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Quiet, low profile life of a Sherman owner........


Jack

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Does not do our cause any good when our preserved vehicles are used in this manner, just bad publicity for all of us.

I live in the USA and we have similar problems at times with government...I think just the opposite that it's about time people learn and be more understanding and respectful about people in general...The tank is a reminder of the many wars that we have all been thru in an attempt to preserve our individual rights...The owner of the tank was respectful in the way he was protesting...

People all over have had enough of stupid politicians....

I wish the people the very best in a fair outcome to them...

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I know it's a little like Oddball to say it but....."what a beautiful tank !!!" :)

It sure is a beauty..I'll never be in that money bracket...I do really love my 1954 Ferret MK1...

Here in the USA the Shermans cost approximately $300,000.00 US dollars...

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It sure is a beauty..I'll never be in that money bracket...I do really love my 1954 Ferret MK1...

Here in the USA the Shermans cost approximately $300,000.00 US dollars...

 

Sadly Joe nor will most of us, especially if such exorbitant parking permit charges become the norm :-D

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Hey Joe it must make you mad knowing every single one of them was built over that side of the Atlantic :) .and.....how many were made??? Jeeeez! .... They do appear for sale here in the UK relatively regularly but they are always up around the £300,000 ..£s !! :) whether anyone is actually getting that sort of money though is a matter that some of the tank boys on here may be able to comment on :)

I did read somewhere on the 'unit cost' of a Sherman at the height of their production and as I remember ..I think it was about $30,000 dollars ??.. ...I guess they weren't 'cheap' back then when you consider what wages were in 1945 ?? . :)

Going off thread a little I know and I apologise in advance .........

..........have you ever seen the article in I think the magazine is called 'Home Mechanics' about a scrap dealer fella up New York way who bought about 1500 (?) of them in one go after the war? they were brand new and had only traveled as far as a Military arsenal where they had sat unused because the war had ended as they were built.....I think he bought them in about 1950 (?) and once the deal was sealed he was responsible for moving them pronto off Government property ..he managed to do it and even advertised for ex Armoured US Army Mechanics and drivers to come and have a job working for him....anyways..sorry to digress a bit but it's a cracking read......someone on here may be able to find a link to the story for you :) oh...I think..not sure...but I think his 'unit cost' was about $3000 each :) EDIT: sorry !! totally wrong ! his unit cost was about ..wait for it...$600 each !!!!

 

EDIT: OK..after a little digging ...the magazine was called 'Popular Mechanics' and the issue he was featured in was from 1960 so ..a little later than I suggested..here's a link ! :) oh and it was 536 Shermans he bought apparently :)

 

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=Z9sDAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA81&pg=PA81-IA2&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false

Edited by RattlesnakeBob
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The subjects been discussed before:

 

http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?28040-Armoured-vehicles-and-tanks-used-in-silly-publicity-stunts&highlight=publicity

 

If im frank, the Bristol protesters looks all very 'upper - middle class' and generaly law abiding.

 

Some other groups however look much more subversive and likely to cause raised eybrows from those in power.

Its the knee jerk reactions from the Daily Mail readers that worries me.

 

Just as a matter of interest why is no DVLA number plate visible on the vehicle?

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Hey Joe it must make you mad knowing every single one of them was built over that side of the Atlantic :) .and.....how many were made??? Jeeeez! .... They do appear for sale here in the UK relatively regularly but they are always up around the £300,000 ..£s !! :) whether anyone is actually getting that sort of money though is a matter that some of the tank boys on here may be able to comment on :)

I did read somewhere on the 'unit cost' of a Sherman at the height of their production and as I remember ..I think it was about $30,000 dollars ??.. ...I guess they weren't 'cheap' back then when you consider what wages were in 1945 ?? . :)

Going off thread a little I know and I apologise in advance .........

..........have you ever seen the article in I think the magazine is called 'Home Mechanics' about a scrap dealer fella up New York way who bought about 1500 (?) of them in one go after the war? they were brand new and had only traveled as far as a Military arsenal where they had sat unused because the war had ended as they were built.....I think he bought them in about 1950 (?) and once the deal was sealed he was responsible for moving them pronto off Government property ..he managed to do it and even advertised for ex Armoured US Army Mechanics and drivers to come and have a job working for him....anyways..sorry to digress a bit but it's a cracking read......someone on here may be able to find a link to the story for you :) oh...I think..not sure...but I think his 'unit cost' was about $3000 each :) EDIT: sorry !! totally wrong ! his unit cost was about ..wait for it...$600 each !!!!

 

EDIT: OK..after a little digging ...the magazine was called 'Popular Mechanics' and the issue he was featured in was from 1960 so ..a little later than I suggested..here's a link ! :) oh and it was 536 Shermans he bought apparently :)

 

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=Z9sDAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA81&pg=PA81-IA2&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false

I don't get mad,a lot of armour is over in Europe and deserves to be where they fought at...You people over there went thru hell during the war and I can only hope the new generations post WW2 will appreciate what you all went thru...We all have a common bond of keeping history alive thru our hobby...

I know all the people I ever talked to said once they fought in WW2 and came home they never really wanted to see that stuff again.....I wonder how many are still here in someone's buildings...Over here they are constantly finding so called barn finds of 60 year old plus cars that were simply put away...

I say keep up the hobby and educate people how important it is...Vote those idiot politicians out of office...

Popular Mechanics is a great read but never heard about the tanks..

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Hey Joe it must make you mad knowing every single one of them was built over that side of the Atlantic :) .and.....how many were made??? Jeeeez! .... They do appear for sale here in the UK relatively regularly but they are always up around the £300,000 ..£s !! :) whether anyone is actually getting that sort of money though is a matter that some of the tank boys on here may be able to comment on :)

I did read somewhere on the 'unit cost' of a Sherman at the height of their production and as I remember ..I think it was about $30,000 dollars ??.. ...I guess they weren't 'cheap' back then when you consider what wages were in 1945 ?? . :)

Going off thread a little I know and I apologise in advance .........

..........have you ever seen the article in I think the magazine is called 'Home Mechanics' about a scrap dealer fella up New York way who bought about 1500 (?) of them in one go after the war? they were brand new and had only traveled as far as a Military arsenal where they had sat unused because the war had ended as they were built.....I think he bought them in about 1950 (?) and once the deal was sealed he was responsible for moving them pronto off Government property ..he managed to do it and even advertised for ex Armoured US Army Mechanics and drivers to come and have a job working for him....anyways..sorry to digress a bit but it's a cracking read......someone on here may be able to find a link to the story for you :) oh...I think..not sure...but I think his 'unit cost' was about $3000 each :) EDIT: sorry !! totally wrong ! his unit cost was about ..wait for it...$600 each !!!!

 

EDIT: OK..after a little digging ...the magazine was called 'Popular Mechanics' and the issue he was featured in was from 1960 so ..a little later than I suggested..here's a link ! :) oh and it was 536 Shermans he bought apparently :)

 

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=Z9sDAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA81&pg=PA81-IA2&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

That article about the tanks was awesome...I just can't imagine the work that was needed to do all of that...

Thank you..

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In the 50's and especially the 60's here in the USA it was the trend to not to be seen with anything with rust...Everybody wanted modern things....That guy that bought all those tanks took a tremendous risk as everybody here wanted to just forget about the WW2 and the Korean War..The thing here was to take a car drive in the country and have picnics...

I grew up in the Chicago area with a lot of steel mills..I hate to think about any nice tanks being melted down for steel..

The other article shows grocery carts on a track in an underground tunnel....I remember that at the one grocery store....It was amazing to see how busy the store was and for people to wait to have their shopping cart come up out of the tunnel...

Again a superb article on the tanks...I hope every tank lover can see that article...

Thank you for posting it...

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It drives me potty when people like ANTAR AND SINGAEGER make comments how do people know Jims tank is a preserved vehicle? when I used to show vehicles and drive them around all over the place people used to always say are you in the army. The general public have not got a clue wether its preserved or not. I used to use my ex military vehicles for all manner of things as it would help pay for the upkeep of them which in this day and age is quite expensive if your not a millionaire. As for the number plates how many military vehicles have you seen with stencilling all over them and the number plate in amongst it all Its our own personal choice if we want hidden plates to paint the vehicle what colour we want, drive it when we want and where we want. I stopped showing 8 years ago and I used to travel a long way this was due to petty politics in a certain club snide comments by other so say enthusiasts. Im sure its jealousy thats what I put it down to any way due to having somthing more interesting than they have!!!

It was lovely to see sloppy But Safe roaring around clifton thanks Jim I dont reckon cliftons seen a sherman since the war!!

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I am a bit p...ed off with some of the comments on this thread so while we wait for Antar and Clive Elliot to explain there comments about me bringing the MV movement into disrepute I would like to make a few comments of my own.

 

First of all thanks to Joe, Bob and Jason for their supporting remarks.

 

Second I am fed up of being classed as a rich and wealthy WW2 armour owner, this I am not .

 

Not that its anybody's business but I will tell you anyway, I bought the Sherman in 1999 for £4000 as a wreck, many people including some on this forum turned their noses up at it and walked away from it. In total it owes me less than some of you have paid for your everyday transport.

 

It was rebuilt on a small budget but with many hours of hard labour, not just mine but with the help of Martin Hammond, Paul my nephew and others. So please don't bleat on about not being in a financial position to own WW2 armour its getting boring.

 

I will say though the prices have soared since buying the Sherman and I certainly could not buy the same vehicle at todays prices. You all had the chance to buy the Sherman, that's your loss get over it.

 

Regarding the lack of number plates, again not that its anybody's business but mine, I have never displayed them on the vehicle in 10 years. I have done more miles than most on the roads in the UK, Belgium, Holland and the Czech republic and not once have I been asked where my plates are. Admittedly I do have some magnetic plates which are on the inside of the hull and if asked I would display them.

 

My only part in the protest last week was hiring the Sherman and myself to the organisers , as you will know the upkeep on these vehicles is expensive so when they can earn their keep it helps.

 

Actually while we were standing around in Clifton I recon about 50% of the people were more interested in the tank and its history than the parking problems. I had a lovely conversation with an elderly Dutch lady who thanked us for keeping the WW2 memories alive with our military vehicles, made my day just chatting to her about her experiences during the war.

 

Last year I had someone going on about me crushing cars at the Welland steam rally, again I was paid to do it and the crowd loved it.

 

I am sure most of the moaners are either just jealous or have nothing better to do than whine on about someone doing something they haven't the ba..s to do themselves, other just have loads of books.

 

On a more serious note when we do commemorative events, we do them with reverence and all the respect they deserve.

 

Thanks Jim.

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You are rich, not financial value of the sherman... no having the skills and know how to remake a wreck in to a living vehicle.

i hope one day i have the honor to meet you and shake your hand, see your work and learn from it.

being rich is not about having money, it is what you make of life.

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Mate, It's your vehicle and you're free to do with it what you will.

 

From what I can see, you've not broken any laws and have raised awareness to (an admittedly first-world) problem, far beyond what could have been done by a few people standing around with signs, while having a bit of fun.

 

Keep doing what you're doing and enjoy it.

 

On another note, it looks to be a very well presented vehicle.

 

Cheers,

Terry

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I bought the Sherman in 1999 for £4000 as a wreck, many people including some on this forum turned their noses up at it and walked away from it. In total it owes me less than some of you have paid for your everyday transport.

It was rebuilt on a small budget but with many hours of hard labour, not just mine but with the help of Martin Hammond, Paul my nephew and others.

 

 

Any photos of the restoration Jim?

Edited by Marmite!!
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Jim ok as you specifically asked I will respond & stick my head above the parapet! I thought the comment I made had died along with the thread that has now since gone. That thread was in fact a duplicate post that just had a news clip & I posted my first reaction to seeing it. I didn’t know there was already an established thread giving the background.

 

You will note that I have not reposted it on this thread. It was only there for a short while but has clearly caused you hurt for which I apologise.

 

Some 40 years ago I used to live in Clifton & even then the parking situation was “difficult”. Much as one might sympathise with the cause I had reservations about the use of an armoured vehicle in a public protest. As I wouldn’t want it to cause concern with anybody in authority. Admittedly much further up the protest scale there was an armoured vehicle in the Newbury Bypass & G8 protests. I don’t know at what point a line is crossed.

 

A couple of years ago it was suggested that I use my Pig in a protest about part of our neighbourhood being annexed into a National Park. But I declined the suggestion.

 

My comment was not based on jealously; I have no particular interest in any tracked vehicles. But I do have admiration for people who can restore these vehicles & bring them to life. Having said that I am a Friend of the Tank Museum but that is based on my interest in wheeled armour & guided weapons.

 

If a tank arrived on my driveway I would have no idea how to go about restoring, maintaining or even driving it. But I am glad there are people such as you who have the skill & determination to preserve such vehicles particularly if it is done with limited resources.

 

You are quite right I cannot match your “ba..s” (as you put it) in comparison I just dabble with a few vehicles that suit my particular interests & yes I do enjoy reading books.

 

So in summary your skill & work on saving, restoring & maintaining this iconic vehicle is not in question. This can be seen by the praise & acknowledgement, forthcoming on this thread. My only point is that is that I just wonder where the line (if there is to be one) might be drawn in using an armoured vehicle in a public protest.

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Regardless of how much disposable income Mr. Clark has to spend on his particular Sherman I'm always of the opinion that we're all kind of lucky that there are those people out there who do have the time, money and inclination to restore, preserve and use such costly to run, high maintenance and labour intensive machinery for enthusiasts to enjoy whether it be armour, exotic cars, aeroplanes, boats, whatever.

 

Without them all we'd have would be static, staid museum pieces and an awful lot less interesting stuff about!

 

Alan.

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Thanks Clive for your reply,your apology is accepted although to be honest I was more annoyed than hurt.

 

Yes I can understand there is a fine line when doing this sort of stuff. I did get assurance from the organiser that it would be a peaceful event without any chance of aggravation from “rent a mob” or tree hugging hippy types.

 

I would like to thank all the other folk who replied for their kind comments, most appreciated.

 

General Lee, I will try and dig out the photos and start a thread on the Sherman's restoration, but please note it is not in the same league as Adrian Barrels Sherman restoration.

 

Thanks Jim.

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I just noticed that (according to your signature at least) that it's an M4A4. Is it running the Chrysler Multibank engine? If so, I'm going to need some pictures and some YouTube videos because those things are really cool.

 

Cheers,

Terry

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