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Looking for assistance re S3 Lightweight Military history


pontyslapper

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Hi All,

 

I've stumbled on this fine website in my search, nay, quest for any snippets of military history relating to my father in law's retirement project - a 1973 S3 Lightweight.

 

So far I've contacted/worked out the following :-

 

Build date - 18th May 1973

Chassis No. 951-01236-A

 

I've contacted RLC Archive who say they've yet to come across the cards for our Lightweight, but they did find info on 951-01235-A - the chassis number immediately before, and that entered service in July 1973 and eventually ended up with the RAF. The very helpful chap at RLC seemed to think that it was highly likely that ours ended up possibly doing similar and ending up with the RAF.

 

I have also done the usual FoI requests for any Merlin info, but I didn't have any luck as it was pre-Merlin. Currently waiting on an FoI from the RAF and RAF Museum and also the heritage certificate from Gaydon.

 

Any help or even little pointers would be gratefully received as I would dearly love to be able to glean some info about where the FiL's lightweight has been over its lifetime.

 

Many Thanks

Paul

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I have 19FM65 95101107A

 

It was 30/4/73 receipt voucher at Ashchurch , so thingies more or less fall in line.

 

1973 , I would expect that if RAF then it would originally have been painted in RAF Blue/Grey , not DBG.

 

Most L'wt's are sort of known, try Forum search appeals , try working backwards with PO's - you may get to somebody in possession still of the "Release Notes".

 

There is the odd person out there who would run it to earth for a few ££ , not may ££ but I have never used him , somebody will advise on this ,,

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From my own personal experience, a request to the RAF Museum with just the chassis number will yield the VRN, if the vehicle ever was in RAF service.

 

Mine is 95103788a, date in service 24th July 1974, and I can confirm that the original colour was Blue gray. Of course, there is a very small possibility, if the base colour was Bronze Green (that was the colour of the ones ordered by the army and marines), that it might have been originally army/marines and then later taken over by the RAF. This is a very remote chance, I repeat.

 

If you want to check the original colour, if the landrover has never been taken apart,look at the underneath of the seatbox, and if that fails, try splitting the upper and lower bulkhead, and check underneath the rubber strip.

 

Regards

 

Martin

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Looked into this a bit more , seems it is FMW

 

 

For a fee of £5 FMW can also try and find your Military registration plate (ERM) from your Chassis number. Email Geoff at freemil@btinternet.com

 

To save a lot of hassle , then £5 to get your ERM - then that should set the ball rolling.

Edited by ruxy
spelin
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So far, I have done the following searches based on the advice here and on other forums.

 

MOD FoI request - nothing as it was pre-MERLIN

RAF Museum - pointed me at the forums as a possible source of help

RAF - still waiting

Heritage Museum, Gaydon - Heritage Certificate purchased, found out the colour and build date and first 'home'

RLC Archive - card in the big 500k pile - next chassis along was in service in July 1973 and ended up with RAF.

 

So, I am hoping that somebody might, just might be able to help me find the military number plate that was attached to chassis no. 951-01236A or its current civvy plate UCU971Y. It seems that the military number is the 'keys to the kingdom' with regards to information.

 

UPDATE ---

 

Turns out the original colour was RAF Blue Grey. Build date was 18th May 1973. Despatch date was 25th May 1973. Its destination was Central Army Vehicle Depot, Ashchurch. Label (line) number 3/786??

 

I guess, its time for the moths to again be released in order to elicit that elusive military number!

 

Thanks to those who have added to my understanding so far. Its a really interesting thing to research. For any piece of info I've found, I've uncovered a host of 'side' information that is also really interesting.

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When the truck was first road registered as UCU971Y , then UC = London C alternatively CU = South Shields

 

It seems it is CU therefore DVLA South Shields would hold the records , however all local offices ISTR are now closed & show in total run from Swansea HQ.

 

Almost certainly when the registration form application was sent / presented at counter, then they would have needed to see the all important "Release Notes" and a photo-copy would be taken , this would state the mil. VRM and chassis No.

 

Looks like a DVLA Swansea search needed ,,

Edited by ruxy
amd.
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  • 5 years later...

Holy thread...back from the dead!

After periods of illness both for myself and the father in law... the lightweight is almost done - it starts/moves under its own steam. Just a few little bits and bobs left when the current lockdown eases and it'll be on the road.

 

As its almost ready I stumbled across some 5 year old emails from my search for information on the old girl. I never did get to the bottom of things so I guess I'm going to restart the search.

Hopefully, some archivist somewhere has digitised the bits and bobs.

 

 

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  • 1 year later...

Hi, I have just been directed to this site as I have what I would describe as a maintenance plate for a lightweight I owned in 1982 (UCU 971Y) I had put it on eBay for someone who had lost one. Did not even realise it had the chassis number on.

I also have some before and after pictures which you may like or not, I was only 17.

Anyway, I will keep an eye on your post or with some help from LTWTBarmy I will get this back to you. I took it off to paint the Land Rover and just didn’t get around to replacing it. I will remove from ebay.

Regards , 

Tony Collins.

07877840500.

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2 minutes ago, ruxy said:
This listing was ended by the seller because the item is no longer available.
 

I wonder why ... (hopefully it has gone to its rightful owner)

411898174_lightweightplate.thumb.jpg.331861eab8c35f0f58290190dabe08c1.jpg

Looks like 59AM11 , Geof Fletcher, should have all the info on this

Cheers

Richard

 

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5 minutes ago, 64EK26 said:

I wonder why ... (hopefully it has gone to its rightful owner)

411898174_lightweightplate.thumb.jpg.331861eab8c35f0f58290190dabe08c1.jpg

Looks like 59AM11 , Geof Fletcher, should have all the info on this

Cheers

Richard

 

There's a few possibilities but it's most strange - why was it pulled ?  is the rightful owner the legal paper beneficial owner or  'keeper' as in finders.  The LWT left Solihull as a  90A  Helicopter start version , quite rare for time-line , I don't know if the extra equipment was same as such trucks much later and in fact last of like KA  ,  the starters then seemed to be hardtop & SW door , however - I knew of a KA  90A and it seemed to have been always basic spec. with hood.

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Relax everyone, there is nothing nefarious happening. I contacted the seller, and he pulled the item as soon as I told him, and additionally, he wants to give the ID plate to the current owner. In fact, he will be joining HMVF to make direct contact with the current owner to return the plate. This is his first response (the second is to let me know his request to join HMVF is pending)- Hi Many thanks for that.
I will make contact with the chap in the thread and give it to him. UCU 971Y was my toy many years ago and I also have some renovation photographs he may appreciate. That said due to the time lapse and my amateur renovations were as a 17yr old I’m sure it’s been stripped down again over the years. 
Many thanks.
Regards,
Tony.

Edited by ltwtbarmy
Dataplate seller email
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13 hours ago, Cashvan said:

Just to let you know, the ID plate for your Lightweight is on ebay at the moment, I hope you see this comment in time! 

@CashvanWell done by the way, good spot! Let’s see if we manage to reunite plate with owner now.

Edited by ltwtbarmy
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It is easy to tell a FAKE  LR  nomenclature plate = most are vinyl printed rather than anodized.

This plate always would be rare in TYPE  and number because it is for a  Non-FFR  90 A , produced in small batch often as a bolt-on Item No. to a Contract.     Not normal -  the  TRUCK UTILITY   4x4  90A  etc. info. is actually stamped using a generic , rather than a specific anodized plate  for Contract No. / Item No.

Among the S2A / Rover 1  and S3  Lightweights , there are more than several specific plates - this greatly aids the detection of rogues and ringers.

With a change to a new 'replacement' legal galvanized chassis - you can do nothing at all and remain legal , there are things you can do to maintain a little anti-theft security.

There are hundreds of LWT  "ringers" around in UK and abroad for a number of reasons.   The ideal is a check of documentation for root of title / legal beneficial ownership.  A detail check of the vehicle hardware can reveal much , over  abt. 18 years of production there were many subtle changes ,  due to much MOD and private bitsa parts replacements this just makes a survey a bit more time-consuming.

Seat base ID plates & bulkhead nomenclature plates  + VIN plates (if applicable) are very important.   Any of the above plates missing and I would walk , even if the truck was good and I was interested in purchase.  This is due to the fact that for self - having original plates is most important,  the £ valuation should be heavily knocked down if any missing.

It is a fact that many have had  fraudulent"historic" status for several years that did not deserve as too new (at the time).  Due to the 40 year rolling rule - many of these are falling legit in original identity.  The vast majority of these have sported a civilian LR ID plate of historic age , often S2A from a scrapper.   Providing the branded chassis No. was just heavily coated with paint / underseal - no great problem to wheel it out under own correct ID , if the original plates still to hand - all the better.   During years as "ringer" and if a MOT certificate was needed , the examiner is not polis - he just needs to see a chassis / identity VIN  (it can be on Dymo tape stuck anywhere) - he just needs to log a ID in his notebook and enter to gain correct access to the  DVSA mainframe.

Obviously the past 'ringer'  to save on £££ for road fund  VED will pass a higher £ valuation because if caught with a wrongful plate it should be crushed and in any case both the guilty & subsequent innocent purchasers insurance (if they have it) is void.

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23 hours ago, Katmiab said:

Hi, I have just been directed to this site as I have what I would describe as a maintenance plate for a lightweight I owned in 1982 (UCU 971Y) I had put it on eBay for someone who had lost one. Did not even realise it had the chassis number on.

I also have some before and after pictures which you may like or not, I was only 17.

Anyway, I will keep an eye on your post or with some help from LTWTBarmy I will get this back to you. I took it off to paint the Land Rover and just didn’t get around to replacing it. I will remove from ebay.

Regards , 

Tony Collins.

07877840500.

Hi Tony,

welcome onboard, really good of you to try and reunite the plate with the vehicle.  Do you have anything military in your garage these days?

 

Cheers,

Julian

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Hi Julian,

Thanks for that. No nothing Military other than a rifle rack for a lightweight which too is on eBay along with lots of Land Rover stuff. Currently have a Discovery 4 but desperate for a good Series 2 to come my way. Hopefully someone on here will know Pontyslapper and I can get the plate to him. I honestly cannot believe it is still going as it had quite a hard life competing in AWDC speed safaris ( Don’t tell Pontyslappers father in law). I very nearly threw the plate in the bin, it was a pal who suggested someone might appreciate it on eBay. Did not even cross my mind to try and find a current owner of UCU 971Y. Anyway, here’s hoping!

Regards,

Tony.

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Hi all.

Just had an email about this.

This is amazing news and a chunk of history!

I shall get onto the chap with the ID plate today to sort something to marry the bits together.

It's not far from being on the road - currently on hold due to health issues and the father in law in the process of moving house.

Next time I get chance I'll pop over to the storage unit and get some photos if I can.

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This was some point in 2017 - it had got to the point of how much chassis is there to weld to. 

Decision was made to treat it to a shiny new Richards galvanised chassis.

It has been ground up restored - its not a rivet counter project by any means. Its now a sort of cream colour and some alterations have been made so the father in law can use it - he's a tall big bugger, so obvious alteration had to be the seat area.

He sometimes mentions selling it, then not. I think it's his age and health that put those evil thoughts in his head. I just have to get hold of him and give his head a wobble about what he has and the time and effort he's put into it.

20170528_183157.jpg

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Had a squiz through some old online photo storage thingybobs and turned up the following photos of the old girl at various stages...

Was green when purchased. Then the stripdown revealed a slightly unhealthy chassis.

As she is now, well last Summer. I think that was before we popped a hardtop on just so we could store bits in there ready for the impending house move.

 

 

20150308_113631.jpg

20150317_175226.jpg

20161030_120304.jpg

FB_IMG_1585401423382.jpg

IMG-20160502-WA0000.jpg

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Hi all,

Just opened the plate from our very kind friend.

The reg is actually 59 AM 44.

I'd already enquired to RAF Hendon using 59 AM 11 - turns out that was a red Ford Escort.

Hopefully we'll uncover a tranche of history with the right reg.

 

Again, thanks to all involved in this history search.

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