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hummermark

19 set pocket watch

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Hi is there a correct make and model of pocket watch that fits the round watch holder on the front of a 19 set in British use in ww2?

i have seen Elgin and Harris  and some other make made in London so the face says which had the arrow on the back,is it that many can fit but they are not the correct?

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Most were actually Swiss 19 jewel design. Various makers, the back of the case will have arrow mark and number. Unfortunatley a lot of the case backs were replaced by plain ones so that they could be sold 'As new'

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I have a watch made here in Australia (don't know about the movement) which appears to be specific to the no.11 & 19 wireless set holders. It doesn't have a ring at the top spindle at the winder although there are recesses for one. It fits neatly into the holder whereas if the ring was there it would interfere. This watch also has a square profile unlike the usual pocket watch.

This is the only one I've seen but there must be others about. Were any British watches like this ?

Australia was still using WS11's quite late in the war and they were getting 'tropicalised' with a stencil 'TT' - tropic treated. Anyway hopefully my photos will attach. A bit dark unfortunately.

regards, Andrew

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Open the back of the watch an look at the movment.  The GS /WT is General Service/ Watch Trade. meaning it is a commercial watch bought in from variuous manufactures. Should be  a 15 or 19 jewel movemt.

Edited by Tony B

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Hi Tony

I haven't had a chance to open the watch yet (I have to excavate into the garage shelves again), however Hummermark may be interested in the entry in the 'complete  station list' in my copy of the signal trg. pamphlet for WS no11 (Aust) and a couple of other early Aust trg pams.  "ZA7400 Watches, non magnetic"  with a footnote "or watches GS, Mk II (Sect. V2) in lieu"

ZA7400 is a Brit. Cat no. as, if it was Aust local manufacture or design it would be ZAA...…...

I have a couple of pams for the no.19 set but they don't show the 'complete station list' - most unhelpful.

regards, Andrew

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A lot of the watches used by both sides were Swiss. The one I have is a black faced RECTA, name on dial  Back of case markings Broad Arrow G.S.T.P. (Gentral Service trade Pattern ) F , unidentifiable 22166. Inside  back of case is engine turned marked F4726 engraved roughly  621242 proffesional engraved and some smal what I take to be repair marks, intials and numbers. Movemt is marked RECTA.  Genral size and scale of numbers on face are similar, though hands are two section but narrower. Hope this might be of intret.

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Hi Tony

I opened up the GS/WT watch from my earlier post : Swiss made, 15 jewel , non-magnetic but no maker. I can see presumably a serial number under the main spring wheel (cannot remember correct name) that's about it. JWH was J W Handley who made many types of instruments during WW2. the underline V means they were based in the state of Victoria. A method of marking on many items including clothing.

For the watch enthusiast a couple of pics of my Aust general purpose Waltham, and an Omega bought at a motor swap meet years ago. The seller had 8 or 10 to choose from, all 'non goers'. None of mine operate.

regards, Andrew

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I can't answer that except that the WS 11 set training book lists the watch as an accessory , and the training book for another early Aust set (WS101) from 1941 mentions in the 'complete station' list that the watch is stored in the holder on the set.

The Maple Leaf Up site article mentions that earlier in the war sets came with the watch but later on they were left out as too many disappeared.

My earlier trg pams show pictures with the watch in place. The WS19 Aust MkII pam (1943) shows pictures of the set with a watch in place, but an Aust reprint of British Working Instructions for WS19 mk I & II - undated show illustration of front panel with empty holder.  I guess you can take that either way , the Brit pam has line drawings not photos so may be the artists interpretation. (pure speculation on my part !)

 

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Just thinking (always dangerous) that if the sets were issued when new and the (training ) pamphlet lists all the components like microphones, cables, batteries (and watch) then they would presumably issued complete. Does that still mean they left the factory complete with everything ? Only someone who was there could give a definite answer.

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Watch was a seperate issue also a reportable item if lost ie easy to nick,  and valuable. That is a lovley movment, probably imported by JWH who then either retailed it under their name or fitted thier own face hand and case. Just like modern watches.  That Omega is particullaly nice,

Edited by Tony B

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I have been looking to find a watch for my 19 sets. Would any one have one for sale... or know where I could purchase one. Thank you. John

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