Jump to content
HotBed

Triumph 3SW Speedo

Recommended Posts

Could someone tell me the correct Smiths Speedo model for a 1939 3SW and a picture if possible please.

TIA

Edited by HotBed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A 1939 bike would most likely have had  a spigot drive Jaeger pattern speedo. Ron

WDD 153.JPG

WDD 182.jpg

WDD 183.jpg

Edited by Ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PS and also a dome glass CZ27 ammeter with illumination panel inside. Ron

 

WDL 181.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Ron said:

A 1939 bike would most likely have had  a spigot drive Jaeger pattern speedo. Ron

WDD 153.JPG

WDD 182.jpg

WDD 183.jpg

So many 8 inch headlights in one shed 😊

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Ron, 

I was looking at Smith’s 😳 on fleabay.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, Ron said:

PS and also a dome glass CZ27 ammeter with illumination panel inside. Ron

 

WDL 181.JPG

Did they use Jaeger ones as well ?.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually I think all of the headlamps you see in that shot are DU42 6" headlamps but I do have about 7 or 8 bikes with DU142 8" lamps, but it's over 30 years of collecting and restoring. Ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, HotBed said:

Did they use Jaeger ones as well ?.

Did who use Jaeger what?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Ron said:

Did who use Jaeger what?

Sorry, did the motorcycle manufacturers during the war also use Jaeger ammeters instead of Lucas 

must be the flat glass of the headlights that make them look bigger 😳

Graham

Edited by HotBed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No they're all Lucas. You can read it on the face of the ammeter I posted. They are the pre-war version with an illumination window inside the headlamp and the headlamp reflector had a slot in it to let some light through to the ammeter window. ....I doubt that anyone was blinded by it though!  Ron

DSCF0533.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One CZ27 just sold on eBay for £155 😳 

and no I wasn’t the winner 😃

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've see them dearer than that😕

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If it's an SW and built to a D.of.A.C. (Department of Army Contracts) or Ministry of Supply contract then the specification almost certainly included an 80MPH, non-illuminated, non-trip speedometer. Prior to 1941, these would have had the Jaeger drive system.  Pre-war, Smiths Instuments had been restricted by their licence  from the French Jaeger company to only build identical interchangeable copies of the original (hence the metric threads) . A yellow 30mph marker and the Smiths MA logo are typical for the period.

The ammeters are Lucas CZ (Centre-Zero) 27s. The pre-war style had a domed glass and a small mica-covered illumination window . These were certainly in use until at least the end of 1939. We're rivet-counting here though and any machine that remained in service after 1940 would have received standard replacements. The burden of proof on those of us with a May 1940 / BEF cut-off date is extremely high :-).

The question that anyone rebuliding a WD vehicle really has to ask themselves is whether they are intending to portray the machine as it entered service, during a particular campaign, or for the duration of the emergency generally..and in the case of the M20, G3L or 16H, post-war as well... Most M20s look more like National Service rejects...It's equally valid of course but most of the owners don't like being questioned about all the 1950s bits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/10/2019 at 7:26 PM, Ron said:

No they're all Lucas. You can read it on the face of the ammeter I posted. They are the pre-war version with an illumination window inside the headlamp and the headlamp reflector had a slot in it to let some light through to the ammeter window. ....I doubt that anyone was blinded by it though!  Ron

DSCF0533.jpg

So the later wartime CZ27s had no cut out and flat glass or did the CZ number change ?.

Edited by HotBed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lucas numbering can get complicated and I'm not fully conversant with them. Some of the pre-war ammeters had a BM number, and at that time in 1939 there was a period of just using civilian stuff for WD ....to modified and purpose made for WD. 

Unless you want to get into the research of exactly how your bike might have left the factory, which can sometimes be very difficult as although the parts might have changed, often the part numbers didn't, and it sometimes has to be done with photographic evidence, which of course are usually B&W..... Some of us have been squinting and zooming in for 20-30 years and still never know for sure.

As far as the ammeter is concerned, a straight forward CZ27 which covered the whole of war-time, Lucas equipped bikes will suffice. However I know a guy who can supply or fit a dome glass for a 1939 effect if required.

I have 2 or 3 with a dome glass, but I think only one that has the illumination window. Again I have 2 or 3 with a plated bezel, which would have been fazed out for economy and to speed up supply as war progressed. 

Otherwise most of my CZ27's have bare brass bezels as on my 3SW here. Ron

DSCF1343.jpg

DSCF1342.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That’s all very interesting Ron, thank you, I do a lot of rummaging in boxes at steam fairs so I’m hoping one will turn up. 🙂

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Probably a good place to look. Not many steam locos will need one. Ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×