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EU Commission Proposals to strengthen control of firearms

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As I read it, not just deac small arms, but anything with a turret even if deactivated. In the meantime I'm sure the terrorists are quaking in their boots. :-(

 

Andy

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That looks rather draconian, no exemption for collectors for category A, which would mean all deactivated WW2 MGs and SMGs would have to be destroyed! Surely an exemption for registered collectors would be a better compromise. Sadly I guess the UK will have little say in the matter, we will just have to implement it...by 2016!

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Well it's a good job I don't have 100 deactivate ww2 MGs in my attic!

 

if a ban occurred, they will force thousands of legal chunks of metal under ground. Unless they offer huge compensation, there is no incentive. I'd be looking at compo of about £150,000 to surrender my deacs.

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If it is deactivated to sec.8 & certified. it is NO LONGER a Firearm, & is NOT a threat!!!!

 

Or are the Government going to say they were wrong, when they implemented Sec.8 ?............

And we all know they Government NEVER admits it is wrong!!!!.....................

 

To ban these, they would have to offer compensation. As it was THEY who passed the act in the first place!

They nearly crippled themselves the last time they offered compensation on Handguns.

& definitely could not afford to do that again!.........

 

The authorites can NOT cope as it is. With renewing Firearm & shotgun Certificates in their system.

Could you imagine the HUGE & MOUNTAINOUS Task of registering HARMLESS deactivated weapons.

And also those mounted in Vehicles?.................Nah! :-X

 

They cannot cope, & that is THE bottom line! They cannot enforce the VCR act effectively. & releye on Us

To Police it ourselves, which we obviously do.

 

there are tens of tens of thousands of LEGALY held deactivated Firearms out there. Can you even BEGIN to imagine

The Chaos & problems that registration of HARMLESS lumps of Metal would bring?

There are FAR more pressing & important matters to attend to. than hounding Harmless Collectors & Enthusiasts!!!

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As always when a government has lost the ability to govern they try to take away more of our freedom. Our hobby generates millions of pounds of revenue and is very well self governed. Yet because the EU sees itself as all powerful they will penalise us for the acts of terrorists ! Handguns were outlawed in the UK yet the streets are awash with them due to totally lax border control. Many people I know have thousands of pounds invested in these INERT weapons what happens when big brother wants to melt them down ? This knee jerk attitude to law making is both misguided and aimed at the WRONG people. The people who obey the law pose NO threat to the community, those outside of the law will always ignore it. The truth is no terrorist has thought "I must get a gun licence" before committing these acts nor have they been proven to have ANYTHING to do with our hobby !

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"This Regulation shall not apply to firearms deactivated prior to the date of its application, unless those firearms are transferred to another Member State or placed on the market." Is tucked away in the small print.

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You make a very important point, there must be thousand of deactivated weapons in the UK.

 

I would much prefer they are registered as deactivated and if out of the owners possession through theft or lost that the owner has to report it. I personally would have no objection to having any deactivated weapons I own being registered with the police.

 

Diana

 

 

 

If it is deactivated to sec.8 & certified. it is NO LONGER a Firearm, & is NOT a threat!!!!

 

Or are the Government going to say they were wrong, when they implemented Sec.8 ?............

And we all know they Government NEVER admits it is wrong!!!!.....................

 

To ban these, they would have to offer compensation. As it was THEY who passed the act in the first place!

They nearly crippled themselves the last time they offered compensation on Handguns.

& definitely could not afford to do that again!.........

 

The authorites can NOT cope as it is. With renewing Firearm & shotgun Certificates in their system.

Could you imagine the HUGE & MOUNTAINOUS Task of registering HARMLESS deactivated weapons.

And also those mounted in Vehicles?.................Nah! :-X

 

They cannot cope, & that is THE bottom line! They cannot enforce the VCR act effectively. & releye on Us

To Police it ourselves, which we obviously do.

 

there are tens of tens of thousands of LEGALY held deactivated Firearms out there. Can you even BEGIN to imagine

The Chaos & problems that registration of HARMLESS lumps of Metal would bring?

There are FAR more pressing & important matters to attend to. than hounding Harmless Collectors & Enthusiasts!!!

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You make a very important point, there must be thousand of deactivated weapons in the UK.

 

I would much prefer they are registered as deactivated and if out of the owners possession through theft or lost that the owner has to report it. I personally would have no objection to having any deactivated weapons I own being registered with the police.

 

Diana

 

I agree but as in most knee jerk proposals it will be rushed through without thought or consideration for the likes of us. I hope this doesn't spell the end of our hobby as we know it and some common sense by the powers that be is shown. Registering of deactivated weapons IS the sensible approach hopefully it will be the option chosen.

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"This Regulation shall not apply to firearms deactivated prior to the date of its application, unless those firearms are transferred to another Member State or placed on the market." Is tucked away in the small print.

 

Agreed, but that only refers to changes in deactivation standards, not the apparent decision to outlaw existing deactivated Section 5 weapons.

 

Andy

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A recent article on The BBC website throws all these proposals on deactivation out of the window.

 

It indicates that most weapons now used by criminals and terrorists are from the Balkan states and one of the weapons of choice (for criminals?) is the handgun.

 

So whilst The EU is blabbering on about deactivated weapons its failing to look at what live weapons are used and where they come from.

 

Diana

Agreed, but that only refers to changes in deactivation standards, not the apparent decision to outlaw existing deactivated Section 5 weapons.

 

Andy

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Yes it is - however much they control guns they will never stop the illegal import and use of firearms. Those in power need to understand that terrorists and criminals don't register their guns they import illegally, they don't need to since they are illegal!

 

Which is self evident!

 

Diana

 

 

Show the electorate we are doing somethinmg.

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They will be banning cars next because they could run a pedestrian down.

 

im happy enough to register myself as a deac owner but it should be free of charge and that's not going to happen. In fact this whole idea won't happen. It would just destroy museums, collectors, the military ( yes our small arms trainers are deactivated L85A1s made to look like A2s).

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Considering the grief I had earlier in the year with my two De-Ac's and the Police 'Guidelines'. ACPO will be getting a warm fuzy feeling. Oh well roll on the Referendum, my choice is now fixed. :mad:

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Gentlemen, The Main point in British law is. Once a weapon has been legally Deactivated & Certified, IT CEASES TO BE A FIREARM! So, if It is inert & no longer a Firearm. WHY are they threats?................

 

We are ALL singing from the same song sheet about the fact. That Criminals ignore the Law & Legislation. THEY WILL NOT BE AFFECTED!!!!!! ONLY Law abiding Collectors & enthusiasts will suffer!

 

Also WHO would be expected to foot the bill for the Paperwork & renewal of 'Collector's Licences'? With Police Budget cut's implemented, & More to come. WHERE is the Money coming from to employ more people to set up & run this Unjust registration system?.....

 

WHY would you need a Licence for HARMLESS lumps of Metal?..................

 

The subject is even more complex & potentially unworkable for the Authorities. They are tied up with far more important & pressing problems right now. And to come!............

 

Registration would be the first step to removal from private ownership. Because their attitude is: 'Ban ANYTHING that looks like a gun. & we will be reducing Gun crime' (SIC).........Which is total rubbish!!! What they REALLY mean is, Ban anything WE want. & it will reduce our workload in whatever area is concerned at the time. Because we cannot effectively enforce existing Laws due to lack of Personel & resources at the present. & we know it's going to get worse, so screaming for even MORE Laws that we cannot keep up with. Will throw up a smokescreen & take the spotlight off us'!....

 

No, I am NOT Anti-Police, I served as a Police Officer after my Military service. So I speak from inside experience!

I think our Police do a Tough job with difficult situations through lack of Kit & resources. But Targeting Collectors & Enthusiast's. will NOT serve to reduce Armed crime from Professional Criminals!.......

 

The Bottom line is: Once deactivated & Legally Certified. a Deact is NOT a Firearm. & poses NO threat! So WHY ban something that is harmless?.....

 

Working usable Firearms are Licenced & controlled. They also Pose little threats from the Criminal fraternity. The Criminals already possess, & have specialist illegal Suppliers for what they require. Mainly abroad, THAT is what the police need to target! But they cannot do that effectively either. WHY? Because of lack of Personel & resources! Who implemented those cuts to budgets & resources? The Governments!!!! THAT is where the problems lie, with the purse string holders!!!!!

 

I am not going to mention types or catagorie's here. but there are far more Dangerous items out there which are lethal. & virtually uncontrolled to the point of lunacy! Deactivated Firearms are most certainly NOT one of them!.......:(

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LADIES and gentlemen !

 

 

Gentlemen, The Main point in British law is. Once a weapon has been legally Deactivated & Certified, IT CEASES TO BE A FIREARM! So, if It is inert & no longer a Firearm. WHY are they threats?................

 

 

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Feretfixer, you are so right. The Copper's on the beat do a lousy, antisocial job, mostly dealing with the effluent of the gene pool, and are e xpected to die for them! It is the muppets sitting in offices and Parliment who know nothing about the practical aspects of the job are the problem. Chief Officers used to have to come up from the ranks, now anyone who can convince enough people to vote for them can do the job. We get the Police we deserve, is still very true, Britian unlike many places is policed by consent. Jersey is better Police officers are elected.

 

Diana , Jackie, I know many Female Police Officers as friemds and colleguses, accept an embarrasing slip. No matter who a Police Officer is , most of them do a sterling job.

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The Main point in British law is. Once a weapon has been legally Deactivated & Certified, IT CEASES TO BE A FIREARM! So, if It is inert & no longer a Firearm.

 

If implemented, the proposal would remove that distinction for a deactivated automatic or "military" weapon and the words on the deactivation certificate would become meaningless.

 

Andy

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On face of it this is obviously very bad news. However, I wouldn't panic just yet as these are currently just proposals and a lot of things would have to happen before they actually became UK law. I would imagine a lot of people in the Home Office will be tearing their hair out at the thought of the massive expense and difficulty of enforcement when trying to implement them in the UK. Clearly they take no account of the 'facts on the ground' of deact ownership in the UK. The reasons why proposals to crack down on deact ownership in the UK have fizzled out in the past haven't gone away.

 

If the Home Secretary has any sense (well, we can dream...) she'll be telling the EC that the proposals as they stand are unrealistic as far as the UK is concerned and need major revision.

 

PS. Ironically. European Human Rights Law may be of help in this matter.

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The government can make as many laws as they like but laws work only if people obey them. I have yet to hear of a terrorist who gives a sh*t for the law. It was against the law to bomb and shoot people but it didn't stop the IRA did it ? If this knee jerk form of law making makes ONE jot of difference to a terrorists agenda it will be nothing short of a miracle. They made handguns illegal to prevent handgun crime it made NO difference and neither will these proposals. I truly hope sense prevails but in this crazy world who wants to bet on it ?

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check out the law in holland toy guns are illegal, basically if it can be used to frighten or scare anyone its banned, keep your toys in belgium thats ok :shocked:

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