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New to HMVF - Simca Marmon SUMB - New Owner

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Good afternoon everyone,

I'm Mike, and I thought I'd indroduce myself as a new member of HMVF...Today I bought a 1959 SIMCA MARMON SUMB 4x4 French military truck and I'm quite excited. (Pic attached)

I am new to the French military truck world but have been fiddling with Land Rovers and particularly V8 Range Rover Classics for years, so not scared of working on chunky metal stuff with oil leaks.

The truck been very well looked after by the previous owners, with everything looking clean and tidy. I guess it's been parked up for a while and as you might expect, the air brakes aren't performing at all well so it is being delivered to me on the back of a recovery truck tomorrow as the current keeper is too scared to drive it. I guess it's a dodgy valve or some seals that need sorting out, but never worked on an air system before so advice and opinions on the cause and suggested repairs are most welcome.

Symptoms: Air pressure up at 9-10bar which I think is normal. The system "blows off" excess air pressure every few minutes which I think is also normal. The bad stuff: Brake pedal rock hard so you need to press really hard to get any braking at all. Once the pedal moves down the brakes kick in and bite well. It seems as though the air assistance is not there at all and the pedal has to be forced down to a point where the hydraulics eventually do their thing and stop the truck.

I don't mind if I fix it myself or pay a local air brake expert. Braking is quite important to get right, so if you can help with any advice or recommendations I would be most grateful.

MUDMAX MIKE - Solihull, West Midlands.

SM001.jpg

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Welcome in. Yes, I agree about the brakes, as I'm fond of quoting my old Mentor Howard, 'A bugger if they don't go, a disaster if they don't stop'. You should get some help once we can all figure our way around this new fangled site. First thing with air brakes, espicially if they have been standing, pump them up and purge  the tanks to clear any accumleted water and gunk. 

Edited by Tony B

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hi iam a new member and just brought a sumb along with a ffr 109 both been used on local shoot and a bit worse a state than yours will post pics soon ....quick question 6volt ? wot batterys you using? positive or negative earth no batterys in truck.

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Jerry

All intact SUMBs are 24v - there were 2 x 12v about 36ah batteries in a tray between the seats in the cab. The “FFR” ones that had radios in the back had a 2nd battery tray in the front left corner of the rear body and - at least in the one I worked on which had been “got at” - each battery was paralleled with the equivalent one in the cab battery box 

 

An. unmodified SUMB will also have a battery cutoff switch on the left side of the engine/gearbox tunnel in the driver’s footwell which is connected between chassis and the battery negative ( so battery negative is floating when the power is cut off)

there should be a 2-pin US style jump start/charging socket to the left of the drivers seat you can use to connect an external battery pack.

 

regards 

 

IAin

 

 

 

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Hi we may have chatted before.. I have had a few of these in the past and know a little bit. Feel free to pick up through our Facebook pages.. French Army Reenactment Group as we have a motor pool of a few French vehicles.. I also have a number of french friends who know about these lorries.. Good luck Baz 

106_2_diary.jpg

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I think it depends on who imported them - I once had BNT??K which was imported by the Gun bus company (later WH Bone) which is the other extreme.

the French “Charge Utile” magazine had a production history in a 3 part article (issues 87-89 from memory) which suggests trials in 1959 although the radiator grille looked quite different and series production of about 8000 units from 1961 through 1972 with mostly 3 tonne long wheelbase units after 1970. The bulk were delivered in large orders from 1964 to 1968.

 

this does not completely mesh with the serial numbers - the three I had were in the 13,000s, 14,000s and 17,000s so I guess they either made more for other customers or started from 10K rather than 1. There are some differences between early and late units if they still have all of their original parts - in particular later units have a 2-bar wing mirror support and rectangular rather than round mirrors. 

I suppose the only sure way to date a specimen is to have the tree rings in the wooden load bed dated by a dendrochronologist ;) 

regards & seasons greetings 

 

iain 

 

Ps I have 2 rear body side panels (a bit rusty) left free of charge to take away  if anyone wants to collect them 

Edited by g0ozs

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Exactly how I understood the production went!!

Must be one of those as they would say on a well known internet auction site "very rare" to have been produced in 1960!!

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I have two spare wheels and tyres to a good home. Tyres are worn but would suffice as a spare as they hold air. Also I have a great deal of radio kit for these that came out a French apx.. I may need a few beer tokens for that though. Also I think I have some of the air braking system and brake shoes if you need them. I'm Bristol based so may be a long way for some rusty bits! 

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As it happens I bought a really very nice 1959 SUMB from a well known dealer in the south of England two week ago  ,the same man who sold then originally ,well my SUMB is mint ,(bought by another dealer and put away around 1999)  I drained the orange petrol cleaned the petrol filter and off I went, I had a SUMB before and always regretted selling  it ,but this vehicle seems more lively than I remember ,I have done a 40 km run faultless   .I could do with a name where I might buy so filters and other consumables ,great Christmas present  ,I had it collected in the UK and dropped outside Dublin, the fun of driving home is missed but it was not UK road legal and the days of taking a chance are in the past 

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I've just bought a Sumb which needs a fair amount of work,  and some parts to get running (mainly the air pak needs a complete overhaul or potentially replacement - might have to find an equivalent from a different truck?).

Can anyone recommend a good general source of spares - are RR still the best bet in the UK?

Any good sources in France or mainland Europe?

And do spares ever turn up at the UK military vehicle shows?

Thanks in advance,  Adam

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Adam

I think RR have the only substantial spares holding in the UK - and they had downsized when I last had contact with them.

There are (or were when I last looked)  a couple of sellers in French e-Bay but most don't ship overseas so you probably need a friend over there to act as your agent. The braking system is basically American (of Bendix design) and a  lot of the small parts are common to US trucks of the period - the engine is similar to but not the same as the post war large capacity Ford V8s so again some parts are common but it is necessary to be more cautious there. The carburettor is the same type as used by early Porsche cars and refurb kits are fairly common in the US E-Bay 

Regards

Iain

 

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On 9/9/2018 at 8:55 PM, g0ozs said:

Adam

I think RR have the only substantial spares holding in the UK - and they had downsized when I last had contact with them.

There are (or were when I last looked)  a couple of sellers in French e-Bay but most don't ship overseas so you probably need a friend over there to act as your agent. The braking system is basically American (of Bendix design) and a  lot of the small parts are common to US trucks of the period - the engine is similar to but not the same as the post war large capacity Ford V8s so again some parts are common but it is necessary to be more cautious there. The carburettor is the same type as used by early Porsche cars and refurb kits are fairly common in the US E-Bay 

Regards

Iain

 

Thanks Ian for this advice - apologies that I didn't reply sooner

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