Jump to content
Petelgv1

Ward lafrance clutch problems

Recommended Posts

Hi, we have a 1943 Ward lafrance wrecker.

When we got her late last year she was hard to get in gear. We put this down to driver error because neither of us had driven one before.. We tried the best way we could but here are the symptoms....

At first she starts ok, then goes into 2nd ok.. Then when out on the road it's hard to pull the lever out of second and she doesn't like to go into third.. I tried double clutching etc, plus letting rev's down then I forced her in..

Last week we did 100 miles like this. Often we had to turn her off, put in second and start off again.

Anyhow. Yesterday I pulled out on main road in second and managed to get up to 5th. Then someone pulled out in front of me. I dropped to third then rolled into next turning. I then had to force her out of third.

I then lost everything.. I could not get a gear.

i turned her off and put in second. Then I pressed the starter and she lurched forward with my clutch down.. This telling me the clutch is not dis engaging.. I spent a time adjusting the threaded bolt by the clutch lever and no better.

i was stuck.. She would not engage a gear at all.

5 hrs later I'd got her home by a JCB Fastrack towing me.

 

am I right in thinking the clutch seems ok but is not releasing.. ??

Can my problem be related to the air cylinder that helps with the clutch. ??

 

Any help is much appreciated as I'm now grounded.. Also best place for parts. Etc

thanks, Pete.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi, we have a 1943 Ward lafrance wrecker.

When we got her late last year she was hard to get in gear. We put this down to driver error because neither of us had driven one before.. We tried the best way we could but here are the symptoms....

At first she starts ok, then goes into 2nd ok.. Then when out on the road it's hard to pull the lever out of second and she doesn't like to go into third.. I tried double clutching etc, plus letting rev's down then I forced her in..

Last week we did 100 miles like this. Often we had to turn her off, put in second and start off again.

Anyhow. Yesterday I pulled out on main road in second and managed to get up to 5th. Then someone pulled out in front of me. I dropped to third then rolled into next turning. I then had to force her out of third.

I then lost everything.. I could not get a gear.

i turned her off and put in second. Then I pressed the starter and she lurched forward with my clutch down.. This telling me the clutch is not dis engaging.. I spent a time adjusting the threaded bolt by the clutch lever and no better.

i was stuck.. She would not engage a gear at all.

5 hrs later I'd got her home by a JCB Fastrack towing me.

 

am I right in thinking the clutch seems ok but is not releasing.. ??

Can my problem be related to the air cylinder that helps with the clutch. ??

 

Any help is much appreciated as I'm now grounded.. Also best place for parts. Etc

thanks, Pete.

 

 

Hi Pete,

With the engine turned off, I assume the gear lever can be shifted in all positions with ease? If this is so, then it points to clutch dragging. Obviously you will have to visually confirm the air cylinder is throwing the lever. If this is OK it is likely a dragging clutch plate. Could be hanging on worn splines on the gearbox, or maybe the plate got damaged when the gearbox was fitted. People often make the mistake of distorting the plate when trying to fit the gearbox, this will then give you a dragging clutch. Could also be oil or grease on the plates causing drag.

 

Richard

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi, with the engine off I can not get any gears still.

today I chocked her up and put a good guy behind the wheel. I went underneath with the engine running, while my mate pressed the clutch peddle. The air cylinder did not move. I guess it should.

I then used a lever bar to move the bar that I think the air cylinder should and without the engine running and the clutch down, he could select gears.

So I guess the air cylinder is our problem.

does anyone know anything about these air cylinders. Etc. ??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi, with the engine off I can not get any gears still.

today I chocked her up and put a good guy behind the wheel. I went underneath with the engine running, while my mate pressed the clutch peddle. The air cylinder did not move. I guess it should.

I then used a lever bar to move the bar that I think the air cylinder should and without the engine running and the clutch down, he could select gears.

So I guess the air cylinder is our problem.

does anyone know anything about these air cylinders. Etc. ??

Hi Pete,

 

Sorry I missed your call but I was at A&E with poor phone signal.

 

The air cylinder is only for disengaging the clutch when using the crane or winch. It isn't used when driving and shouldn't move. The pedal operates the short link rod with the two clevises (250mm-ish length) which is then connected to the shaft that passes into the side of the clutch housing. If you can release the clutch with a bar on the operating lever it suggests an adjustment issue as it seems the clutch itself is ok.

 

Can you post some photos of the clutch linkage and cylinder showing what it looks like with the engine running and air pressure up, and then with the pedal pushed down?

 

Maybe it's not releasing far enough and you can get away with it when cold because of the cold oil dragging. Once it warms up and gets thinner the drag will diminish. The 250mm-ish rod needs to be adjusted so that the release bearing is just skimming the centre part of the clutch pressure plate. That should give you the required travel. Out of interest have you investigated how many shims are present between the pressure plate and flywheel?

 

- MG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Mike, I've not looked to see how many shims are left in the clutch yet.

im glad I see this post as today I was going to remove the air cylinder as I was convinced that was my problem..

It does seem strange that when I open the air cylinder rod, I can get gears.

As it stands I can now not get any gears at the moment. Hot or cold.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name=Petelgv1;470484....

It does seem strange that when I open the air cylinder rod' date=' I can get gears.

.......[/quote]

 

Certainly points to simple adjustment issue with linkage from pedal, as if you push the air shaft with a bar it will almost certainly be moving the clutch release arm just a little more than the pedal linkage can. Even a tiny adjustment can make a big difference.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So I assume that the air cylinder works in parallel to the manual clutch pedal system? Is it possible for the air cylinder to be out of adjustment such that it effects the adjustment of the clutch pedal system?

 

trevor

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After a morning of adjusting everything clutch related with no joy, I ended up removing 1 of 4 shims from each of the 4 clutch retaining bolts. I guess this makes the pressure plate closer to the clutch plate.

I now have a clutch again and after a small adjustment on the peddle lever she seems to be ok.

Next week I'll give her a gearbox oil Change as she was worse when she got warm, then take her out and hope she is ok changing up and down.

Pete.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi, I'd just like to update this thread incase anyone has similar symptoms.

We took our clutch out in the end due to having an ongoing problem.

we immediately noticed a crack in the pressure plate.

A pain but now we no what the problem was and we can fix it.

Thanks everyone.

Pete.

image.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That clutch saw some serious abuse for that to happen!!. Glad you got the problem figured out.

 

John G

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×