wdbikemad Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Who remembers the 70s issue high-leg lightweight patrol boots, officially "boots, DMS, urban patrol".......? they were a very lightweight high-leg boot in grained leather, lace-up front, lightweight DMS sole similar (but not identical) to the standard ankle boot of the time.......I seem to recall they had no toe cap...?? They were introduced to provide a comfier alternative to the DMS boots and puttees for endless hours of pavement patrolling, were far quicker to put on than ankle boots and puttees (a vital factor in emergency call-outs) and lasted into the early 1980s......... Sought after at the time, and NI issue only, the downside was the things only lasted a few months before splitting and generally falling apart........first time I wore a pair instead of DMS boots and puttees I bust my ankle on rough ground.... Anyone ever seen the first pattern NI patrol gloves (black leather, pad on the knuckle) ? First issues also had padded upper fingers (except for the trigger finger)...later deleted as they had a tendency to catch on the handle of the riot shield........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willyslancs Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 will ask someone about the gloves mate ............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 The gloves were about. I have a pair bought from one of the shows a while back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted February 12, 2012 Author Share Posted February 12, 2012 The black leather NI gloves had a long life and remained popular throughout the UK military, becoming obsolete following the introduction of the green (later black) leather CS 95 combat gloves...... Most found today are of the 2nd pattern, retaining the pad across the knuckles but the first issue with additional padded fingers are rather rare....I think they were only manufactured for a couple of years during the 1970s..... Many commercial copies of the 2nd pattern are around and still available.......genuine issue gloves are fitted with a small white label bearing size, manufacturer, NSN & contract number, and often a date on early production....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robin craig Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 From my memory, the NI patrol boots and gloves were always looked upon as being "Gucci" kit to have and wear. Most units would not allow such "non standard" kit to be worn outside of theatre ie NI. Some units were more liberal. I remember an RCT friend turning up at another unit to unload a vehicle and being spotted wearing his NI boots by the RSM of the unit he was unloading at. Needles to say the RSM went up one side and down the other of my mate as he was not wearing regulation army kit and this "wasn't Belfast ya know laddee". There then followed a torrent of abuse all based on the theme that the RCT were less than a "real man's" outfit in the modern army and how if my mate was in a real fighting unit things would be different. A number of years later my mate was out of the RCT and in a local Police force and by amazing chance happened to pull over a speeding civvy car being driven by an off duty Captain . . . . wasnt it the one and only RSM now commisioned. Not to make a pun out of it but "the boot was on the other foot" and someone got a very long lecture on his driving habits. The once RSM never clued in who my mate was . . R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Oh Sweet!:-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Both items extremely rare and have never seen pics of either in anyones collection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienFTM Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Both items extremely rare and have never seen pics of either in anyones collection. I was last man into Omagh at end of tour in 1976. I visited the Clothing Store in search of Patrol Boots and Gloves NI but I got short shrift at the high port, allegedly because it was end of tour and they were out of stock. I always felt the clothing storeman had earmarked them as his personal buckshees. There have been threads on Arrse about both items. The boots appeared in a number of patterns, notable with and without toecap welts (pictures of both are easy to find). As stated above, Gloves NI had padded fingers less trigger fingers. About 1979 we got issued Gloves, Combat which were essentially identical to Gloves NI less any finger padding. During the intervening years, rather than wear green woolly gloves (no use when trying to work a radio and mark a map in far-sub-zero or driving rain) I wore either black leather ski gloves (available from the PRI shop and therefore semi-officially suitable in uniform) or my own German sheepskin-lined motorcycle gauntlets which in days before electrically heated motorcycle gloves were the best I was going to get. I also wore sheepskin-lined Panzerstiefel tank crewman's jackboots in the field. You have to understand that for a small country like ours to field four armoured divisions on permanent 4 hours' notice for war in BAOR and a brigade on ops in NI, savings had to be made somewhere and self-purchased non-standard uniform was accepted, nay actively approved. Just as now, I hear you say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 The green woolly gloves were, frankly, useless.......no grip, absorbed water rapidly, and weren't at all warm.......although they were polyester rather than wool I seem to recall so poor to start with......nearly as awful in fact as the green polyester socks, which combined with DMS boots and plastic mesh insoles provided the perfect recipe for athletes foot and other attractive conditions..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digger10 Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 My Old Man did a couple of tours in the province in the 70s and kept a pair of NI boots for his BFTs. When I was doing basic in the late 80s I had a problem with the BCH - I couldn't get a pair in the wide fitting so was getting crippled by them - he gave me the NI boots to try. Soles disintegrated on the first go round the assault course..so that was a disaster...i remember them being unbelievably light compared to either BCH or DMS boots (even more so with half the sole missing) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted February 19, 2012 Author Share Posted February 19, 2012 (edited) I remember during 1984 (I think) my feet were in a rather poor condition due to wearing DMS boots for long tours of duty in the field for weeks on end in poor weather......so on a rare day off I found my old NI boots in a kitbag...... It was a revelation putting them on......but within an hour I had merrily jumped out of a truck in the darkness and landed awkwardly, busting my ankle badly from which I still suffer today.... Guess my legs had got used to the support of puttees...! I think the NI boots were originally based upon the good ol' Dr Martens boots that many troops had started wearing in NI for pavement pounding, and were basically an official attempt to provide an alternative to the standard DMS ankle boot. Problem was, they were just not robust enough to last, a situation that has largely changed today with advancements in materials and construction techniques....... BCH (boots, combat, high) did not appear until around 1985 and the first version lasted until the early 90s.....but were not as well made as initially hoped with seams splitting and soles falling off....they were also rather painful to break-in....prior to that, there were few alternatives available to the DMS ankle boots that were any good..... German para boots were a popular alternative, as were RAF aircrew boots in my outfit if you could get 'em........but the other common option was to get your DMS boots extended to high-leg.......it was all really a question of what you could get away with at the end of the day.....! Edited February 19, 2012 by wdbikemad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienFTM Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 My Old Man did a couple of tours in the province in the 70s and kept a pair of NI boots for his BFTs. When I was doing basic in the late 80s I had a problem with the BCH - I couldn't get a pair in the wide fitting so was getting crippled by them - he gave me the NI boots to try. Soles disintegrated on the first go round the assault course..so that was a disaster...i remember them being unbelievably light compared to either BCH or DMS boots (even more so with half the sole missing) I first got issued CH about 1984, the year in which my daughter was two years old. When she married a few years ago I managed to find a picture I took one Sunday morning when I awoke to find her wearing my boots beside my bed but unable to move due to the weight of the boots and she was in up to her nappy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airportable Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Picked up at the Hack Green Bunker Sunday. First Pattern Combat High. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enfield1940 Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 A nostalgic sight: I had a pair of those back in my student days in the early 1990's. If memory serves I got them at an 'aerojumble' at North Weald airfield. I'm afraid they eventually got replaced with a pair of the (then) rather more trendy German 'para' boots. They in turn got replaced with a pair of German army mountain boots which fitted my narrow feet better. (Thanks be to the army surplus stall in Huddersfield market) For old times sake I now own a pair of similar German Lowa boots, although they only tend to get used when it snows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienFTM Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 A nostalgic sight: I had a pair of those back in my student days in the early 1990's. If memory serves I got them at an 'aerojumble' at North Weald airfield. I'm afraid they eventually got replaced with a pair of the (then) rather more trendy German 'para' boots. They in turn got replaced with a pair of German army mountain boots which fitted my narrow feet better. (Thanks be to the army surplus stall in Huddersfield market) For old times sake I now own a pair of similar German Lowa boots, although they only tend to get used when it snows. If you are deeply into German boots, keep an eye out for Panzerstiefel, tank crew boots for winter wear. They are short jackboots (well, short compared to jackboots, but still at least as high as CH) with a sheepskin lining. Pull-on, tick; comfy, tick; warm, tick. Job's a good'n. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 Just got these beauties today,never worn and smell lovely:cool2::cool2::cool2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airportable Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 (edited) Very nice. Intresting they are made/assembled different to mine. i.e. no. of eyeletts and heel area. The silver colour marking look close to mine in same position. But very faint due to polish etc. Edited March 30, 2012 by airportable Added extra wording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 I think I can see a "93" date on the markings ? It is just possible that the original BCH were modified in respect of the heel reinforcement area because this had been a major area of concern for comfort, durability, etc....... The boots shown look almost the same as the MK2 BCH introduced around this time, but retain the full rows of eyelets all the way to the top.....on the MK2 the upper rows were changed to speed-lacing loops...........possibly an intermediate version.....??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 I have a used pair somewhere that i used to wear regularly in the winter,will have to dig those out and compare. I always thought that the MK1 BCH had the DMS type heel and the type like mine were the MK2-never BCH came with speed lacing,thought that was an Assault boot thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted April 1, 2012 Author Share Posted April 1, 2012 I have a used pair somewhere that i used to wear regularly in the winter,will have to dig those out and compare. I always thought that the MK1 BCH had the DMS type heel and the type like mine were the MK2-never BCH came with speed lacing,thought that was an Assault boot thing? That is largely correct Harry, although issues of the MK2 BCH certainly came with upper speed lacing (as well as eyelets) by 95.....it was all part of the kit improvement surrounding CS 95 gear...... I think the pair shown, as mentioned, are a late MK1 with MK2 improvements, or, an early MK2 lacking the upper speed lacing loops........ The MK2 BCH was basically a much-revised MK1, and was often termed an "assault boot".....it was lighter than the MK1, easier to break-in, and had improved lining, padding, etc........ Over at the farm, I still have one pair each of NOS DMS boots, MK1 BCH and MK2 boots in a size 10L.......(my size ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted April 1, 2012 Share Posted April 1, 2012 On the subject of boots,i also have somewhere a pair of unissued DMS and a 60s dated pair. When were the DMS introduced into service? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share Posted April 2, 2012 On the subject of boots,i also have somewhere a pair of unissued DMS and a 60s dated pair. When were the DMS introduced into service? Hmmm...I have this somewhere...but at a guess, early to mid 60s........? Prior to this the only rubber soled boots were the CWW (cold-wet-weather) type with the screw-on commando soles........ Oddly, Marines continued with this sole, even after the introduction of the MK1 BCH............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 CWW-are these the same as the SV type boots? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdbikemad Posted April 3, 2012 Author Share Posted April 3, 2012 I think so......but there are other boots designed to accomodate skis.....? What does SV stand for...???:undecided: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch Harry Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Not sure-SOLES,VULCANISED maybe???? They are the term used to describe the WW2 era boots used by Commandos-basically Ammo boots with the leather soles replaced by the Itshide commando type soles. Also have some post war DMS type boots with the Itshide type soles-NOT converted DMS boots but made this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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