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my mk 4 churchill


eddy8men

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right then fella's here she is in all her glory, this little fixer upper has been mine since the end of june but it's still sitting in shrewsbury awaitng collection, unfortunately i can't collect it until the land i've just bought is sorted out but i'm working on it so it should be up in manchester by the end of this month which is when i can start to really get a proper look at it, most people think it's beyond economical repair but to me it looks do-able maybe i should take my rose tinted glasses off :D anyway i've already decided that i'm going to get it running so that's that.

 

all the best

 

eddy

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Hi Eddy

 

Very good I had thought originally (from the Ebay photo) it was a re-enforced hull version. The hull received the full rebuild treatment as it has 7inch air outlet and has the fixing points drilled for AVRE -hovever only a view of the roof hatch over the co-drivers seat while show whether it was converted to an AVRE as it does not have the AVRE fittings mounted. Bit more suspension units than I expected although many are probably scrap.

 

There are undoubtably some marking on the hull rear.

 

In someway less distorted than I thought -i've got a hull door pistol port in my junk pile.

 

Steve

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I guess you have got to re-manufacture it from first principles, that is how I am approaching the Loyd. Take it down to it's smallest parts and then rebuild, I'd imagine stripping back to a bare hull, getting it straight and with less holes would be my first mile stone.

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thanks steve

don't worry mate you'll get all the time you want to have a proper look when you come down here to help research all the various projects i've got on the go, might even take you out for a pint and if you bring that pistol port i'll buy you 2 pints :D.

 

all the best

 

eddy

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thanks for the support guys, it's a big project almost too big but i will get it running again come hell or high water but there's a big difference between getting something moving under it's own steam, and restoring it. my plan is to get it looking right externally and driving but what goes on under the bonnet will bear little or no resemblance to the original. why do it this way you might ask it's because the doctor recently told me that i don't have long left to live! maybe only another 40 or 50 years and i don't want to spend them working on this buggar.

 

eddy

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Eddy,

 

I say good on ya, nothings impossible, its just a case of how much time, effort and money you want to throw at it.

At least when its done you can - "I did that", and thats the bit i like best.

I look forward to seeing the fruits of your labour.

 

All the best, Richard

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Sodium filled exhaust valves too -it is alot more of a design than many writers have given it- the story of the Churchill motor was 2 x 6cylinder Bedford motors cobbled together may never go away. It's a pity they couldn't get 450 -500 BHP out of it and that would have given the Churchill a chance.

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I didn't know that, so, an 'old tech' side valve, we were forward thinking!

 

It was probably made as a side valve, due to width of the engine increasing further if it had been overhead valve. As it was, the cylinder heads could just be removed. Vauxhall and General Motors engines had been overhead valve for a good few years previous so to build the engine as a side valve, there would have been a strong reason for doing it in my opinion.

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Sodium filled exhaust valves too -it is alot more of a design than many writers have given it- the story of the Churchill motor was 2 x 6cylinder Bedford motors cobbled together may never go away. It's a pity they couldn't get 450 -500 BHP out of it and that would have given the Churchill a chance.

 

Maybe adding a supercharger would have overcome the limitations imposed by the valve arrangement and given the extra power. Supercharging was in reasonably common use, mainly on aircraft engines of the time. Squeezing extra power out of the unit would also have but extra strain on the cooling system though and if the intended use included desert areas it may have been too much.

 

As a matter of interest Eddy what engine transmission arrangement do you have in mind for this Churchill?

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Maybe adding a supercharger would have overcome the limitations imposed by the valve arrangement and given the extra power. Supercharging was in reasonably common use, mainly on aircraft engines of the time. Squeezing extra power out of the unit would also have but extra strain on the cooling system though and if the intended use included desert areas it may have been too much.

 

As a matter of interest Eddy what engine transmission arrangement do you have in mind for this Churchill?

 

Churchill was only intended to do 15 mph or so, 350 bhp was ample for that.

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hi fella's

the engine and transmission choice will get me hung on the forum and adrian might get a posse together and be the one to string me up from the nearest tree but i'm weighing up the idea of taking the hydraulics from a large tracked crawler and fitting the motors directly onto the final drive and running the controls through to the drivers compartment. it might sound daft but when you think about it, it makes sense. no gearbox or brakes or steering or anything to worry about just 2 motors and the engine, pump and reservoir. the only issue i can see is the reduction in the final drives might make it painfully slow but they'll be a way round it and i reckon i could get all the bits for under a grand. this looks to be the quickest, easiest, cheapest and most reliable way to get the old girl moving again ready for A&E 2012 :D

 

let the ranting commence

 

eddy

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I'm one for keeping it as original as possible, at least in terms of apperance, perhaps better to say audiovisual in that it must look like a 'normal' Churchill and sound like one too. So fitting a Petrol 12 cylinder engine would be a must, whether or not it is the original version of a 12 cylinder petrol engine is another matter. This isn't an ideal world. Anyway, I thought you knew a chap with a NOS Churchill engine and box....

 

If the Churchill is a back burner project to follow the Cromwells you have got years to find the correct engine. How about asking the Tank Museum and Duxford, they have been very helpfull to me. Then you have got the monuments in Europe, they don't need an engine and box, just a block of concrete the same weight:D ....don't know until you ask.

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eddy8men

let the ranting commence

 

You might have to claim political asylum after that one:D as a short term solution to get it going it has merit and as long as the final drives are not irrevocably altered I can't see any harm. it will give time to work out a better system -possibly a more conventional Churchill transmission and perhaps a modern motor, which will be very difficult to source -most of the gate guards were stripped out years ago- even then finding even a reasonable transmission may(will) require a complete long term rebuild including rehardening-reflashing the gears.

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hi fella's

with regard to the transmission it's not just a cost issue, the churchill's a real dog and no mistake and to try to restore it back to original spec would take more money and time than i'll ever have and to be honest is probably beyond my ability, i simply think it's more realistic to get it externally correct and moving under it's own steam for people to see and enjoy, rest assured that nothing will be butchered in the hull or anywhere else on it and should the day come when i part with it the new owner will be able to easily rip out my bodge and fit their own. however having said all that i might change my mind and fit something more original i was also thinking of using the correct gearbox and a rolls royce eagle engine from withams, i also have access to original recon boxes and engines but like i said earlier i don't envisage carrying out that kind of resto. we'll just have to wait and see but don't forget i'm builder from manchester not a professional military vehicle restorer all i can promise is i'll do my best.

 

eddy

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