in Frankfurt (Germany). I served in the Royal Signals as a radio-relay technician between 1967 and 1980, mainly in BAOR and the UK - with a stint in NI. Came out as a sergeant. I'm father of two (boy and girl) and grandfather of 2 girls. My main interest is in ambulances (don't ask!) , and I'm already in the PLAIN MILITARY forum.

The last K9 radio vehicles in service with the Regular Army were held by 8 Signal Regiment in Catterick (the trade training unit of the Royal Signals then). Three were held by "Schemes Troop". They were basically stripped out (but fitted with a TTVF4/12 - a telegraph conversion set) and mainly used as luggage carriers when taking trainees out in the field to exercise under "realistic" conditions. They were still on strength when I demobbed in late 1980.

Does anyone know where the Pigs were up-armoured after PIRA started using tungsten-tipped rounds ?