Steve 82

Hi Rick, The quick answer is - no, I do not have the code details - as mentioned I provided a swatch to `Warpaint` for copying. The level of sheen is Matt. The slightly longer answer - From my limited research of the colour as applied to the VW82, the only conclusion I have been able to draw is the apparent variety of shade applied at the factory through the war ! There was indeed a RAL code (RAL 7025 I think ?) but, since the wartime military colours were changed after the war, we cannot provide that to the paint mixer either. For what its worth, my subjective comparison of the colour from different vehicle parts that were protected from sunlight (insides of headlights etc) has led me to observe a gradual change from a deep yellow colour early-on to a more grey colour - particularly in 1945. In all instances, the colours were a very dense solid colour I do have the pigment mix proportions of a batch I hade made up from a lighter version in cellulose, but would personally go from a batch made from copying a suitably dated example. My swatch for the recent batch was provided to me by a company in Prague specialising in all models of Kubelwagen (VW82). The colour was derived by them from original parts from correct period vehicles. I have confirmed it by comparing with examples I have either obtained or seen on friends vehicles. With regards level of matting, `Warpaint` produce their paints in matt, satin and gloss - all of which are quite different. I find a level of matting somewhere between matt and satin may sometimes be required and, for this you have to experiment in small quantities to achieve the result. Anyway, hope this above gives you some idea of the issues. PM me if you need to discuss more, Cheers, Steve

Finally plummed for Warpaint. Provided them with a sample of late war Dunkelgelb and they came-up-trumps - even down to the level of matting agent. I will certainly be using them for future resprays of my collection and, would not hesitate to recommend them. Thanks for all comments, Cheers Steve

Hi, We are looking for a Bedford 4T with a command body and, Unimog U600L to support a BAOR / RAF - themed display at next years Cosford Airshow. Does anyone local (West Mids) own either of these and would like to take take part in what promises to be a cracking living history display at next June`s airshow ? The vehicles would need to be in British Army colours as would have been applied in BAOR (i.e. either NATO green or NATO green / black cammo). I believe someone on HMVF offered to support for the 2013 airshow but, we have been unable to find their details. Perhaps other forum members could help put me in touch with anyone they know who might be interested to take part. Thanks, Steve 82

Hi, We are looking for a Unimog U600L to support a BAOR / RAF - themed display at next years Cosford Airshow. Does anyone local (West Mids) own one of these and would like to take take part in what promises to be a cracking living history display at next June`s airshow ? The vehicle would need to be in British Army colours as would have been applied in BAOR (i.e. either NATO green or NATO green / black cammo). I believe someone on HMVF offered to support for the 2013 airshow but, we have been unable to find their details. Perhaps other forum members could help put me in touch with anyone the know who might be interested to take part. Thanks, Steve 82

A few more pics.......

Hi All, I was only able to come for a couple of days but, the return of the `Beltring` atmosphere - whilst less than before, was noticeable. So many good aspects outweighed the bad - which have already been discussed elsewhere. So, in order to try and not replicate pics of vehicles covered elsewhere in this thread, here are a few of my images. Cheers, Steve 82

You are welcome ! Unable to make the full weekend this year, but enjoyed the Saturday immensely Will post some pics soon (this site is not very user-friendly for posting bulk pics !) Cheers, Steve

Hi Larry, My message is a general statement under the overall heading of this thread - i.e. W&P 2017. It did not relate to your mail or or any others in the thread. Apologies for any confusion Your message was indeed very practical and well-meaning - an aspect those attending the show from the Europe should make themselves aware of. I still stand by my observations of previous shows. Cheers Steve 82

All, I really miss the build-up / anticipation of previous W&P`s. The banter for weeks before hand, early set-ups a couple of weeks before the show (and associated pikey visits), live reporting of the set-up - oh and almost forgot, the show itself ! However, the endless bickering and `slagging-off` here and elsewhere over the past few years has been unfortunate. There always was an element of belly-aching (which is human nature !) but, am convinced it has itself contributed to some of the demise in recent times. I just hope we can start to build again and, use the original site as a basis for this. Whilst the organiser will play a big part, ultimate success I suspect can only come from ourselves. Suppose the real question is, do we want our show to thrive ? I know I certainly do. Look forward to meeting old and new friends alike Cheers, Steve 82.

Hi all, Has anyone in the UK (or elsewhere) used the company `War-paint` for Wehrmacht colours - and in particular Dunkelgelb ? I have heard no feedback on its success and, since I am uncertain which period their paint reflects (the shade differed throughout the War), then I would appreciate any feedback. Regards Steve 82

`I just can't think of what the truck is , something from the 1970's methinks , fibre-glass based on VW Beetle floorpan ?` Sorry to dissapoint, but the vehicle is VW181. Over 50,000 were produced between 1969 and 1982 for certain NATO armies and, sold in lesser quantities on the civilian market in several countries. Utilising none of the WW2 panels, the build quality of the VW181 was a big improvement over the original Kubel (VW82). Incidentally, the car was based on a VW Carman Ghia floor-pan, with a beefed-up suspension. The car in the pic looks in reasonable condition with only minor changes at the front (missing issue military bull bar) As for the uniforms - the tunic and caps look almost modern Bundeswehr? Was similarly stopped maybe 20 years ago driving my VW181 by 2 local cops who pulled me over at a roadblock (on the pretence of checking for escaped prisoners). Both wanted to know everything about my car and, we all had a good laugh with everyone taking it for the humour that it was meant to convey. Sad times we live in where the guys on the front line cannot even have a laugh without risking being reprimanded ! Steve 82. Names (repeatable - in public anyway) for the vehicle: VW181 = LH drive model and called `Thing` in the US, `Safari` in Mexico, `kubel` in Germany and other continental countries VW182 = RH drive model and called `Trekker` in the UK

Great to see this thread developing into a more balanced discussion - especially given the endless rumours/second-hand stories circulated before the event. From our perspective (myself and the family), we really enjoyed the show this year. The improvements in booking-in formalities, facilities management (toilets / showers / dust suppression / site bus / catering etc) were most welcome which, coupled with the chilled atmosphere made for a great environment to meet our many existing (and some new) UK and European friends. Without repeating the issues already raised, I just wanted to reiterate two aspects of the show of greart interest to me: Overseas Visitors - One aspect I have not seen raised to any great extent is the significant number of European visitors / re--enactors / exhibitors / traders who grace the show - without who`s numbers, the event would not have swelled to its current size and diversity. I have learnt from my German, Dutch and Belgian friends that this years event did not coincide with Continental school holidays which, coupled with memories of last year`s `Operation Stack` undoubtedly led to a reduction in attendences. Despite this, the number of different languages heard around the show was impressive ! I sincerely hope the organisers remain mindful of this when planning both the future timing and location of the show. Post-War interests - I would also urge that we do not overlook Post-War vehicles / re-enacting. Looking across the show fields over the years, the trend in collecting these vehicles - either out of choice , practicality or affordability is clearly visible, with the total numbers often exceeding WW2 exhibits. IMHO profit-making show organisers planning to exclude / marginalise these interests do-so at their financial peril ! Thats all for now, except to congratulate the organisers on a good first-attempt at W&P. However, I would also urge them to address at least some of the more pressing observations made in this thread if the decline of the show is to be avoided. Hope to meet at least some of you next year (event permitting !) Cheers Steve 82

Greeting from Kidderminster ! Firstly, a big congratulations to Emma, Amy and the team for taking-on and further developing the show. Am sure Bob and Shirley James would have been really pleased with the way in which they are carrying the event forward. We certainly are. Despite the wet weather during the preceding days, the weekend – for the most part turned out well – not least because of the weather, but also the quality and extent of displays, activities and, public attendance (car park seemed quite full on both days !). As usual, we formed part of the VMARS display, and operated a working NATO Cold-War communications set-up during the early mornings – `relaxing` over the rest of the days. Again displaying the Unimog telex station and VW181 (kubel) radio-car, the theme this time was to set-up in a mobile mode – ready to scarper in the event that the Ruskies spotted our location The Saturday morning VMARS radio-net was busy and, Cadet Civilian Instructor - Pete Coates (see his rather well-equipped Landy below) managed around 70 contacts during an international competition which went-on all weekend. Also noted is the gradually increase in the number of ex-Bundeswehr NATO vehicles (apart from my own !) – which reflect at least in part what was once the largest European contributor to NATO, with around 500,000 Army personnel. Was good to see several taking part in the arena this year. Finally, I focussed my photography on the working radio-equipped vehicles this time, and, look forward to seing the images of other vehicles and displays. Cannot wait for next year ! Cheers Steve 82

Hi Simon, The show is most definitely going ahead ! Just preparing for our VMARS groups display of (mostly) vehicle-mounted ex-NATO comms kit. Not been down the site for a couple months, but will post some images when I am there over the coming week. Looking forward to attending - all we need now is the weather........ Cheers, Steve 82

Sean, The problem I have is getting accurate colours made-up. With two exceptions (a few years back) where I had paint successfully matched to un-weathered surfaces on the inside of a couple of ex-NATO vehicles, the following 6-times met with significant variation. The colour used - RAL 6014 (dark olive) was a standard colour through the 60/70/80`s on German vehicles and equipment and, variations in level of matting aside, incorrect colours (presumably through pigment variation) are frustratingly easy to spot ! I realise that some veriability is inevitable but, was hoping of finding a UK supplier / mixing company with a good reputation for authenticity - short of going back to a German manufacturer who specialises in this. Cheers Steve 82

Greets from Kidderminster, In theory, should you require a can of paint for your pride and joy - provided you know the paint code, then you should end up with a representative finish - right ....? I must say, that has rarely been my experience and, I have had to have several `discussions` with paint shops with regards their mixing of RAL 6014 - to name a few :nut:. If anyone can recommend a company providing reliable and accurate coloured paints then I would be most grateful Thanks Steve 82

Thanks all for your responses. Cheers, Steve

I am having a Spring cleanout and, in preparation for an upcoming project need to let some stuff go - including militaria, radio kit, vehicle, trailer and spares. Could I please ask fellow members for their suggestions as to reliable online methods for advertising (am hearing bad things with regards Ebay. Of course I realise there is the facility here and, milweb. Any thoughts / suggestions / experiences would be much apreciated. Cheers, Steve

Some more images..... Enjoy ! Cheers General views over the field / arena / stalls Civvie Vehicles WW2 German displays 1:1 model Spitfire (working Merlin !)

Hi All, A bit slow off the mark posting my photos this year – that dirty four letter word again – work ! Firstly - a big thanks again for the efforts by Paul Valides and Bob James in facilitating such a great show for us all. Anyone who deals with Paul will know the extra mile he went-to in his efforts. And let`s not forget the efforts of his supporting show-team ! The show has matured so much these past few years, and continues to grow – both MV attendance and number of military and civilian re-enactors. We set up our display of ex-NATO (Bundeswehr) communications vehicles and equipment on the Thursday as part of the wider VMARS (Vintage Military and Amateur Radio Society) display. The focus of our display was to show the vehicles this time (as opposed to a tactical set-up) and, the area was located on the uphill side of the show ground , offering an excellent take-off point for our transmissions. Anyone who visited could not help but note our masts along the skyline ! With so many masts, live power and transmission lines across our designated area, visitors respected the hazard tape marking our boundary and, waited to be safely guided to view our exhibits. We were so pleased with the positive comments from our visitors and enjoyed the opportunity to explain something of the equipment and its historical context. Starting to think of some display ideas for next year already :-D I therefore attach below a small collection of images I took over the event – both of my display and, more general images to give some idea of the show`s atmosphere. The collection is by no means comprehensive. For more images and video (not my own), try a youtube search `Wartime in the Vale 2015`. I believe also that the photographer – Richard Kyte ( http://www.rjkytephotography.co.uk/c0084/c0084.html ) has started to post his quality show images on his website. All the best for now, Cheers, Steve Our Display: VMARS Lineup Random MV`s To be continued.....

Despite the grass and the toilets...... there are a few less-than-positive UK-based comments - would be interesting to hear feedback from more of our overseas visitors - who still make-up a large proportion of those attending. Regarding a mobile `embankment`, I think temporary grandstands are quite common these days and, leave minimum impact on the ground. Am sure the W&PR coffers could stretch to providing something more than a 1m - high earth bund ???? The comments on a lack of atmosphere are also valid ..... to a point. I recall how there were definite `neighbourhoods`around the previous site, where you knew you would find old friends each year. Admittedly, this is something that will develop, but it took several years to establish. On a personal level, the cost of fuel has priced me out of bringing anything remotely `large` to the event and, have tended to focus my display / re-enactment efforts closer to home over the past few years (since before the move to the new site). Cheers Steve 82

Great to see so many improvements across the site – well done to the organising team. The access track around the site, loo`s, showers, restaurants etc made such a difference to the day-day life at the event. Even the Marshalls seemed to have taken more `happy` pills than normal and, their stirling efforts to assist folks enter and leave the site were much appreciated. No-one can prevent foul weather however….the on-going deterioration of the entrances to almost all of the `fields` made access by 2-wheel drive all but impossible. Those that did make it through were having to speed in order just to keep moving – a dangerous gamble given the close proximity of so many pedestrians. From a Health and Safety perspective (and I do this for a living), may I suggest that some investment in additional temporary surfacing might be in order before anything unfortunate occurs. A very enjoyable week however – well done and thank-you to all the show team. See you next year.

Our fourth set of pics

Our third group of pics

Second group of pics