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Steve#

Enfield project

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Hi

This is my first post on here, so please bear with me!

I recently bought a collection of Enfield parts: a WD CO frame (M7668 dispatched from the factory 1st Jan 1944), a Model G engine (G5449, sa ex-WD from late 1943), tank, girder forks and wheels... There was no written history with the bike (the dates above came from the Owners Club) but I was given to understand it had been modified for trials (allegedly by Eric Cheney) by adding length to the forks (see closeup of the fork legs - the extensions are visible), reshaping the rear triangle, fitting 21" front wheel and a huge rear sprocket.

Anyway, I have a couple of questions that I thought someone on here might help me with:

The forks and front wheel could never have been used together - the spindle is a bigger diameter than the fork dropout, but I am keen to identify the front hub and also what bike the forks are off as the brake is RHS whereas WDCO  brake was on the left.

I'm also keen to know what the rear triangle is off as the dropout lugs are unlike anything I've seen...

Any other thoughts, observations or suggestion most welcome.

 

The bike is currently up and running by the way (in "trials" trim) but cosmetically untouched while I decide what direction to take it. One things for sure I am going to need to a lot more practice (and fitness!) to ride it in trials sections!

The photos are from when I first got the bike home - I will add some newer pictures....

Thanks.

Steve

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That is a WD/CO rear frame if bothe sides have tool box brackets pointing out but would be a Model G post war if the left tool brackets point in. The rear stand castings are the late open or simpler castings. The earlier type castings supported the stand bolts on both sides of each eye of the stand. This type of rear frame was used on the type 2 frame but I have seen them fitted to Type 1 1/2 frames 

 

And I don’t see any seat/mudguard bracket castings. They may have been ground off. That would be unfortunate.

Edited by Chris Hall

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Thanks Chris

I will check the tool brackets - sounds like this could be the original rear frame for the WDCO front half (type 1 1/2 - no diagonal frame brace at the headstock).

Sadly the seat lugs are ground off.....

Steve

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The forks are definitely Royal Enfield but as yet I can't identify them. Lots of pre war Enfield's had a right hand brake drum as did the WD models L,G and D, you also have the speedo bracket lug near the top. But the mudguard support strap looks C/CO.  Most of the others had a mudguard support lug on the front fork tube only.  I don't recognise the 'flat' brake plate and cable anchor bar either. Your front mudguard stay lugs appear to have been sawn off.   I can't quite see you spring properly but it looks like C/CO type and not the G/L type (which can be re-located through 180 degrees for sidecar use). 

The speedo lug indicates that they came originally from a model with a right side brake drum and the rest could be just modifications for trials use?  Ron

WDL 150.jpg

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Thanks Ron

The lower fork swivel (at the base of the spring) is in line with the steering axis, so I guess its not a Model where it can be reversed for sidecar (since reversing it would make no difference that I can see). 

I also think the flat brake plate is a later braze on. Possibly to fit a non RE front hub... (though as I said, the hub I got didn’t fit in the lugs)

The front wheel was probably swapped for a 21” in “converting” it for Trials, so the original mudguard (and stays) would presumably have been replaced.

Thanks for your help. Plenty to keep me busy!

Steve

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The Forks are standard Enfield WD/C forks that have been modified to right side brakes. The wheel looks like a post war model G/J or possibly pre war bike with rear speedo. The brake plate is not for that wheel and could be pre war Enfield model H etc. Is it an 8”?

 

oh and the gearbox is post war.

Edited by Chris Hall

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Hi Steve,

Did you recently buy this one? Or is "Steve" your "nom de plume"? I dated this bike in June 2017 for Tom B. It is indeed a WD/CO frame from January 1944, but engine and gearbox are post war Model G items.

Jan

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Thanks Jan..

I bought it in Feb 2017 from a guy called Robert W.... however, I asked the REOC dating officer (who's name is Tom B) for a dating cert on 20th May 2017. Tom replied that he couldn't issue a formal cert as the bike was incomplete at that time. 

Tom emailed me some info (though I can't find the email now) and returned my photos etc with two dates written on-

 - on my covering letter " 7668 01-01-1944 Barton WD"

 - and on the Engine pencil rubbing page was written "CO 2-09-1943?"

The engine is a G though I'm pretty sure, it has the larger crank diameter, I recall Tom's email saying it was a Model G engine from 2nd Sept 1943.

I agree on the gearbox of course - that has the "neutraliser" level which I think was post war Model G and others.

Thanks again

Steve.

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Oops... of course... Tom wasn't the owner, I should have known... :$  Tom had asked me if I could confirm that the 350cc OHV engine with number 5110 below the cylinder and 5440 below the mag was a WD/CO from 02/09/1943? There was no photograph in his email. I told him that “duplicated frame number” 5110 and “true engine number” 5440 were most probably genuine, they “match” when I compare them with other entries in my Register. I confirmed the date and asked for a photograph of this engine, for the Register. But when Tom sent me some pictures of the engine, I told him (quote) "I’m afraid that they prove that we were wrong with our conclusion that this is a WD/CO engine… It is in fact a post war Model G engine. I’m definitely sure that there is no acceptance marking and no contract stamp on this engine… (and it will have bigger crankpins than a WD/CO engine)."

So somehow all the information got mixed up... Sorry for that... But your frame is definitely a WD/CO frame (a type 1 1/2 to be precise). Number 7668 left the factory on January 1st 1944, destination War Office, Barton.

Jan

 

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Thanks Jan..

That all makes sense now :-)

Thanks again.

(btw - your surname isn't Carter by any chance is it?)

Steve.

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2 minutes ago, Steve# said:

(btw - your surname isn't Carter by any chance is it?)

No it isn't... ^_^

Jan V.

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20 hours ago, Chris Hall said:

The brake plate is not for that wheel and could be pre war Enfield model H etc. Is it an 8”?

Chris - thanks  for coming back with more thoughts/info. The front hub is 7"

Steve.

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