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T8Hants

Modern fuel and my 3HW

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Quick question as starting up day is getting closer (I hope), are there any special actions I should take to run my 3HW on the modern rubbish they  now call petrol?

I have the valve seat additive, should I need to be concerned about the ethanol content any other things I should think of to ensure good practice.....Ta!

Gareth

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OK since I was reliably informed a couple of years ago, that the super unleaded petrol from an independent station (non supermarket) had minimal to no ethanol AT THAT TIME, I've gone out of my way to use it and so far had no problems. However I still add a drop of Frosts Ethomix for good luck.A £15 bottle will last me for a year.  Ron  

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A interesting subject I have followed for years , it seems a case of the more you get to know - the more you don't know.

My old man used Cleveland Discol and I think I must have done for a while after I passed my test (1967). 

Alcohol - was a great thing , you did not hear of problems.  So why the problem with  MODERN ethanol (btw  - I don't doubt the present so called petrol(s) are rubbish) I suppose Tet. Lead did prevent valve seat regression , it is all this about  damage to .die-cast carb. bodies , metal pipes, rubber hoses, metal fuel tanks - that I just don't get , you did not know of these problems in 1950's / 1960's.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/article/march-1934/48/alcohol-fuel-high-compression-engines

Walker (Jonnie Walker family) and the Distillers Co.  seemed to be the UK (Scottish) pioneers of this MODERN fuel - pre-WW2  !

Google on Cleveland Discol , plenty of info. 

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Petrol, unlike engine oil,(Which in a way I think we are spoilt with) is a nightmare.As said the more you know,the less you know.I had problems a few years back with Ethanol eating a fibreglass tank on one bike.Also my rigid AJS trials bike suffered badly from the ethanol drawing in moisture and causing low speed running problems.At the time I solved it by using Aspen Alkylate petrol which has no ethanol and a 5 year shelf life.The engines run really well on it,but its very expensive. I still run all my chainsaws and strimmer on it because they are all 20+ years old and modern petrol ruins the rubber/plastic  components in the fuel system. I can happily leave them over winter and they still fire up with no issues. My G3l and the AJS now seem happy on Shell Optimax which was "Supposed" to be free of ethanol... I never worry about valve seat additive, I rebuilt the AJS engine 9 years ago,its done alot of work since then and shows no sign of compression loss or needing pushrod adjustment.   

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Posted (edited)

I agree about not worrying about the effects of unleaded petrol. There was a lot of hype about "valve seat recession" and a panic to get hardened valve seats installed or an additive for your fuel....or both! ....Me included!  But over the last 20 odd years I just haven't bothered with any of it. 

I am however still concerned about the effects of Ethanol (I've already suffered the consequences of de-laminated 'Petseal' in at least three tanks). To that end I do the very best I can to minimize it. Having said that, I notice that most guys I ride with think nothing of pulling into the nearest supermarket and fill up with the cheapest regular petrol.......I even took cans of my own petrol to France rather than use the French stuff (Don't tell the ferry man!) Hey Ho ..Ron the Paranoid.   

Edited by Ron

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The small self service pumps (card only after hours) across from the Lidl in Bayeux had four star...... or equivalent, smelt like paraffin when I lifted the nozzle, then again the Diesel pump smelled like petrol.....

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You pays your money and you makes your choice!  Like Ron, I use Ethomix these days AND buy premium grade petrol which is supposed to have low/no ethanol.  But I have a keen motorcyclist mate who does lots of miles on some real pukka veteran, vintage and classics bikes and does not use "snake oil" as he calls it!  But there is no doubt that modern fuels do eat fibreglass and old recipe tank sealant and old recipe "rubber" fuel pipes.  And ethanol IS hygroscopic so if left in a tank or carb, has the potential to attract water.

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Posted (edited)

Well i have an old book for volkswagen from the late 40s. They gave tips how to mix a lot of stuff trough your petrol to save money. Ethanol was one of the less harmfull. Some of that would be an ecological crime today ;-).

Edited by Citroman

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I read somewhere that when we sent the Spitfire to Russia they put lumps of lead in there tanks  to replace the Tetro ethyle -lead on 5 star fuel .I  go and get Lead substitute from Halfords  as well as using those Lead beads that are advertised on ebay on a wire dropped in the tank Modern petrol stings if you get it on skin and is not volatile as it use to be more like parafin

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, tankdiver said:

I read somewhere that when we sent the Spitfire to Russia they put lumps of lead in there tanks  to replace the Tetro ethyle -lead on 5 star fuel .I  go and get Lead substitute from Halfords  as well as using those Lead beads that are advertised on ebay on a wire dropped in the tank Modern petrol stings if you get it on skin and is not volatile as it use to be more like parafin

I think you will find all these claims of sponge lead within petrol tanks is totally untrue.  Marketed over many years with similar claims , ISTR proven untrue.  Much on vehicle forums several  + years ago,  IIRC  much repeated hearsay - a invention of a RAF artificer & somebody queried the  'named person'  and asked for his service Number with the authorities - he could not be paraded.

I think you will find that the 100 octane type 'synthetic' stuff was produced at two sites within the UK  from hydrogenerated  coal , one being at  ICI Billingham Works (that my feet trampled over late 1970's / 1980's)  and the other was at a similar Shell managed  (but government owned) works in Lancashire.  These supplies were probably sufficient but were added to by tankers from across the pond.  I would have to check - I think the stocks were also added to by a link between Carless Capel & Leonard and the Coalite , Bolsover works.

--------------------------

Eugene Houndry's  Process  -  yet another "secret"  process claim  ??

Edited by ruxy
spelin

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