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bobs1918

Pierce Arrow ww 1 truck for sale

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This   was  posted on  Facebook   group  I  am  in.   It  is  in  Luxembourg.     Asking  price  is  69 K  USD  I'm out!  

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Lettering on the radiator reads " Equipment --------pe Centre". Would have thought this would have been " Center" in American speak? Perhaps an earlier restoration?

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The lorry looks nice, but I do not trust the paintwork at all, it looks like it was prepped for a filmset.

trevor

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Looks to me that the camo pattern has been mostly sprayed. Not impossible for WW1 but very unlikely I would have thought.

Potentially a very nice truck though, will be interesting to see who wants it at that price.

David

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On 25/10/2017 at 3:56 AM, bobs1918 said:

This   was  posted on  Facebook   group  I  am  in.   It  is  in  Luxembourg.     Asking  price  is  69 K  USD  I'm out!  

piercearrrow.jpg

piercearrow2.jpg

i have seen it. Its nearly 100% original. After WWI it belong to a cool merchant in France he moved the tailgate to the side for easy access that is the only modification we could find on it, all date plates are still there. Lorry is repainted it has the greyish WWI paint underneath maybe with so solvent you can get the paint of and get the original back. I have done it once on a repainted 19 set which was in all colours of the rainbow came out amazingly. If you want something WWI this would be it is my opinion not sure about pricing this stuff so rare where do you find a second one. Was used in a film .

 

Edited by monty2

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Yes the paint is not original. Most of the rest of the 'vehicle however is. The body is the correct 5 ton version, although it has been raised onto a tipping gear mainframe for the coal merchant between the wars, he would definitely have repainted it at this time. If you look carefully you can see the operating valve to the left of the non-original seat base. It was indeed used by this coal merchant who moved the tailgate to the side. However most of the fittings on the body are original and  still have the US Army stamps on them.

All the running gear, engine/gearbox/axles etc. are correct. It was fitted with a steel wheel/pneumatic tyre conversion,  which I now posses as it has the wooden front wheels which came off mine. So please take a good look at them and if you see any let me know as I need a pair!

It was definitely in French service during the war as it has the original French translated data plates on the bulkhead, Pierce Arrow supplied direct to the French govt, and the presence of these factory applied plates proves this was one if these direct supply trucks.

It will be interesting to see where it ends up, and what yarn is spun about its "original" paint and condition. However this is a highly original vehicle and one which deserves a good home where it's history is preserved. Please keep us all updated with its future.

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Hi Tim. This Pierce Arrow has been around for a while with the price creeping upwards. Interesting to see it again though. 

Pierce Arrow fitted data plates in both French and English as I understand they were uncertain as to which country it was going to be ultimately supplied to. The French Pierce Arrows did not have the US Army body fitted to them so this was probably a US army one, but the body could have come off a different truck. Here are photos of another one in the USA. I should have bought it when it was cheap. But there we go.

The markings should have been QMC not QM and they certainly would not have painted USA QM on the bonnet. If someone says that is original markings ask for photo evidence.

How is your GMC coming along?

Tim

 

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Hi Tim,

Thanks for the corrections to my assumptions. There is always some "here-say" to vehicle history. Interesting that you say the French ones had a different body. If PA did not know the end user so they fitted both language plates, were all the trucks bodied in France? There is a picture of an R5 packed for shipping to France in knocked down form which has the std US body. Does this show some were shipped bodied, or were they removed on arrival in Europe? Did the British ones use the US body or was a WD type utilised? I'm not questioning your details, I'd just like to know. You are the guru on all things WW1 trucks and merely want to be correct. If you're ever near Canterbury at any time I would be pleased to show you around my vehicles and would value your opinion . I'm conveniently located for a drop in on the way to France.

When I bought my PA from Philippe I did try to also buy this one, however I just couldn't justify the cost, albeit much less than it is offered now. However as with your US one we should not regret. The joy of hindsight. Quite interesting to see that the US one you looked at had pneumatic front tyres, and they seem to be on very similar wooden spoked wheels to the std solid rubber type. I assume this was an inter-war conversion.

The 3x GMC ambulances are nicely stored away for future rebuilds, and I keep on the lookout for spare parts, which turn up occasionally. So on the back burner, but not forgotten. In fact I bought a parts manual in Australia today! Currently I could really do with some correct wooden front wheels for the Pierce if you happen to hear of some. The job to get on with before/over the christmas period is to start on the PA radiator rebuild. It leaks like a sieve, so I either have to fix it or get a bigger watering can to keep up with the leaks.

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With best wishes, Tim.

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A guru? Thanks. That is very kind of you to say. There are several other people who are more knowledgeable than me but who don’t post here very often.

My understanding is that the British PA’s were shipped over as a rolling chassis and were fitted with a British built body on arrival. The French PA’S had their own style body which was hinged at the side. I would have thought that these would have been assembled in France but I have photos of these in the PA factory ready for shipping. You may have seen the Windscreen article I did in 2016 which showed PA’s arriving in France already fitted with their French style wooden body.

I believe that the US PA’s were shipped to France from the manufacturer partially knocked down and were fitted with a wooden body on arrival which had been shipped separately. However, some trucks were transported from in service use to France and were shipped with the body fitted. I am not aware of the British War Department using American Army PA’s although the US Army did use British bodies PA’s. I do hope that everyone is keeping up with this.

I see that the front of the body of your PA has been shortened by about 30 cm. Any idea why? Wheels, usually attached to rolling chassis with no drive train do occasionally turn up. I will keep my eyes open for one. Is your radiator beyond salvation as there might be one coming up for sale shortly (in the USA).

Best regards

Tim

IMG_0382.jpg

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Good evening, 

Actually i have been searching quite a time for a truck like this, however it's very hard to get a good reference for the values of these vehicules given that so few are actually around for sale. 

According to you, what would actually be a realistic price/value for a truck in the same condition as the green "69 K" truck posted above? 

Best regards thanks for your advice.

Thomas

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Hi Thomas

The seller reads this forum so I don’t think it is fair for me to publicly give my opinion as to value. What might be a good starting point is if you did a search for “Pierce Arrow” on HMVF and see the many previous posts on the subject. I think that there have been four others offered for sale in recent years. Ask yourself what is the highest you would pay for it and then ask the seller what is the least he would take for it. See if you can meet in the middle.

Why do you want it? You understand that apart from possibly a magneto or a carb there will be no available parts for it at all. What do you intend to do with it if you bought it?

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

Tim

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Ok thanks Tim

Yes that's a good point ,I don't want to interfere with someone's deals of course. But by the way do you maybe know at which site this truck for sell then? This could actually be something interesting for me to follow, i thought it was sold last year.

Best regards

 

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Well  then   from   69K  to asking  45K getting  to  a  point  that  someone  may  take  the   plunge!

 

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