kurtino Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 hello everybody i'm Lorenzo aka kurtino from varese (near milan) in italy. my job is maintenance technician on electronics devices I'm 48 years old and my second hobby is restoring military vehicles when possible. My last work was done on a land rover lightweight mk2 and vw iltis type 181 both sold. Now I found in switzerland an humber pig mk1 and before proceeding to purchase i wanted know some information about this vehicle like origin, mileage, story, ecc. I apologize for my bad English. greetings from italy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john1950 Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 Welcome. Your English is better than my Italian would be, so do not worry about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 Welcome Lorenzo. I congratulate on your choice of vehicle, I knew there was one in Switzerland but only had a poor image of it. I have put together some information that may be of help from the records I have here, but can provide no information about it's service life. I think you may get this from the Tank Museum, there is no record card for it at the Royal Logistics Corps Museum. If you can provide a picture of the armoured contract plate I can tell you where the Pig body was made. Bear in mind all Pigs started out life as soft skinned trucks. This plate is smaller that the chassis plate & is located on the passenger side just below the front window. 14 BK 01 FV1601 CT later GS Truck (not armoured) Contract No. 6/V/6443 Chassis No. 21401 Engine No. 7261 Date in Service: 21/12/53 Depot Receipt Voucher: CBR/R/4677 Delivered to 31st B Vehicle Depot Church Broughton Converted to Armoured under Contract No. 6/V/27445 during 1959/60 To become FV1611A (Personnel Carrier, no winch) Struck Off Census: 15/5/67 Sold at Auction: 4/10/67 Second day of sale at Ordnance Storage & Disposal Depot, Ruddington Sale No. 92 Lot No. 803 Price: £80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 14, 2017 Author Share Posted August 14, 2017 many thanks for your answer. the current owner told me that it was a swiss army test vehicle, the air box external, the air filter internal and the oil filter are missing.....where i found the spare ? the gearbox are locked but the 4x4 traction diff in neutral gear moves the wheels, the steering are damage. 2000 euro is a good price? (more or less 1800 GBP) have a good day, guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 14, 2017 Author Share Posted August 14, 2017 many thanks for your answer. the current owner told me that it was a swiss army test vehicle, the air box external, the air filter internal and the oil filter are missing.....where i found the spare ? the gearbox are locked but the 4x4 traction diff in neutral gear moves the wheels, the steering are damage. 2000 euro is a good price? (more or less 1800 GBP) have a good day, guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 14, 2017 Author Share Posted August 14, 2017 unfortunately the contract plate has been remove Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 That is a good price but of course is offset by things you will have make, replace or repair. The external air filter cover could be made, the air filter is quite common to many Rolls Royce B Series engines of the 1950s & so is the oil filter. Most commonly available for Ferret. Banisters would be a good source (but not cheap) http://www.milweb.net/go/banister/ A gearbox might be difficult, the few I have seen in recent years have been wrongly described as for Pig but actually were for GS as they do differ. Steering what is the damage? Has some silly person tried to tow it using the steering rods rather than the shackles? Tyres will be a problem as they are run-flat (that is why no spare was carried) are no longer made, they are larger than the GS tyres. You would be very lucky to find any. You are lucky that the rear side lockers, wings & light guards seem to be there. At least it seems not to have been messed around by a previous owner trying to embellish it with novelties to make it look tougher or stranger according to his fantasies. I have seen all sorts of horrible things apart from too many of everything fitted, but bling & even WW2 markings :cry: Does the engine run? Shame about the armour contract plate. Can you show me a close up of the vertical bar on the outside behind each side door externally that is the full height of the vehicle (not the smaller bars just on the flat surface) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony B Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 Welcome in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 14, 2017 Author Share Posted August 14, 2017 the steering box has lost the balls. the engine has not been started since many years, i dont know if it is damage/blocked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 14, 2017 Author Share Posted August 14, 2017 They are the only photos I have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 14, 2017 Author Share Posted August 14, 2017 When the current owner has loaded it on the truck in 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 15, 2017 Author Share Posted August 15, 2017 hi everybody another day, another answer..... how can i find the DOS FORM 419b about the pig in question? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted August 15, 2017 Share Posted August 15, 2017 As I said I think your best bet is from the Tank Museum. I know finding the history might be interesting, but would you not buy it if it didn't have an interesting history & it just spent most of its life in a storage depot? With respect for your enthusiasm, I would have thought before worrying about researching its history in the Army, you need to do more of an assessment on whether you think that it is going to be a viable restoration for you. Or have you fallen in love with it & going to buy it anyway? :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 15, 2017 Author Share Posted August 15, 2017 i loved it since first time that i watched it, but i have a little problem with the italian customs i must garantee the legal origin and history of the vehicle and prepare so many documents.....:-X Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted August 15, 2017 Share Posted August 15, 2017 Ah I thought it must be love. Strangely I have been helping someone who is trying to export a Pig into Switzerland. It may help you if I send you the data pages from the User Handbook or maybe the FVRDE Design Spec. The scans I have posted are from official documents. I could send you scans of the complete pages to give it more context & a scan of the front cover of the sales catalogue. The entry in the official ledger clearly shows the date when it was struck off census (no longer in military service) & the official sales catalogue showing when it was finally disposed of. You are certain that the armoured contract plate has been removed & not just heavily over-painted? It is only about 2cm x 10cm held on with a rivet at each corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 15, 2017 Author Share Posted August 15, 2017 the plate (on passenger side) is missing (i think remove by the second owner) impossible recovery it. any kind of help is welcome. thank you for the patience I must declare that the vehicle is oil-free otherwise I have to pay a tax for adisposal fee, and also is demilitarized gun/cannon-free Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted August 15, 2017 Share Posted August 15, 2017 Oil free? That seems extraordinary, do they just mean drain the engine of oil or must it include gearbox, transfer box, differentials & Tracta housings? I assume they are concerned about the disposal of old oil. What if you undertook to drain all old oil dispose of it correctly in Switzerland & replenish with new clean oil to avoid damage to the vehicle if moved without lubricants. If the vehicle was in running order & was driven to the border would they expect it to be drained & driven into Italy with no lubrication? It wouldn't get very far :-( Does this just apply to historic vehicles or would you have the same issues importing say a Fiat Panda? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 15, 2017 Author Share Posted August 15, 2017 You do not have to be surprised Italy is the land of strange laws. if you have a shop you must pay a tax on the shadow of his tent on public ground. However,I think that the problem is old oil in a non-operative vehicle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 22, 2017 Author Share Posted August 22, 2017 I have found the documentation that I will have to submit to the Italian customs and as I already knew there is self-certification of the amount of engine oil, the absence of hydrofluorocarbons in the shock absorbers and demilitarization certificate. The Customs also asks a fiche certificate with all vehicle specifications, someone tells me where to find this information? british army, museum, some good samaritan:) ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fv1609 Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 I have never heard of a "fiche certificate" but I assume it is a summary of the design specifications presented for convenience in microfiche as it may be a wordy document & to have it on a single fiche is easier than lots of sheets of paper. I have the FVRDE Design Specifications I can scan for you & together with the Data Summary I have given before, should cover that aspect. "demilitarization certificate" I don't whether that means any offensive weaponry has been rendered safe or whether it means a release certificate to show it hasn't been stolen from the army. I hope it doesn't mean the decommissioning of any military feature to make it as a civilian version of the vehicle. Because the Humber was not a military version of a civilian truck, there was no civilian equivalent it was designed exclusively as a military vehicle. I remember once hearing of an ex-military Land Rover imported into Spain that had to have all the military wiring removed & replaced with a civilian loom. That was many years ago not some crack-pot new European idea. I am away at show for a week so have no access to my books, not sure whether I have anything that covers the shock absorbers, but I think there is something that covers rebuilding them. So that might include the liquid & that might be linked to a Defence Standard or STANAG or at least a NATO product code. Release certificate is difficult but there is evidence from the scan of the register that it was removed from the army register = struck off census. Then the Ruddington sales catalogue shows having been removed from army jurisdiction then it was sold legitimately to a private individual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtino Posted August 24, 2017 Author Share Posted August 24, 2017 many thanks clive- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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