David B.

In 1970 I painted my Austin engine in Woolworth's Household Paint. It lasted until about 2000 or thereabouts when the engine was rebuilt and painted again.

Morning Tony, Thats a good constructive thing to do. I've put mine next to it and I can confirm only some of the wording. Top Line - Only a dash between "10" and "CWT" to add. Otherwise same lettering Second line - I have a rusted out hole at the beginning so I can't see the vacant square shown as white.I think there is the number "2" on a plain background however underneath the "L" of trailer in the top line.I can't see "OEC" too clearly , otherwise in agreement with you. Third Line - Same as you but I think that the word "number" is written in full. Anyone else with confirmation ?

Others will know better than me but this plate sounds to be one for the 10 cwt LIGHTWEIGHT Trailer the "airborne" type. I believe they were made with the designation which included Number and Mark descriptions. The 10 cwt GS , Mortar and Mortar Ammunition trailers were made with No 1 and No 2 designations only according to the 1948 Identification List and the 1960 Illustrated Parts List . SS trailers,both Lightweight and ordinary 10 cwt types seem to have had brass plates(as did other makers) which survive better than the Orme Evans steel plates.@ Do any Orme Evans plates survive with anyone in an uncorroded condition,sufficiently clear and in good enough condition to have copied ?

This should really be required watching for anyone interested in obscure,obsolete and rusty old bits of bent metal. In other words - all of us. The commentator sounds like one of those blokes at the Ideal Home Exhibition,selling gadgets for slicing beans and cutting carrots. I liked it.

Tony - Our plate,which is very rough reads TRAILER 10-cwt 2 WHLD GS. .?????? CONT NO 23/4302 Chassis no. W.D. Number??? OE 6622 What is legible on yours and have you had any further thoughts on your lifting handle bracket's originality ? By the way is it your headboard or tailboard which drops down? Gordon thanks for the info. Ours is too far gone to copy I think. Has anyone a good clear one ?

Simon - I can't see them on his website. Have you had GS trailer plates from him ? The Orme Evans steel plates rust badly and ours could do with replacing.

Hello Tony, As you have said before,there has been very little information about on these trailers and although we have had to suspend work on ours I've spent a few idle moments trying to do a little research on them. By correlating some of the existing facts I have made a few deductions which may or may not be correct. Specifically - I think all the No 1 trailers had the lifting arms pivoting on brackets welded to the tow bar and the different type of hitch illustrated earlier in this thread (without the integrally mounted lifting arms) Pictures I have seen of these earlier trailers of whichever maker seem to bear this out and the illustrations in the trailer Parts List and The Data Book of Wheeled Vehicles also support that supposition. I'm happy to stand corrected and I have to say that your brackets look right ,but that would fly in the face of the fact that your chassis number and other characteristics are those of a No 2 trailer which did not have such brackets but which does have a chassis number in the same contract as ours which is confirmed as a No 2 GS by the steel ID plate which we have. Incidentally your chassis/census details together with ours points to a sequential relationship between chassis and X number and so another Orme Evans chassis number should enable you to calculate the census or X number. All of this says to me that there is a long way to go to document and prove any information which at the moment is lacking on these little workhorses. I'm happy to try and keep this info together,if by the provision of other proven information or photos supplied by other owners the facts could be illustrated. Could we start with other owners observations on the lifting arm question and go from there ? I will say I don't want to get too anal about all this,after all its only something to cart the tent about or or to put the beer in and tow behind the Jeep or 15cwt . I am happy to share any info that I have and if it is all proven step by step the information would usefully fill a gap in trailer knowledge. Regards, David.

I'm glad that you have identified the hitch Carleton,it's a new one on me. Tony - your trailer is definitely from the same contract as ours which would place it quite late on.1944/45 at least.Looking again at your picture of the drawbar,the welded-on brackets do look different to the No1 trailer and I would think that they are a modification,probably contemporary to the fitting of your tow hitch. If you wanted to be correct,they should come off and an (expensive) cast hitch fitted of the type which we spent ages to find ,see early on in this thread. Have a word with John Corden or Ian Litchfield who may have spares. David.

OK Tony - I may stand to be corrected. I associate the lifting handle brackets mounted on the draw bar as being the typical of the No 1 trailer. This is the case with the Reynolds and SS made No1s for example but they have rounded mudguards which I also believed to be the shape of all No1 models regardless of manufacturer. If you have the census number or contract number of your Orme Evans still legible on the data plate, I should be able to tell if it was constructed as a No1 or No2 trailer and whether therefore, by inference the brackets welded to the drawbar are original. Our Orme Evans (with angled mudguards and lifting arms integral with the tow hitch ) was made under contract S4302 a mixed contract for almost 2000 No2 GS and Mortar trailers numbered X5421421 - X5423417 . David.

My towing eye is also a mystery - it has the larger ring (as for 15cwt trucks) but a strange housing. The hand grips are welded to the chassis bar which suggests an earlier towing mechanism. QUOTE] Without seeing much of your trailer I believe it to be an earlier No 1 type with the tow hitch separate from the lifting handles. These were often retrospectively replaced with the larger diameter eye and handles mounted integrally with the tow hitch body fitted as standard on the No 2 trailers. I'm not familiar with your tow hitch type though. What is your body like and what shape are the mudguards ?

Glad to see you made it back OK.obviously all the bungs were in place. Charlie does have a track record where remembering things are concerned,you should ask him about his Weasel. Please give him my best and hope to see him soon. David.

Hello Sean, Could that measurement be 2 13/16 inches ? The later No 2 trailers which is what yours is had the tow hitch/eye of this internal diameter fitted as standard in order to be compatible with the standard WD tow hook. The earlier 2 inch id eye would only have fitted the early 15 cwt pin and pintle. The earlier No 1 trailers also had their hitches retrospectively changed for the later type ,either the cast body or the fabricated type as yours is, thus enabling them to be towed by the later 15 cwt trucks with a standard WD hook. About the largest compatible towing truck with a standard hook seems to have been the Bedford OY as the three ton 4x4 truck's tow hook would have been too high in theory. Anyway, nice trailer , are there any holes within the body which might have been mortar or ammunition fittings ? If not, it would have certainly been a GS variant. I can give you a little information about manufacturers and contract numbers if you wish but do have a good look for a makers plate. all the best, David.

Don't necessarily rush to that conclusion Carleton. It could quite simply be a GS. The trailer that we have comes from a mixed contract of GS and Mortar trailers. Oddly it has an opening headboard AND opening tailboard. I think that it is a Mortar variant that has been modified because there are signs of conversion at the rear and after all a trailer being used in the GS role would not be a lot of use with a moveable headboard only. There are number of possible explanations for having the both ends moveable. A programme of retrospective REME type modification changing Mortar trailers for GS use or even changes to the balance of Mortar to GS trailers in the contract and modification by the manufacturers before delivery took place. One clue to the role of the pictured trailer might be if there are any signs internally of the mortar or ammunition fittings. Absolutely dead right about the hitch though,I've not seen a survivor before and I'd be interested to know if the internal diameter of this fabricated hitch is larger than the earlier type as fitted to the No 1 trailers with the seperate arms or the same as the cast type fitted to the No 2.

If the canvas was down the weapon would get wet when it rained. The other variable might be the length of the dash lights - am I right in thinking that some American dash lights are longer than others ?

Tim - I would be interested in making contact with the Nubian owner. I have some pictures of it after I acquired it ex Century Theatre about 30 years ago. David.

One story I heard was that most of the AFVs were the loaded contents of a ship (LST ?), prepared for embarkation to Suez,never unloaded and sold for scrap,lock stock and barrel together with the ship.

Thanks for your very comprehensive reply (is it Rik?) Sorry for the delay in replying. I must store your advice away safely until I get some free time and I'm sure it will help me no end. Anything further you can add will be well received. I'm going to start with the 10 cwt GS,Mortar and Ammunition trailers. I have already a list of contract numbers,makers names and the census number block but would like to know the dates of contract placement and delivery. Is there a short cut to that information or might you already have pages which includes this info . Thanks again, David.

I'd be interested to know if the ledger illustrations are a result of your own research in the National Archives and whether you can advise me as to the procedure for arranging a visit and looking for vehicle or trailer contract details,dates of contract placement etc. Is this the best place to look for this information ? Thanks, David.

Julian - my old Hillman used to do this over the Winter sometimes. I used to do as Pete suggests but as it was a lighter vehicle we could get little bit of speed up and then drop the clutch ,in a lower gear though. If the vehicle has a tendency to do this,blocking the clutch pedal down with a bit of wood while laid up should prevent it happening. Not sure what that does to the clutch springs in the long run though. David

Danny, Beware the assumption that this is a wartime conversion. I seem to recollect that the C8 chassis was the basis for a crane conversion that was marketed postwar. Regards, david.

Has anyone come across this article or can suggest where to look for it ?

Thanks Clive - looks a worthwhile buy. Presumably under the bag its much the same as your "Wally"

Off at a slight tangent - I have a couple of sets of difficult to replace 3 point screened plugs in a very sooty state through similar use which I would like to clean up properly - rather more than a rub up with a wire brush. Does any one know of or have one of those old Champion ( I think) blast cabinets which were used for the thorough cleaning of spark plugs in garages some years ago ? Thanks - David.